Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!not-for-mail From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.misc Subject: Dwarfs vs Dwarves and Tolkien (was Re: Know what I miss about D&D?) Date: 28 Jun 2000 23:24:50 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 63 Message-ID: <6uaeg5ebx9.fsf_-_@chonsp.franklin.ch> References: <8j3jol$djr$1@madmax.keyway.net> <01bfde46$70e38860$536a02d0@john---sandra> <8j3os0$e0r$1@madmax.keyway.net> <01bfde56$c3d91200$a86a02d0@john---sandra> <3955AFBB.6BE7E91@my-deja.what-do-you-think.com> <8j5gsr$qtn$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <3956bcba.6791145@news.paradise.net.nz> <8jau7q$pg1$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <8jdctj$k5e$1@nnrp1.deja.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: chonsp.franklin.ch X-Trace: chonsp.franklin.ch 962227491 623 10.0.3.2 (28 Jun 2000 21:24:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@chonsp.franklin.ch NNTP-Posting-Date: 28 Jun 2000 21:24:51 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.4 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.games.frp.misc:11166 Arthur Boff writes: > ichabod@dmtcorp.com (Ichabod) wrote: > wrote: > > > > > rboleyn@paradise.net.nz (Rupert Boleyn) wrote: > > > > On Sun, 25 Jun 2000 17:52:31 GMT, Arthur Boff > > > > wrote: > > > > > Deykin ap Gwion wrote: > > > > >> "S. John Ross" wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> > And the bit about whether Dwarvish [shouts of "DWARFISH!" > > > > >> > from the rafters] > > > > >> > > > > >> It's dwarvEN, dammit! *dodge, tumble, escape!* > > > > > > > > criminally > > > > >neglected "Dwarvoid" and "Dwarvic". > > > > > > > > No it's Dwarfen (or Dwarfoid, or Dwarfic). > > > It's spelt with a v, not an f! Respect Tolkein's authoritah! Tolkien says that it correctly is f. > > Didn't Tolkien write that spelling it with a v was wrong, > > and he should have done it with an f? Yes (spelling with v is wrong), no (he didn't say he should have used f). > Ah, but didn't he do that to differentiate his dwarves with people with > the medical condition of dwarfism? Nope. That "explanation" is just retroactive PC crap. From Lord of the Rings, Appendix F, II On Translation: ------ It may be observed that in this book as in The Hobbit the form dwarves is used, although the dictionaries tell us that the plural of dwarf is dwarfs. ... But we no longer speak of a dwarf ... for a race now abandoned to folk tales ... or at least to nonsense-stories in which they have become mere figures of fun. But in the Third Age something of their old character and power is still glimpsed, ... It is to mark this that I have ventured to use the form dwarves, and so to remove them a little , perhaps, from the sillier tales of these latter days. ------ But the best part of that text is this bit: ------ It should be dwarrows (or dwerrows), if singular and plural had each gone its own way down the years, as have man and men, or goose and geese. ------ So I hope that one settles the quarrel for ever :-). -- Neil Franklin, neil@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ Nerd, Geek, Hacker, Unix Guru, Sysadmin, Roleplayer, LARPer, Mystic