From: "Christopher Kreuzer" Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Lines: 28 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 14:48:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.43.125.102 X-Complaints-To: abuse@blueyonder.co.uk X-Trace: text.news.blueyonder.co.uk 1108910899 82.43.125.102 (Sun, 20 Feb 2005 14:48:19 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 14:48:19 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!in2p3.fr!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.117.148.138.MISMATCH!pe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!pe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!text.news.blueyonder.co.uk!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169403 Volume One of the scholarly journal /Tolkien Studies/ is available online. The paper publisher is WVU Press: http://www.wvupress.com/journals/details.php?id=3 The journal now has electronic subscriptions through the John Hopkins University Press Project Muse: http://muse.jhu.edu (very impressive website) This is the Tolkien Studies page: http://muse.jhu.edu/journals/tolkien_studies/ Here is the free sample of Volume One: http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/ NB. The PDF link for the Tom Shippey checklist is broken. Click on the HTML link for the Tom Shippey checklist and use the PDF link on that page. Christopher -- --- Reply clue: Saruman welcomes you to Spamgard ###### From: Dirk Thierbach Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:50:01 +0100 Lines: 14 Message-ID: <20050221165001.3527.0.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> References: Reply-To: Dirk Thierbach X-Trace: individual.net YVvZkisDyAaqJDrwkpB7JQnbM+YQJjOeiF69aOEDrEwbgNZPaJu0EF8g== X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.5-20040615 ("Gighay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.26 (i686)) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.bme.hu!newsfeed.iif.hu!NIIF!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169465 Christopher Kreuzer wrote: > Here is the free sample of Volume One: > > http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/ Thanks for the link. BTW, the article by Verlyn Flieger, http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/v001/1.1flieger.html contains an interesting discussion how Tolkiens idea of a "mythology for England" may have changed through time. - Dirk ###### From: "Christopher Kreuzer" Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien References: <20050221165001.3527.0.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> Subject: Re: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Lines: 27 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 23:14:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.43.125.23 X-Complaints-To: abuse@blueyonder.co.uk X-Trace: text.news.blueyonder.co.uk 1109286859 82.43.125.23 (Thu, 24 Feb 2005 23:14:19 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 23:14:19 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!news2.euro.net!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!pe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!pe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!text.news.blueyonder.co.uk!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169620 Dirk Thierbach wrote: > Christopher Kreuzer wrote: > >> Here is the free sample of Volume One: >> >> http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/ > > Thanks for the link. BTW, the article by Verlyn Flieger, > > http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/v001/1.1flieger.html > > contains an interesting discussion how Tolkiens idea of a "mythology > for England" may have changed through time. Yes. What did you think of it? The article by Drout is also interesting in parts. Denethor and King Lear. Other bits as well... When I first read the journal about a year ago (preview copy) I wrote a lot about it, but never typed it up. Must dig out the old notes... Christopher -- --- Reply clue: Saruman welcomes you to Spamgard ###### From: "Count Menelvagor" Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Date: 25 Feb 2005 17:48:48 -0800 Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 2 Message-ID: <1109382528.580494.322240@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: 136.242.228.158 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: posting.google.com 1109382532 13937 127.0.0.1 (26 Feb 2005 01:48:52 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 01:48:52 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: User-Agent: G2/0.2 Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com; posting-host=136.242.228.158; posting-account=uvDL7QwAAACz2MWOxUwJ6HLWiGRonps7 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!proxad.net!216.239.36.134.MISMATCH!postnews.google.com!f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169688 thanks for posting this. interesting article about álfar. ###### From: Dirk Thierbach Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:17:10 +0100 Lines: 27 Message-ID: <20050228101710.A00.2.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> References: <20050221165001.3527.0.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> Reply-To: Dirk Thierbach X-Trace: individual.net EN6g03dlZ9KIbtGMqLYTygCMnGlJqb2IrCJjAdlOlZ/rlbSNbyXKfaOw== X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.5-20040615 ("Gighay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.26 (i686)) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169766 Christopher Kreuzer wrote: > Dirk Thierbach wrote: >> Thanks for the link. BTW, the article by Verlyn Flieger, >> >> http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/v001/1.1flieger.html >> >> contains an interesting discussion how Tolkiens idea of a "mythology >> for England" may have changed through time. > Yes. What did you think of it? I agree with most she (?) says. > The article by Drout is also interesting in parts. Denethor and > King Lear. Other bits as well... I found this article less interesting. Most of the comparisons seem a bit forced to me. IMHO, if they are similarities, then because both Tolkien and Shakespeare used similar "ingredients" for their personal "cauldron of stories", which came out quite differently after the cooking. Tolkien may be inspired by passages in King Lear, as he was by the "Great Birnam wood to high Dunsinane hill" of Macbeth, but I'd say simplifies things too much to try and make similar one-to-one comparisons to King Lear. - Dirk ###### From: "Christopher Kreuzer" Newsgroups: alt.fan.tolkien,rec.arts.books.tolkien References: <20050221165001.3527.0.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> <20050228101710.A00.2.NOFFLE@dthierbach.news.arcor.de> Subject: Re: Tolkien Studies (volume 1) online Lines: 41 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Message-ID: <5cJUd.25442$8B3.5882@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:14:25 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.43.125.23 X-Complaints-To: abuse@blueyonder.co.uk X-Trace: text.news.blueyonder.co.uk 1109614465 82.43.125.23 (Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:14:25 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 18:14:25 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!news1.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.117.148.138.MISMATCH!pe2.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!pe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk!blueyonder!text.news.blueyonder.co.uk!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:169772 Dirk Thierbach wrote: > Christopher Kreuzer wrote: >> Dirk Thierbach wrote: > >>> Thanks for the link. BTW, the article by Verlyn Flieger, >>> >>> http://muse.jhu.edu/demo/tolkien_studies/v001/1.1flieger.html >>> >>> contains an interesting discussion how Tolkiens idea of a "mythology >>> for England" may have changed through time. > >> Yes. What did you think of it? > > I agree with most she (?) says. Yes, she. I sort of followed the argument, but haven't read enough of HoME to be sure about that. >> The article by Drout is also interesting in parts. Denethor and >> King Lear. Other bits as well... > > I found this article less interesting. Most of the comparisons seem a > bit forced to me. IMHO, if they are similarities, then because both > Tolkien and Shakespeare used similar "ingredients" for their personal > "cauldron of stories", which came out quite differently after the > cooking. Tolkien may be inspired by passages in King Lear, as he was > by the "Great Birnam wood to high Dunsinane hill" of Macbeth, but > I'd say simplifies things too much to try and make similar one-to-one > comparisons to King Lear. Fair enough. I found the parsing of the sentences of the WK and Eowyn a bit more perplexing and overdone. I always thought such things were automatic stylistic hallmarks of individual authors, rather than anything that needed that level of analysis. But still interesting. Christopher -- --- Reply clue: Saruman welcomes you to Spamgard