From: "David Flood" Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 20:45:26 -0000 Organization: Customer of Energis Squared Lines: 38 Message-ID: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: modem-33.nuada.dialup.pol.co.uk X-Trace: newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk 983738947 29846 62.137.249.33 (4 Mar 2001 20:49:07 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: 4 Mar 2001 20:49:07 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@theplanet.net X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-nue1.dfn.de!uni-erlangen.de!newsfeed.germany.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!diablo.theplanet.net!news.theplanet.net!newspost.theplanet.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33305 This one has bothered me for the last ten years, every time I re-read "The Fellowship of the Ring" - Just *why* was Strider/Aragorn, who told the Hobbits incessantly about the dangers of the lands between the Shire and Rivendell, wearing a useless sword while travelling in those same lands? ("and they saw that the blade was indeed broken a foot below the hilt", 'Strider' pp188, tFotR). A few points on this; not only were the broken shards of Narsil of no use against the Nazgul or anyone else (i.e. the 'flame' of this sword had to later be rekindled in Rivendell in being re-forged), but as Elendil's sword, it was one of the most important heirlooms of the Dunedain, maybe even the most important after the Ring of Barahir and the original Star of Elendil, as a symbol of the High King of the Numenorean Exiles... Isildur thought Narsil important enough to send two of his warriors to bring it to safety at the Gladden Fields, so why was Aragorn wandering around Arnor by himself with this priceless heirloom? What good did it do him, the Heir of Elendil, supposedly travelling incognito as a 'Ranger', to carry it? If the Chieftains of the North made a habit of this, it would probably account for the fact that so many of them seemed to die young and violently ;-) Surely he should have worn some serviceable, if less valuable weapon, if Eriador was so dangerous, and doubly so when he heard from Gildor's people that the Black Riders (whom he knew to be Nazgul) were about? How could this "hardiest of Men" have been so foolhardy to risk himself, his line and one of the Exiles' greatest treasures? just a thought... Daithi ###### From: pedwards@dmapub.dma.org (Phil Edwards) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: 5 Mar 2001 12:42:15 -0500 Organization: $home is where the core is Lines: 22 Message-ID: <980j5n$igr$1@dmapub.dma.org> References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> X-Why-No-Archive: well, do /you/ think it's worth the diskspace? NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.115.68.80 X-Trace: 5 Mar 2001 12:43:25 -0500, 209.115.68.80 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.tele.dk!194.176.220.129!newsfeed.icl.net!news-feed.fnsi.net!athena.netset.com!localhost!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33289 David Flood wrote: > Just *why* was Strider/Aragorn, who told the Hobbits incessantly about the > dangers of the lands between the Shire and Rivendell, wearing a useless > sword while travelling in those same lands? ("and they saw that the blade > was indeed broken a foot below the hilt", 'Strider' pp188, tFotR). I was wondering this just last night, rereading those chapters. I'm glad it's not just me. How the &#!% was he supposed to defend himself? Using what? His personal long-stemmed curiously-carved smoking pipe? Maybe Numenorean tobacco is fatal to orcs. Phil -- pedwards at disaster dot jaj dot com | pme at sources dot redhat dot com devphil at several other less interesting addresses in various dot domains The gods do not protect fools. Fools are protected by more capable fools. ###### From: Frannie Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Message-ID: <2gv7atc7jnbetsdf2lme9brpj85tdkmerr@4ax.com> References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> <980j5n$igr$1@dmapub.dma.org> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 21:00:50 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 142.165.27.144 X-Trace: tomcat.sk.sympatico.ca 983826050 142.165.27.144 (Mon, 05 Mar 2001 15:00:50 CST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 15:00:50 CST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news0.de.colt.net!colt.net!newspeer.highwayone.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!btnet-peer!btnet!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!cyclone.bc.net!clarke.sasknet.sk.ca!tomcat.sk.sympatico.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33341 On 5 Mar 2001 12:42:15 -0500, pedwards@dmapub.dma.org (Phil Edwards) wrote: > >David Flood wrote: >> Just *why* was Strider/Aragorn, who told the Hobbits incessantly about the >> dangers of the lands between the Shire and Rivendell, wearing a useless >> sword while travelling in those same lands? ("and they saw that the blade >> was indeed broken a foot below the hilt", 'Strider' pp188, tFotR). > >I was wondering this just last night, rereading those chapters. I'm glad >it's not just me. > >How the &#!% was he supposed to defend himself? Using what? His personal >long-stemmed curiously-carved smoking pipe? Maybe Numenorean tobacco is >fatal to orcs. > > >Phil my hubby says..keep reading! ###### Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> Organization: Europa From: ronc@pacifier.com (Ron Christian) NNTP-Posting-Host: thetics.europa.com Message-ID: <3aa405b6$1_2@news.nwlink.com> Date: 5 Mar 2001 13:31:34 -0800 X-Trace: 5 Mar 2001 13:31:34 -0800, thetics.europa.com Lines: 43 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!isdnet!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer1.nac.net!newsfeed.nwlink.com!news.nwlink.com!ronc Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33291 In article <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>, David Flood wrote: >This one has bothered me for the last ten years, every time I re-read "The >Fellowship of the Ring" - > >Just *why* was Strider/Aragorn, who told the Hobbits incessantly about the >dangers of the lands between the Shire and Rivendell, wearing a useless >sword while travelling in those same lands? ("and they saw that the blade >was indeed broken a foot below the hilt", 'Strider' pp188, tFotR). Good question. >[...] >Surely he should have worn some serviceable, if less valuable weapon, if >Eriador was so dangerous, and doubly so when he heard from Gildor's people >that the Black Riders (whom he knew to be Nazgul) were about? How could >this "hardiest of Men" have been so foolhardy to risk himself, his line and >one of the Exiles' greatest treasures? > >just a thought... I don't have the book in front of me, but it seems to me that their goal was to go directly to Rivendell, and that the first thing he did with the weapon once he got there was have it reforged. I think he had it on him in Bree because the portents argued that it was finally time for Narsil to be reforged. So, he was either already on the way to Rivendell when he was redirected to Frodo's quest, or he looked at the situation and decided to take the sword with him. I agree, however, that he should have had another weapon with him. Firebrands make for cool movie trailers, but I don't think they're that practical in a fight. :-) Someone more scholarly than I will no-doubt point out the exact paragraph in the Letters that contradicts this. :-) Ron -- [www.europa.com/~ronc] "Denying minorities their God-given right to vote is a terrible, terrible crime. Unless they're Cuban immigrants, of course." -- Rev. Jessie Jackson (paraphrased) ###### From: "John Bytheway" Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 22:36:06 -0000 Organization: BT Internet Lines: 21 Message-ID: <9814f4$rhs$1@neptunium.btinternet.com> References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> <980j5n$igr$1@dmapub.dma.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: host62-7-110-237.btinternet.com X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.bme.hu!news.tele.dk!212.74.64.35!colt.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer0!btnet-feed5!btnet!mendelevium.btinternet.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33316 Phil Edwards wrote in message news:980j5n$igr$1@dmapub.dma.org... > How the &#!% was he supposed to defend himself? Using what? His personal > long-stemmed curiously-carved smoking pipe? Maybe Numenorean tobacco is > fatal to orcs. Clearly, defense was not necessary. He was pretty good at hiding out anyway, and when faced with an enemy he could of course simply Stride away, or invoke the names of a few powerful friends (e.g. Elrond), or perhaps offer to heal their wounds in return for his life. At the worst he could pull his sword out 10 inches and say "Don't think I don't know how to use this thing" in a threatening voice. This all changed when he was being accompanied by loud, slow, impolite companions, and he decided it was high time he could hold his own in a fight. John ###### From: brahms@mindspring.com (Stan Brown) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 20:15:49 -0500 Organization: Oak Road Systems Lines: 24 Message-ID: References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> <3aa405b6$1_2@news.nwlink.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 3f.35.7f.40 X-Server-Date: 6 Mar 2001 01:15:45 GMT X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.10 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news.uni-ulm.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!schlund.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.icl.net!netnews.com!xfer02.netnews.com!newsfeed2.earthlink.net!newsfeed.earthlink.net!news.mindspring.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33324 Quoth Ron Christian in rec.arts.books.tolkien: >I don't have the book in front of me, but it seems to me that their goal >was to go directly to Rivendell, and that the first thing he did with the >weapon once he got there was have it reforged. I think he had it on him >in Bree because the portents argued that it was finally time for Narsil >to be reforged. My problem with that explanation is that the sword started out in Rivendell, where Elrond gave it to Aragorn (along with other heirlooms) before the start of the War. So Aragorn had to carry a broken sword at least from Rivendell to Bree and back again, instead of something more useful. I hope someone can come up with a story-internal explanation that's at least plausible, because this point has always bothered me too. Seems like David Flood struck a nerve here -- and I mean that in a good way. -- Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Cortland County, New York, USA http://oakroadsystems.com Tolkien FAQs: http://home.uchicago.edu/~sbjensen/Tolkien/ Encyclopedia of Arda: http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/default.htm more FAQs: http://oakroadsystems.com/tech/faqget.htm ###### From: pedwards@dmapub.dma.org (Phil Edwards) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: 5 Mar 2001 20:59:13 -0500 Organization: $home is where the core is Lines: 21 Message-ID: <981g9h$tmu$1@dmapub.dma.org> References: <97u9o3$t4m$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> <980j5n$igr$1@dmapub.dma.org> <2gv7atc7jnbetsdf2lme9brpj85tdkmerr@4ax.com> X-Why-No-Archive: well, do /you/ think it's worth the diskspace? NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.115.68.80 X-Trace: 5 Mar 2001 21:00:24 -0500, 209.115.68.80 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.bme.hu!news.tele.dk!171.64.14.106!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!news-out.nuthinbutnews.com!news-in-austin.nuthinbutnews.com!news-feed.ssmdata.net!athena.netset.com!localhost!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33290 Frannie wrote: > my hubby says..keep reading! Well, thanks for quoting my entire post only to add one line. I've read the books so many times I feel I can quote entire passages. So, ask your hubbie, please, what exactly he had in mind? You won't be spoiling any surprises for me. If somebody out there has a working in-story answer, I'd love to hear it. Blast Tolkien for having the bad grace to suddenly pass away before we could ask him these questions. :-( Phil -- pedwards at disaster dot jaj dot com | pme at sources dot redhat dot com devphil at several other less interesting addresses in various dot domains The gods do not protect fools. Fools are protected by more capable fools. ###### Lines: 26 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: mcresq@aol.com (Russ) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Date: 06 Mar 2001 07:26:36 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: Session Scheduler Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Message-ID: <20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com> Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!do.de.uu.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.online.be!europa.netcrusader.net!152.163.239.130!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33308 In article , brahms@mindspring.com (Stan Brown) writes: >My problem with that explanation is that the sword started out in >Rivendell, where Elrond gave it to Aragorn (along with other >heirlooms) before the start of the War. So Aragorn had to carry a >broken sword at least from Rivendell to Bree and back again, instead >of something more useful. > >I hope someone can come up with a story-internal explanation that's >at least plausible, because this point has always bothered me too. >Seems like David Flood struck a nerve here -- and I mean that in a >good way. > Quite frankly, I simply never took Tolkien's comments in Letters very seriously. We have to assume some comments in Letters were simply off the cuff remarks like anyone else who has ever written a letter in his life. (God knows there are some things saved on Deja that I wish weren't saved for posterity ). And Aragorn not having a usable sword and merely carrying around some shards is one of them. (Sauron bringing the Ring to Numenor and carrying it back to Middle-earth as a spirit is another) Russ ###### Reply-To: "Conrad Dunkerson" From: "Conrad Dunkerson" Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien References: <20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com> Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:51:02 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.78.72.158 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 983875862 12.78.72.158 (Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:51:02 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:51:02 GMT Organization: AT&T Worldnet Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.tele.dk!209.50.235.254!europa.netcrusader.net!204.127.161.3!wn3feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.71!wnfilter1!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33300 "Russ" wrote in message news:20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com... > We have to assume some comments in Letters were simply off the > cuff remarks like anyone else who has ever written a letter in > his life. > And Aragorn not having a usable sword and merely carrying around > some shards is one of them. > (Sauron bringing the Ring to Numenor and carrying it back to > Middle-earth as a spirit is another) There may be reasons to question the logic of each of these (though I don't personally have a problem with either), but they were certainly not just 'off the cuff'. Both appeared more than once and over a period of years. ###### Reply-To: "Conrad Dunkerson" From: "Conrad Dunkerson" Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien References: <97uc87$foc$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk> <9813j9$d9g$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk> <9MUo6.6076$Ey1.340798@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net> <9818m1$kn8$1@newsg4.svr.pol.co.uk> <981h70$7ln$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk> Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Lines: 85 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:30:41 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.78.72.158 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 983878241 12.78.72.158 (Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:30:41 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:30:41 GMT Organization: AT&T Worldnet Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.cwix.com!wn2feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.72!wnfilter2!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33295 "David Flood" wrote in message news:981h70$7ln$1@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk... > I think he was there rather to join Gandalf in escorting the > Ringbearer to Rivendell (see below), wherever he had come from - > prudence should have had him able to defend himself and the > Ring... If he knew he would be in particular danger (which seems unlikely to me). At that, I think he COULD defend himself... even when the Nazgul showed up. Consider the road the hobbits were taking. Bilbo and a bunch of unarmed Dwarves took the same route without great concern, and would have been fine except for a trio of recently arrived trolls. Further, Gandalf had said; "'If you want my advice, make for Rivendell. That journey should not prove too perilous, though the Road is less easy than it was, and it will grow worse as the year fails." FotR, Three is Company At this point only Frodo and Sam were supposed to be going on the journey. If Gandalf expected it to be 'not too perilous' for THEM then I'd argue that it certainly wasn't a grave danger for Strider. Of course, the arrival of the Nazgul changed all that but there is no indication Strider knew the Nazgul were about until September... after he returned from the 'journey of his own'. The fact that it was a matter 'of his own' suggests to me that he had gone to retrieve the sword. > Strider seems, from his own account in tFotR, have returned from > Wilderland with Gandalf, gone on his 'journey', then returned to > join Gandalf at the Shire in Sept. (to also accompany the > Ringbearer to Rivendell?). > OK - we know that for some strange reason he travelled to meet > Gandalf and Frodo practically unarmed... Why didn't he at least > borrow some gear from either the Elves he met, or the Rangers > manning the Fords? It was obvious that there was danger of > fighting, in getting the Ring out of the Shire and safely to > Rivendell... Let's have the passage to get the sequence of events; "'I came west with him in the spring. ... We last met on the first of May: at Sarn Ford down the Brandywine. He told me that his business with you had gone well, and that you would be starting for Rivendell in the last week of September. As I knew he was at your side, I went away on a journey of my own. And that proved ill; for plainly some news reached him, and I was not at hand to help. ... When I returned, many days ago, I heard the ill news. The tidings had gone far and wide that Gandalf was missing and the horsemen had been seen." FotR, Strider As such I would agree that Strider had likely returned in hopes of joining Gandalf in escorting Frodo to Rivendell. However, from the time they parted at Sarn Ford (where the Rangers held a guard and later fought the Nazgul) until he expected to meet Gandalf in September he was off on a trip and did not learn of the Nazgul until he returned. At which point he wasn't near any of the known Ranger dwellings / outposts where he could switch weapons. He could have gotten something from the Elves - if they were armed, and if he knew that HE would be meeting Frodo and they wouldn't. At that, swords that struck Nazgul exploded and injured the wielder... he was probably better off with a firebrand, and he knew it. In April Gandalf felt that the road to Rivendell would not prove too perilous for two unarmed and untried hobbits to travel in September. On May 1st he met with Strider and told him about this. Sometime in June he hears of the Nazgul, leaves a message telling Frodo to leave before August, and takes off for Isengard. Frodo doesn't get the message, and so is 'on time' to meet Strider. Strider was expecting a road safe enough for two unarmed hobbits to travel alone... and Gandalf as escort. To me it all ties together logically. He had the shards because the time for them to be reforged was at hand. He didn't have another sword because it would be awkward to carry both, the road was supposed to be safe, Gandalf was supposed to be there, and/or swords were not the best weapons against Nazgul. ###### Lines: 35 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: mnkohrz@gateway.net (Mnkohrz) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Date: 06 Mar 2001 15:06:38 GMT References: <20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com> Organization: http://www.compuserve.com Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Message-ID: <20010306100638.14193.00000009@ng-ff1.news.gateway.net> Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!isdnet!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33325 >Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? >From: mcresq@aol.com (Russ) >Date: 3/6/01 1:26 AM Central Standard Time >>I hope someone can come up with a story-internal explanation that's at least plausible, because this point has always bothered me too. Well, how does this sound? Aragorn had three reasons to carry the shards of Narsil: sentimential, practical and utilitarian. The broken sword served as a personal reminder of his legacy and his purpose in life. He was not just another Ranger, he was the Heir of Isildur. As such he had responsibilities and duties that dictated that he could not afford to be the hot-tempered, reckless warrior that Boromir or Eomer was. The sword therefore served to remind him to use his brains rather than his brawn. (And I assert that this is entirely in accord with Tolkien's portrayal of Aragorn. He was quick to action when necessary, but otherwise he preferred to weigh his options and choose the best one when circumstances permitted.) As a practical matter, of course, this meant that he had to rely on other skills and talents: stealth, concealment, woodcraft and strategy. It may even have forced him to rely on other weapons, altho these are never mentioned (which may or may not be significant.) He might have also carried a staff, for example, since it can be a very useful thing in hilly terrain. Lastly, even a broken sword is not totally useless in a fight. The blade was broken a foot below the hilt - this still left a good twelve inches that he could use to slash or parry. (It was certainly longer than the blades that the hobbits carried.) It's certainly true that a whole sword would have been a much better weapon, but I don't believe that Aragorn ever carried it as a weapon until after it was reforged. Someone else in this thread implied that Narsil reforged would have been much more effective against the Nazgul. Let me point out that even if Aragorn had Anduril, it is doubtful he would have wielded it against the Nazgul since "all blades perish that peirce that dreadful king." Mnkohrz ###### From: brahms@mindspring.com (Stan Brown) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 11:29:59 -0500 Organization: Oak Road Systems Lines: 33 Message-ID: References: <20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 3f.35.71.9f X-Server-Date: 6 Mar 2001 16:27:16 GMT X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.10 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.tele.dk!171.64.14.106!newsfeed.stanford.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!newsfeed2.earthlink.net!newsfeed.earthlink.net!news.mindspring.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33337 Quoth Russ in rec.arts.books.tolkien: >Quite frankly, I simply never took Tolkien's comments in Letters very >seriously. We have to assume some comments in Letters were simply off the cuff >remarks like anyone else who has ever written a letter in his life. (God knows >there are some things saved on Deja that I wish weren't saved for posterity >). And Aragorn not having a usable sword and merely carrying around some >shards is one of them. Actually, no, we are not dependent on the Letters. In the Inn at Bree he shows Sam his broken sword. I don't see an explicit statement that Strider carried no other sword, but that scene would have been very strange if he had had one. In Appendix A we read of Elrond having turned the sword over to him at age 20: 'But when Estel was only twenty years of age, it chanced that he returned to Rivendell after great deeds in the company of the sons of Elrond; and Elrond looked at him and was pleased, for he saw that he was fair and noble and was early come to manhood, though he would yet become greater in body and in mind. That day therefore Elrond called him by his true name, and told him who he was and whose son; and he delivered to him the heirlooms of his house. ' "Here is the ring of Barahir," he said, "the token of our kinship from afar; and here also are the shards of Narsil." ' -- Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Cortland County, New York, USA http://oakroadsystems.com Tolkien FAQs: http://home.uchicago.edu/~sbjensen/Tolkien/ Encyclopedia of Arda: http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/default.htm more FAQs: http://oakroadsystems.com/tech/faqget.htm ###### From: Stug Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 13:02:25 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3AA52631.20D48413@telerama.com> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20010306022636.20978.00000997@nso-cg.aol.com> <20010306100638.14193.00000009@ng-ff1.news.gateway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 14 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.bme.hu!news.tele.dk!216.218.192.242!news.he.net!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33285 Mnkohrz wrote: > > As a practical matter, of course, this meant that he had to rely on other > skills and talents: stealth, concealment, woodcraft "Speak, Orc, or I shall whittle you to death with this . . . thing that is almost a sword." Stug -- "...the Balrogs get hence with a measureless booty." --Meglin, The Fall of Gondolin ###### Lines: 38 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: mcresq@aol.com (Russ) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Date: 06 Mar 2001 18:20:14 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: Session Scheduler Subject: Re: Why was Strider lugging around a Broken Sword??? Message-ID: <20010306132014.02654.00000822@nso-md.aol.com> Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!kanja.arnes.si!news-hub.siol.net!news-out.cwix.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:33306 In article , brahms@mindspring.com (Stan Brown) writes: >>Quite frankly, I simply never took Tolkien's comments in Letters very >>seriously. We have to assume some comments in Letters were simply off the >cuff >>remarks like anyone else who has ever written a letter in his life. (God >knows >>there are some things saved on Deja that I wish weren't saved for posterity >>). And Aragorn not having a usable sword and merely carrying around some >>shards is one of them. > >Actually, no, we are not dependent on the Letters. In the Inn at >Bree he shows Sam his broken sword. I don't see an explicit >statement that Strider carried no other sword, but that scene would >have been very strange if he had had one. > >In Appendix A we read of Elrond having turned the sword over to him >at age 20: > >'But when Estel was only twenty years of age, it chanced that he >returned to Rivendell after great deeds in the company of the sons >of Elrond; and Elrond looked at him and was pleased, for he saw that >he was fair and noble and was early come to manhood, though he would >yet become greater in body and in mind. That day therefore Elrond >called him by his true name, and told him who he was and whose son; >and he delivered to him the heirlooms of his house. > >' "Here is the ring of Barahir," he said, "the token of our kinship >from afar; and here also are the shards of Narsil." ' I don't have a problem with Aragorn carrying around shards. I do have a problem with him having no other weapon in the dangerous wilds of Eriador. Russ Russ