Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!news.msfc.nasa.gov!europa.clark.net!199.60.229.5!newsfeed.direct.ca!island.idirect.com!news.uunet.ca!news.auracom.net!usenet From: NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (A.Stephen Fraser) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 10:45:13 GMT Organization: Sherwood Archery Lines: 42 Message-ID: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (remove the NOSPAM) NNTP-Posting-Host: ip14.surenet.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 *********************************** The following post was made in alt.config *********************************** Dear alt.config readers: I am frasers@surenet.net (Stephen Fraser) and the proponent of a newsgroup to be named either alt.archery.traditional or alt.sport.archery.traditional. I am submitting this proposal for your comments. This newsgroup will be dedicated to participants of traditional style archery. Charter: Traditional and Primitive Archery related subjects. A Newsgroup in which traditional archery enthusiasts can discuss their hobby and trade tips. This is an unmoderated newsgroup. Justification of Readership: While the NG alt.archery exists, there are (in short) great two completely different styles of archery. One of which (compound style) is very technically oriented and of little interest to those who prefer traditional style. There has been discussion via email from readers of alt.archery and rec.org.sca, many of whom are also interested in a non-modern archery group. A merging of enthusiasts from both groups would be beneficial to its readers. Estimate of posts stands at 20 per day initially, with - of course - expected growth. This estimate is calculated by the number of responses via email upon posting a message regarding the creation of such of alt.archery.traditional or alt.sport.archery.traditional. 20 email responses were receieved within 24 hours of the posting, and it is assumed that even a greater number would frequent the group. I submit this for your discussion and approval. Many well days, Stephen Fraser (ICQ: 9825255) ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.idt.net!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.51.24.226!news.ispn.net!not-for-mail From: "D Blesener" Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 12:38:34 -0500 Organization: Internet Services Provider Network Lines: 48 Message-ID: <6k1obq$dkv$1@news.ispn.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: "D Blesener" NNTP-Posting-Host: srt-198.dialup.ndak.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Go for it, great idea. A.Stephen Fraser wrote in message <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net>... >*********************************** >The following post was made in alt.config >*********************************** > >Dear alt.config readers: > >I am frasers@surenet.net (Stephen Fraser) and the proponent of a >newsgroup to be named either alt.archery.traditional or >alt.sport.archery.traditional. > >I am submitting this proposal for your comments. This newsgroup will >be dedicated to participants of traditional style archery. > >Charter: Traditional and Primitive Archery related subjects. A >Newsgroup in which traditional archery enthusiasts can discuss their >hobby and trade tips. This is an unmoderated newsgroup. > >Justification of Readership: While the NG alt.archery exists, there >are (in short) great two completely different styles of archery. One >of which (compound style) is very technically oriented and of little >interest to those who prefer traditional style. > >There has been discussion via email from readers of alt.archery and >rec.org.sca, many of whom are also interested in a non-modern archery >group. A merging of enthusiasts from both groups would be beneficial >to its readers. Estimate of posts stands at 20 per day initially, >with - of course - expected growth. > >This estimate is calculated by the number of responses via email upon >posting a message regarding the creation of such of >alt.archery.traditional or alt.sport.archery.traditional. > >20 email responses were receieved within 24 hours of the posting, and >it is assumed that even a greater number would frequent the group. > >I submit this for your discussion and approval. > > >Many well days, > >Stephen Fraser >(ICQ: 9825255) ###### Message-ID: <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 15:38:08 -0700 From: "Ronald W. Babcock" Reply-To: ptherapy@olympus.net Organization: Port Townsend Physical Therapy X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; U; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery To: rasers@surenet.net Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: ptpm039.olympus.net Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newsgate.cistron.nl!het.net!peer.news.zetnet.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer!btnet!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.63.63.70!nwnews.wa.com!news3.nwnexus.com!hoh.olympus.net!ptpm039.olympus.net Lines: 20 Stephen, While I can appreciate the feelings of needing another group I am very concerned what seems to be a greater need on the part of many to continue to split our sport in different factions. It is time that we realize that the gun hunter, archer, bow hunter, muzzle loader, farmer, pet owner, horse rider etc, .... will seperatley we will fall to a united and organized group of Pro-animal rights and anti-gun groups. I no longer own a firearm but yet am a member of the NRA because I believe that they have the largest lobby for pro-weapons ownership and hunting rights. If we continue to split, we will fall. Share your traditional information with compound and crossbow shooters. Maybe you'll convert a few of them. Most of all we have to stop dividing and conversely come together. Keeping it simple will assist all of us in feeling that we have something to offer and may assist in breaking down barriers. If you want another group try "alt.shootingsports", and be be part of a solution, not a participant in perptuating "anti's" agendas.. This is not a personal attack, only a commentary on the way we've done things in the past. Ron ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsfeed.mad.ibernet.es!news.mad.ibernet.es!not-for-mail From: jbarcelo@redestb.es (Josep Barcelo) Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: Traditional Archery Newsgroup Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 18:01:01 GMT Organization: T.B.Informātic Lines: 16 Message-ID: <35646b19.848662@news.redestb.es> References: <356235d2.10225174@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: jbarcelo@redestb.es NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp203.202.redestb.es X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (A.Stephen Fraser) wrote: >For some time I have considered starting a newsgroup dedicated solely >to Traditional/Primitive Archery, and thought now would be a good time >to do so. > Ok! I love traditional bows!! Add me to the list. Regards from Spain NOSPAMjbarcelo@redestb.es http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/1598/arco.htm ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!feed1.news.luth.se!luth.se!feed2.news.erols.com!erols!not-for-mail From: "bowhunter1" Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Thu, 21 May 1998 22:32:10 -0400 Organization: Erol's Internet Services Lines: 2 Message-ID: <6k2o39$9pf$1@winter.news.erols.com> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 207-172-89-159.s32.as5.smt.erols.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: winter.news.erols.com 895804329 10031 207.172.89.159 (22 May 1998 02:32:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@erols.com X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Right On Ron! ###### Path: ccw.ch!usenet From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery,rec.org.sca,alt.config Subject: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: 22 May 1998 00:47:40 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 50 Message-ID: References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (remove the NOSPAM) NNTP-Posting-Host: chonsp.franklin.lugs.ch X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 Xref: ccw.ch rec.sport.archery:423 rec.org.sca:15528 rec.org.sca added, as mentioned and potentially interested alt.config added, as thy got copy of original, prevent parallel threads As it is crossposted: I am writing from an rec.sport.archery point of view. NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (A.Stephen Fraser) proposed: > The following post was made in alt.config And independant copy crossposted to alt.archery, rec.sport.archery > I am frasers@surenet.net (Stephen Fraser) and the proponent of a > newsgroup to be named either alt.archery.traditional or > alt.sport.archery.traditional. > > I am submitting this proposal for your comments. This newsgroup will > be dedicated to participants of traditional style archery. A question: could one also consider calling this new group rec.sport.archery.traditional? This would be good because many news servers have an extremely spotty coverage of alt.* groups (mine for example does not cary alt.archery and has one single alt.sport.* group). > Justification of Readership: While the NG alt.archery exists, there > are (in short) great two completely different styles of archery. One > of which (compound style) is very technically oriented and of little > interest to those who prefer traditional style. Absolutely in agreement. > There has been discussion via email from readers of alt.archery and > rec.org.sca, many of whom are also interested in a non-modern archery > group. For non-archers: Non-modern, that is, when technique is more important than technology. Where self development is more important than buying yet more mod cons. > I submit this for your discussion and approval. I wish you well with you submission. Could be an interesting group. -- private: Neil.Franklin@ccw.ch.remove http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/ office: franklin@arch.ethz.ch.remove http://caad.arch.ethz.ch/~franklin/ WinCE car, crashing soon on a road near you ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-penn.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.217.77.43!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!nntp.earthlink.net!not-for-mail From: Martin Kruse Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 00:48:03 -0700 Organization: EarthLink Network, Inc. Lines: 35 Message-ID: <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> Reply-To: mkruse@earthlink.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust54.max4.los-angeles.ca.ms.uu.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) Ronald W. Babcock wrote: > > Stephen, > > While I can appreciate the feelings of needing another group I am very > concerned what seems to be a greater need on the part of many to > continue to split our sport in different factions. It is time that we > realize that the gun hunter, archer, bow hunter, muzzle loader, farmer, > pet owner, horse rider etc, .... will seperatley we will fall to a > united and organized group of Pro-animal rights and anti-gun groups. I > no longer own a firearm but yet am a member of the NRA because I believe > that they have the largest lobby for pro-weapons ownership and hunting > rights. If we continue to split, we will fall. Share your traditional > information with compound and crossbow shooters. Maybe you'll convert a > few of them. Most of all we have to stop dividing and conversely come > together. Keeping it simple will assist all of us in feeling that we > have something to offer and may assist in breaking down barriers. If > you want another group try "alt.shootingsports", and be be part of a > solution, not a participant in perptuating "anti's" agendas.. > > This is not a personal attack, only a commentary on the way we've done > things in the past. Ron I agree that we have to present a united front especially to our ennimes that's not what is at question here. the thing is that when we swap info among our selves (talk shop) it's more intresting with like intrests. so lets go for it. If there is a danger of us "isolated trads" missing any info on what the antis are up to so we may present a united front it is hoped that you'll drop in and spread the word. but when it comes down to discussing gear some of us are real bored with hearing about peep sights cams and rangfinders. no flame or deviseveness intended you're welcome to take off the training wheels and shoot with the big boys :-) Martin Kruse ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!btnet-peer!btnet!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.172.150.11!news1.bellglobal.com!sapphire.mtt.net!garnet.nbnet.nb.ca!news.unb.ca!m0564.MTA.CA!akarpowicz From: akarpowicz@mta.ca (Adam Karpowicz) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:49:24 Organization: Mount Allison University Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 138.73.23.164 X-Newsreader: Trumpet for Windows [Version 1.0 Rev A] In article <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> Martin Kruse writes: >I agree that we have to present a united front especially to our ennimes >that's not what is at question here. the thing is that when we swap info >among our selves (talk shop) it's more intresting with like intrests. >so lets go for it. If there is a danger of us "isolated trads" missing >any info on what the antis are up to so we may present a united front it >is hoped that you'll drop in and spread the word. but when it comes down >to discussing gear some of us are real bored with hearing about peep >sights cams and rangfinders. no flame or deviseveness intended you're >welcome to take off the training wheels and shoot with the big boys :-) >Martin Kruse I believe it is a good idea to have a strictly traditional group. As Martin says it is the boredom factor and, I think, some traditional archers may feel intimidated by all the over 300fps arrow velocities and what not. This could explain the scarcity of postings on real bows too 8-). What we may loose, though, is some good posts on archery physics, still aplicable to traditional archery. Adam Karpowicz ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!europa.clark.net!208.134.241.18!newsfeed.internetmci.com!207.217.77.43!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!nntp.earthlink.net!not-for-mail From: Martin Kruse Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 08:47:36 -0700 Organization: EarthLink Network, Inc. Lines: 25 Message-ID: <35659E18.2CD4@earthlink.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> Reply-To: mkruse@earthlink.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust47.max62.los-angeles.ca.ms.uu.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) > I believe it is a good idea to have a strictly traditional group. As Martin > says it is the boredom factor and, I think, some traditional archers may feel > intimidated by all the over 300fps arrow velocities and what not. This could > explain the scarcity of postings on real bows too 8-). What we may loose, > though, is some good posts on archery physics, still aplicable to traditional > archery. > > Adam Karpowicz I think you're right and I'll continue to scan both -or all three groups for intresting threads but I'd READ a trad group. as for itimadition factor no way I get more game than most of the compound shooters I know and when I was shooting with a club with a 3d range I used to beat aboput half of them at that. the only things that I have against compounds is that they are awkward, boring,and no fun to shoot. I regularly shoot with guys with both coumpounds and fita recurves and within the range limitations of my equipment I keep up just fine. and in fact I'm going to be going to the PSE dealer school in Aug. to learnto work on wheelie bows so that I can be more help to some of the students I have who shoot them. but I do miss the old days bc (before coumpounds) when I belonged to a bare bow club and we were all talking about the same sport :-) Masrtin Kruse ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newsgate.cistron.nl!het.net!Cabal.CESspool!bofh.vszbr.cz!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsgate.duke.edu!stking From: stking@acpub.duke.edu (Steve King) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Followup-To: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Date: 22 May 1998 15:41:27 GMT Organization: Duke University, Durham, NC, USA Lines: 52 Message-ID: <6k46b7$n0b$1@news.duke.edu> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: bio2.acpub.duke.edu X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Ronald W. Babcock (ptherapy@olympus.net) wrote: : ..............................................It is time that we : realize that the gun hunter, archer, bow hunter, muzzle loader, farmer, : pet owner, horse rider etc, .... will seperatley we will fall to a : united and organized group of Pro-animal rights and anti-gun groups. Oh bullshit. "rec.equestrian" and "rec.guns" have about ZERO in common, except for threads about broken legs, I imagine.... Seriously. Threats to bow-hunting (APPROPRIATE for this group) are myriad, and include things like strip-mall development, enviromental pollutants, for-profit land-leases, diminished leisure-time, etc., etc., with PETA and "anti-gun" groups about last on the list. When was the last time some ARA freak stopped you from hunting? When was the last time too many hunters, crowded into too small a tract of public land, ruined your hunt? : I no longer own a firearm.... Court order? :) : If we continue to split, we will fall. Share your traditional : information with compound and crossbow shooters. Maybe you'll convert a : few of them. Most of all we have to stop dividing and conversely come : together. Keeping it simple will assist all of us in feeling that we : have something to offer and may assist in breaking down barriers. Why don't you propose usenet be divided into "us" and "them?" That simple enough for you? There are good reasons and bad reasons for creating a traditional archery group, and mostly -- in *my* opinion -- no compelling reasons, as neither 'rec.sport' nor 'alt' archery are particularly high-traffic, and, as you suggest, there's nothing wrong with sharing "traditional information." But it requires a significant leap of faith to agree with your conclusion that pet-owners, and farmers, and horseback riders, and target archers, and blackpowder hunters, etc., are going to be "damaged" by the creation of "alt.archery.traditional." Take care! Steve ###### Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news.linkline.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newshub.northeast.verio.net!news-feed1.tiac.net!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-feed2.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!inmet!news From: Carl West Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional X-Nntp-Posting-Host: trix.camb.inmet.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <3565A22C.810361FC@inmet.com> Sender: news@inmet.camb.inmet.com (USENET news) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: Intermetrics References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 16:05:00 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; U) Lines: 18 Martin Kruse wrote: > ...but when it comes down > to discussing gear some of us are real bored with hearing about peep > sights cams and rangfinders. Bingo! It's not that I'm going to un-sub from r.s.a, but I'll probably visit less often. When I've got something that warrants it, I'll cross-post. -- Carl West http://www.inmet.com/~eisen To gain face, give it To lose face, try to save it Or take it away. ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-penn.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-backup-east.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!206.172.150.11!news1.bellglobal.com!news.uunet.ca!news.auracom.net!usenet From: NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (A.Stephen Fraser) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Fri, 22 May 1998 20:20:45 GMT Organization: Sherwood Archery Lines: 76 Message-ID: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> Reply-To: NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (remove the NOSPAM) NNTP-Posting-Host: 165.154.111.21 X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 On Fri, 22 May 1998 00:48:03 -0700, Martin Kruse wrote: >Ronald W. Babcock wrote: >> >> Stephen, >> >> While I can appreciate the feelings of needing another group I am very >> concerned what seems to be a greater need on the part of many to >> continue to split our sport in different factions. It is time that we >> you want another group try "alt.shootingsports", and be be part of a >> solution, not a participant in perptuating "anti's" agendas.. >> >> This is not a personal attack, only a commentary on the way we've done >> things in the past. Ron > >I agree that we have to present a united front especially to our ennimes >that's not what is at question here. the thing is that when we swap info >among our selves (talk shop) it's more intresting with like intrests. >so lets go for it. If there is a danger of us "isolated trads" missing >any info on what the antis are up to so we may present a united front it >is hoped that you'll drop in and spread the word. but when it comes down >to discussing gear some of us are real bored with hearing about peep >sights cams and rangfinders. no flame or deviseveness intended you're >welcome to take off the training wheels and shoot with the big boys :-) > >Martin Kruse > Martin has a good point here. Any information about antis, or opportunities to support the sport of hunting should be crossposted to not only alt.archery, rec.sport.archery, alt.archery.traditional but also any gun related newsgroups. Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I leave the five percent to those who have not experienced it) but our styles and equipment are very different. For example, for two months, a thread has been going in this NG regarding kinetic energy charts, which may seem great fun for some folks, but is virtually a waste of download time for most traditionalists. We're not concerned about Kinetic energy dynamics - that's for scientists. We're not interested in replacing cams and metal strings ... that's for compounders. What we wish to share is our love for _our_ style of shooting and hunting, which in no way divides archers further. If one NG makes the difference between whether hunting supporters will stand united or fall divided, then I say we're a pretty weak group. But we're not. We're all proud of what we do and what we accomplish. But to be honest, some trads find that a harvest with a compound is just not the same as what we call an "instinctive" harvest. Indeed, a newsgroup about bowmaking, fletching, arrowsmithing, etc. may not be a bad idea. (alt.archery.bowyery) In no way does it divide archers or even trads further ... it's a nice, neat way of dividing up discussions so that one can pick and choose what they wish to see. If we started a group called alt.archery.compounds.suck, I could see a LOT of negative comments. But that is not the intention, nor even the feeling of most trads. I honestly hope that alt.archery.traditional comes to fruition. And if it does, and if someone in ANY group has info to share that is pertinent to hunting in general, it should be cross-posted. What some call "splintering" may, in fact, appear to present a larger united front. There are two ways of looking at the issue. Many well days, Stephen Fraser, medieval style bowyer/fletcher Email: frasers@surenet.net ICQ: 9825255 ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!woodstock.news.demon.net!demon!europa.clark.net!208.134.241.18!newsfeed.internetmci.com!167.142.225.6!newsrelay.netins.net!news.netins.net!not-for-mail From: "Scott Hamlin" Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: 23 May 1998 00:13:01 GMT Organization: netINS, Inc. Message-ID: <01bd85df$0e8154c0$3b148ea7@swhamlin.netins.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: desm-19-059.dialup.netins.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1162 Lines: 13 30 years from now Traditional may refer to a bow with wheels, I think there are enough newgroups already. I shoot a longbow, but I enjoy the variety of information and opinions in this NG. If a subject does not interest me I just mark it read and move on. I think sometimes it is easy to develope tunnel vision by breaking down into our own little groups within the same general idea. I say lets stick together. -- ========================================================= "Choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve. As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." (Joshua 24:15) ========================================================= ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!news-out.internetmci.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!205.138.110.202!news.digisys.net!not-for-mail From: sorefeet Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Sat, 23 May 1998 09:44:34 -0600 Organization: NRA Lines: 45 Message-ID: <3566EEE2.61EDA6E5@digisys.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3564ACB7.148F@olympus.net> <01bd85df$0e8154c0$3b148ea7@swhamlin.netins.net> Reply-To: sorefeet@digisys.net NNTP-Posting-Host: modem21.digisys.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Howdy, Scott here makes some very good points. Splitting this NG is silly, it's not like there 450 post a day like rec.guns or something. There are people like me who shoot both "wheelie" bows and "stick & string" bows that dont want to go to another NG to read about either one. Oh, and I also dig your sig file too, Scott. Scott Hamlin wrote: > > 30 years from now Traditional may refer to a bow with wheels, I think > there are enough newgroups already. I shoot a longbow, but I enjoy the > variety of information and opinions in this NG. If a subject does not > interest me I just mark it read and move on. I think sometimes it is easy > to develope tunnel vision by breaking down into our own little groups > within the same general idea. I say lets stick together. > -- > ========================================================= > "Choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve. > As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." (Joshua 24:15) > ========================================================= -- TK Rice sorefeet@digisys.net "To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them." George Mason, Patriot Visit the SONS OF FREEDOM website at http://www.digisys.net/users/sorefeet Without prejudice per UCC 1-207 ###### Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery From: dannykaye@cix.compulink.co.uk ("Danny Kaye") Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Message-ID: Organization: Compulink Information eXchange References: <35652DB3.406C@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 10:00:51 GMT Lines: 18 Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!news.freedom2surf.net!peer.news.nildram.co.uk!peernews.cix.co.uk!cix.compulink.co.uk!usenet > to discussing gear some of us are real bored with hearing about peep > sights cams and rangfinders. no flame or deviseveness intended you're > welcome to take off the training wheels and shoot with the big boys :-) Hear Hear :) each to their own, I am fed up of downloading so many I killed a deer or my new bow is faster than yours posts :) danny email dk@maths.ntu.ac.uk www http://euler.ntu.ac.uk/dk/dk.html ###### Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery From: dannykaye@cix.compulink.co.uk ("Danny Kaye") Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Message-ID: Organization: Compulink Information eXchange References: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 10:00:53 GMT Lines: 11 Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!news.freedom2surf.net!peer.news.nildram.co.uk!peernews.cix.co.uk!cix.compulink.co.uk!usenet > Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I leave the five > percent to those who have not experienced it) but our 95% of USA archers maybe... danny email dk@maths.ntu.ac.uk www http://euler.ntu.ac.uk/dk/dk.html ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!netnews.com!feed2.news.erols.com!erols!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!nntp.earthlink.net!not-for-mail From: Martin Kruse Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 09:09:30 -0700 Organization: EarthLink Network, Inc. Lines: 23 Message-ID: <3568463A.5EB7@earthlink.net> References: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: mkruse@earthlink.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust43.max3.los-angeles.ca.ms.uu.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) Danny Kaye wrote: > > > Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I > leave the five > > percent to those who have not experienced it) but our > > 95% of USA archers maybe... > > danny > > email dk@maths.ntu.ac.uk > www http://euler.ntu.ac.uk/dk/dk.html Not our fault you live in a socialist country where the people have allowed the goverment to deprive you of your basic human rights. and I really don't understand why you think it's something to gloat about. Save the flames. I wont bother argueing with non hunters. -or anything else that is below me on the food chain :-) Martin Kruse ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!europa.clark.net!205.252.116.205!howland.erols.net!news-feed.ifi.uio.no!sol.no!not-for-mail From: Archery on the Internet Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 10:46:56 +0200 Organization: SOL Internett Lines: 60 Message-ID: <3567DE80.E1124C0B@online.no> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: ti18a96-0135.dialup.online.no Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) To: remove the NOSPAM Another newsgroup is probably not a bad idea. In fact one newsgroup per style (longbow (traditional), recurve (olympic), compound) probably wouldn't be a bad idea. However, and this is my reason for replying, I'd suggest new groups are created in the rec.sport hierarchy and not in the alt hierarchy. Regarding the talk (later in this thread) about warnings about PETA activities etc., why don't someone create a special newsgroup for that? That newsgroup would be interesting for bowhunters as well as gunners. Having these PETA messages cross-posted across multiple newgroups makes little sense. A.Stephen Fraser wrote: > > *********************************** > The following post was made in alt.config > *********************************** > > Dear alt.config readers: > > I am frasers@surenet.net (Stephen Fraser) and the proponent of a > newsgroup to be named either alt.archery.traditional or > alt.sport.archery.traditional. > > I am submitting this proposal for your comments. This newsgroup will > be dedicated to participants of traditional style archery. > > Charter: Traditional and Primitive Archery related subjects. A > Newsgroup in which traditional archery enthusiasts can discuss their > hobby and trade tips. This is an unmoderated newsgroup. > > Justification of Readership: While the NG alt.archery exists, there > are (in short) great two completely different styles of archery. One > of which (compound style) is very technically oriented and of little > interest to those who prefer traditional style. > > There has been discussion via email from readers of alt.archery and > rec.org.sca, many of whom are also interested in a non-modern archery > group. A merging of enthusiasts from both groups would be beneficial > to its readers. Estimate of posts stands at 20 per day initially, > with - of course - expected growth. > > This estimate is calculated by the number of responses via email upon > posting a message regarding the creation of such of > alt.archery.traditional or alt.sport.archery.traditional. > > 20 email responses were receieved within 24 hours of the posting, and > it is assumed that even a greater number would frequent the group. > > I submit this for your discussion and approval. > > Many well days, > > Stephen Fraser > (ICQ: 9825255) -- Kjetil Kilhavn says, visit Archery on the Internet http://home.sol.no/~kkilhavn/arc_www/arc_www.htm ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!ubnnews.unisource.ch!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newsfeed.mad.ibernet.es!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsfeed.nacamar.de!news.space.net!roka.net!krischik!not-for-mail From: "Martin Krischik" Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Sun, 24 May 98 18:41:50 -0100 Organization: never Organised Lines: 21 Distribution: World Message-ID: References: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: "Martin Krischik" NNTP-Posting-Host: samson.cymes.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ts-mail.roka.net 896028259 14041 (None) 62.104.43.11 X-Complaints-To: usenet@roka.net X-Newsreader: PMINews 1.02 Beta 1 For OS/2 Cache-Post-Path: samson.cymes-bs.de!unknown@p15.braunschweig.dacotec.net X-Cache: nntpcache 2.3.2 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) On Sun, 24 May 1998 10:00:53 GMT, Danny Kaye wrote: :> :>> Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I :>leave the five :>> percent to those who have not experienced it) but our :> :>95% of USA archers maybe... Quite right. But most US Citizens don't know that there is a World outside the USA. Regards Martin. -- Martin Krischik MailTo://krischik@cymes-bs.de http://www.cymes-bs.de/~krischik Member of TeamOS/2. Request PGP Key by sending an E-Mail with "PGP" as subject. ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.wli.net!news-peer-west.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!nntp.earthlink.net!not-for-mail From: Martin Kruse Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Sun, 24 May 1998 10:59:00 -0700 Organization: EarthLink Network, Inc. Lines: 21 Message-ID: <35685FE4.333A@earthlink.net> References: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> Reply-To: mkruse@earthlink.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust7.max3.los-angeles.ca.ms.uu.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; I) Martin Krischik wrote: > > On Sun, 24 May 1998 10:00:53 GMT, Danny Kaye wrote: > > :> > :>> Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I > :>leave the five > :>> percent to those who have not experienced it) but our > :> > :>95% of USA archers maybe... > > Quite right. But most US Citizens don't know that there is a World outside the USA. > > Regards Martin. > -- Shure we do all those forigeners causing traffic jams have to come from somewhere. :-) Martin Kruse ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.idt.net!news-peer-east.sprintlink.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-backup-west.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!206.191.192.2!Spacestar!not-for-mail From: rcain.nospam@spacestar.net (Rod Cain) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 02:31:58 GMT Organization: Spacestar Communications, Twin Cities, MN Lines: 49 Message-ID: <3569cbea.2214270@news.spacestar.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: ts2-11.amery.spacestar.net X-Trace: news3.spacestar.net 896142780 29488 (None) 206.191.199.227 X-Complaints-To: usenet@spacestar.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230 Stephen, It seems youv'e rocked the boat a little. I spose this is a usual eventuality as a result of creating new NG's. I think it's a fine idea. We can certainly subscribe to as many NG's as we have time for and I might consider subscribing to this one and the new one both. Although I haven't regressed to traditional it has it's romantic draw and I went as far as acquiring a 45# recurve that I plan on getting familiar with. I have no imediate interest in losing any "clean kill capability" in the name of tradition but will make the conversion someday if and when I get good enough to shoot a traditional bow accurately enough. I'd like to look at additional news groups kinda like stocks splitting. Once they split they continue to grow there-by making the whole hunting/shooting community larger and more able to stick up for our collective interests. Some like Ron eluded to the "cultural war" with his difference of opinion and Steve seemed to ignore that it even exists. Anyway, good luck with the new NG. Rod On Thu, 21 May 1998 10:45:13 GMT, NOSPAMfrasers@surenet.net (A.Stephen Fraser) wrote: (snip) >I am frasers@surenet.net (Stephen Fraser) and the proponent of a >newsgroup to be named either alt.archery.traditional or >alt.sport.archery.traditional. > >I am submitting this proposal for your comments. This newsgroup will >be dedicated to participants of traditional style archery. > (snip) > Estimate of posts stands at 20 per day initially, >with - of course - expected growth. > (snip) >I submit this for your discussion and approval. > > >Many well days, > >Stephen Fraser >(ICQ: 9825255) ----------------------------------------------------- ************* The truth is out there! *************** ###### Remove .nospam from address to email ######### ----------------------------------------------------- ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-penn.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!130.185.14.35!torn!nott!bcarh189.bnr.ca!bcarh8ac.bnr.ca!bmdhh222.bnr.ca!news From: Rob Smith Newsgroups: rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:14:34 +0100 Organization: Bell Northern Research Lines: 35 Message-ID: <356AC039.1FABB204@nortel.com> References: <3565dab9.57984229@news.surenet.net> <3568463A.5EB7@earthlink.net> Reply-To: NOSPAMsmithrob@nortel.com NNTP-Posting-Host: nwcwi486.europe.nortel.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Martin Kruse wrote: > Danny Kaye wrote: > > > > > Hunting is a passion that 95% of archers share, (and I > > leave the five > > > percent to those who have not experienced it) but our > > > > 95% of USA archers maybe... > > > > danny > > > > email dk@maths.ntu.ac.uk > > www http://euler.ntu.ac.uk/dk/dk.html > > Not our fault you live in a socialist country where the people have > allowed the goverment to deprive you of your basic human rights. and I > > really don't understand why you think it's something to gloat about. > I don't think we need unsolicited political comments in an archery newsgroup. Maybe instead of splitting off traditional archery we should split off a different group for these hunting guys as there seems far more in common between archers whether compound/recurve/traditional than there ever is between hunters & non hunters. > Save the flames. I wont bother argueing with non hunters. -or anything > > else that is below me on the food chain :-) > > Martin Kruse ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!204.71.106.34!avalon.net!not-for-mail From: rods@bigfoot.com (Rod Strabala) Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 05:28:31 GMT Organization: Avalon Networks Inc. Lines: 26 Message-ID: <356b9fa6.2353555@news.avalon.net> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3569cbea.2214270@news.spacestar.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: dial10.icwest.avalon.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 On Tue, 26 May 1998 02:31:58 GMT, rcain.nospam@spacestar.net (Rod Cain) wrote: >Although I haven't regressed to traditional it has it's romantic draw and I went >as far as acquiring a 45# recurve that I plan on getting familiar with. I have >no imediate interest in losing any "clean kill capability" in the name of >tradition but will make the conversion someday if and when I get good enough to From one Rod to another: You just HAD to know this remark was going to draw a response or two from those of us who only hunt without wheels - I wasn't aware the deer in my freezer were killed any less "cleanly" by my 56# Jeffery recurve than if I had been shooting the lastest super-dooper hatchet-cammed, 35" 300 fps capable, 86% let-off, laser-sighted megadeath compound-from-hell machine. BTW, this is just a friendly ribbing, my point is that those of us shooting longbows and recurves are well aware of our "clean-kill" range limitations, that's part of the reason we CHOOSE to stay with traditional gear, and don't consider it a "regression". BTW, take this is the nature it was intended, I have no desire to start a traditional vs. compound war, I don't care what people shoot as long as they are having fun doing it. Rod ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp2.dejanews.com!nnrp1.dejanews.com!not-for-mail From: elizanewt@webtv.net Newsgroups: alt.archery,rec.sport.archery Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] alt.archery.traditional Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 05:25:06 GMT Organization: Deja News - The Leader in Internet Discussion Lines: 37 Message-ID: <6klgri$p1n$1@nnrp1.dejanews.com> References: <3564052b.2124001@news.surenet.net> <3569cbea.2214270@news.spacestar.net> <356b9fa6.2353555@news.avalon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.79.35.187 X-Article-Creation-Date: Fri May 29 05:25:06 1998 GMT X-Http-User-Agent: Mozilla/3.0 WebTV/1.2 (compatible; MSIE 2.0) In article <356b9fa6.2353555@news.avalon.net>, rods@bigfoot.com (Rod Strabala) wrote: > > On Tue, 26 May 1998 02:31:58 GMT, rcain.nospam@spacestar.net (Rod > Cain) wrote: > > >Although I haven't regressed to traditional it has it's romantic draw and I went > >as far as acquiring a 45# recurve that I plan on getting familiar with. I have > >no imediate interest in losing any "clean kill capability" in the name of > >tradition but will make the conversion someday if and when I get good enough to > > From one Rod to another: > > You just HAD to know this remark was going to draw a response or two > from those of us who only hunt without wheels - I wasn't aware the > deer in my freezer were killed any less "cleanly" by my 56# Jeffery > recurve than if I had been shooting the lastest super-dooper > hatchet-cammed, 35" 300 fps capable, 86% let-off, laser-sighted > megadeath compound-from-hell machine. BTW, this is just a friendly > ribbing, my point is that those of us shooting longbows and recurves > are well aware of our "clean-kill" range limitations, that's part of > the reason we CHOOSE to stay with traditional gear, and don't consider > it a "regression". BTW, take this is the nature it was intended, I > have no > desire to start a traditional vs. compound war, I don't care what > people shoot as long as they are having fun doing it. > > Rod > Well said, Rod. After all its just as plausible to gut shoot a deer with a gun as it is to lung shoot one with a bow, any bow. Clean kill is the result of hunter ethics not equipment. Rich M Longbow Archer Traditional Bowhunter -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==----- http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading