From: wilbur07@aol.com (Wilbur07) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: From the Angband Newsgroup Lines: 116 NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder05.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 16 Jan 2000 03:09:47 GMT Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Message-ID: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!nyc-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!easynet-tele!easynet.net!newspump.sol.net!news.execpc.com!newspeer.sol.net!europa.netcrusader.net!24.30.200.2!cyclone-east.rr.com!news.rr.com!news-east.rr.com!portc05.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12599 Subject: Late birthday present for Tolkien -- Tolkien and his poor writing v. 4 From: ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) Date: 1/12/00 9:18 AM Pacific Standard Time Message-id: <387cb62c.2270874@enews.newsguy.com> How could I let Tolkien's birthday go by without reposting my most popular article ever? =============================== It seems that Tolkien has not thought very clearly before writing his books. He really needs to think things through before even putting pen to paper. Some examples: 1) Beren goes through all the trouble of having Luthien put Morgoth to sleep, sneaking in, etc. All he has to do is read some glyph of warding scrolls and shoot him with some bolts. He should have found some if he went down to level 100 of Angband. And how did he get down so low with only Angrist? This story is obviously not well thought out. 2) Hurin manages to slay Mim, and the story makes no mention of his stuff getting disenchanted. I guess mabye he didn't have magical things, but Tolkien could have given us a little clue. [What was Hurin doing going up against Mim with nothing magical?] 3) According to Unfinished Tales, in the final days before Hurin's capture he would not wear his iron helm. Why the hell not? Didn't he notice when he put it on there was magic light and he suddenly could see all the monsters around him? No wonder he got captured. 4) Gothmog fails to summon anything in his fight with Echtelion, even though there is no mention of an anti-summoning corridor. 5) Turin somehow manages to use Mormegil, with its huge minuses, to off Glaurung in one blow. I don't think so. Glaurung also has "Gothmog syndrome" when he doesn't summon any ancient dragons. "Father of Dragons" indeed. 6) Excuse me, Mr. Tolkien, it's "Muhgash" not "Muzgash", and he's a kobold, not an orc. Geez. 7) It is impossible for Bard to kill Smaug with one arrow using the Long Bow of Bard, unless our redoutable human has hacked the source code. One wonders exactly what the "black arrow" is. 8) This could be attributed to luck, but while in Moria the party manages to completely avoid the Evil Iggy. Gandalf also uses an unorthodox strategy of beating the Balrog which involves no invulnerability potions. 9) Okay, I thought Gandalf was supposed to be honorable. But he had cheat death on! Glorfindel also uses cheats. New: 1) Is Samwise Gamgee at some kind of negative level? Sting provides at least 3 attacks, but he only makes two seperate swipes against Shelob. Also, Shelob exhibits "Gothmog Syndrome" when she fails to summon even one spider. 2) Okay...how did Aragorn turn a Broken Sword into Anarion? The book mentions "forging". Nice euphemism for "hacking"; he obviously went to the Forge of Hex Editing. I think he took cheating lessons from Gandalf. 3) Gandalf was putting on a show for the Fellowship. With Narya and its immunity to fire, he had nothing to fear from Muar. He obviously had some ulterior motive, probably to cover up the fact that his Cheat Death option is on. 4) Beren somehow gets the Iron Crown of Morgoth even though he doesn't slay the evil fiend. There's some heavy duty cheating going on here.... 5) Tolkien overestimates the power of the One Ring. Sorry, but "Control Ringwraith","Ressurection", and "Rule the World" are not innate powers of the ring, nor are they in the list of "Bizzare Things" that it activates for. Perhaps Tolkien misread the spoilers? 6) After slaying Muar, Gandalf does not pick up Calris. (Or maybe he didn't read the spoilers to find out that it was good; although this is unlikely given his other cheating.) More New: 1) When the party is getting ready at Rivendell, they make no attempt to procure even the most basic items, such as cure light wounds and phase door scrolls. The orcs would have been much easier if they had had those basic items. 2) Morgoth is apparently dead even though Sauron is not. (Probably Gandalf-the-cheater is to blame again). 3) Did Saruman forget how to use all his powers at Orthanc? He doesn't do any magical bolts or attacks. 4) Something is wrong with the generation as well. Glaurung, Sauron, Saruman, and many others appear in the town level, and the Balrog of Moria is well above the level he normally appears at. (Perhaps Tolkien could not read C code very well and did not have access to spoiler files. Or, perhaps Tolkien was a visionary and saw the creation of terrain and multiple towns.) 5) Tolkien made a late note saying that there were very few Balrogs, perhaps only seven. Huh? Is that the number that he met in his limited playing time? And a bonus birthday one: 1) On Weathertop, the hobbits are unable to see the faces of the Ringwraiths even though their Westernesse daggers should be providing them with See Invisible. -Chris Mark Constantino ###### From: nath_kuijpers@bit.wxs.nl (Morwen) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 19:51:38 GMT Organization: Planet Internet Lines: 18 Message-ID: <388220d5.43649018@news.wxs.nl> References: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> Reply-To: nath_kuijpers@bit.wxs.nl NNTP-Posting-Host: ut0239-1.dial.wxs.nl X-Trace: reader1.wxs.nl 948052060 1173310 195.121.232.239 (16 Jan 2000 19:47:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@wxs.nl NNTP-Posting-Date: 16 Jan 2000 19:47:40 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!isdnet!newsfeed.icl.net!news-x.support.nl!195.121.6.78.MISMATCH!news.wxs.nl!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12612 On 16 Jan 2000 03:09:47 GMT, wilbur07@aol.com (Wilbur07) wrote: >Subject: Late birthday present for Tolkien -- Tolkien and his poor writing v. 4 >From: ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) >Date: 1/12/00 9:18 AM Pacific Standard Time >Message-id: <387cb62c.2270874@enews.newsguy.com> > >How could I let Tolkien's birthday go by without reposting my most >popular article ever? [regretful snip of brilliant article] LOLOL ROTFLKMHIGLMAF etc -- Morwen, Guardian of the CHOKLIT Sword ()xxxxxx)|(>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (remove the obvious bit to reply....) ###### From: jsavard@tenMAPSONeerf.edmonton.ab.ca (John Savard) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 14:48:43 GMT Organization: Edmonton Community Network Lines: 15 Message-ID: <38832b33.680021@news.ecn.ab.ca> References: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> <388220d5.43649018@news.wxs.nl> <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet.edmonton.ab.ca X-Trace: newsfeed.sas.ab.ca 948121043 10440 198.161.206.2 (17 Jan 2000 14:57:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@sas.ab.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 17 Jan 2000 14:57:23 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!194.25.134.126.MISMATCH!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.tli.de!newsfeed.direct.ca!cyclone.bc.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!sas.ab.ca!ecn.ab.ca!198.161.206.167 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12619 On Mon, 17 Jan 2000 03:47:37 GMT, ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) wrote, in part: >Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not played >Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and rabt. I think that people who have played Moria, or Castle of the Winds, or D&D would still recognize enough to appreciate the humor. I remember reading, long ago, a piece on the web that was along the same lines as this, but which "criticized" Tolkien by comparing his works to D&D, for example, commenting that Gandalf was a high-level wizard, and yet only used a few low-level spells in the book. John Savard (teneerf <-) http://www.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html ###### From: ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 17:28:46 GMT Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 17 Message-ID: <38835132.1766035@enews.newsguy.com> References: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> <388220d5.43649018@news.wxs.nl> <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> <85upn0$7v6$1@bgtnsc01.worldnet.att.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-294.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!pln-w!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews4 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12637 On Mon, 17 Jan 2000 05:02:09 -0500, "Conrad Dunkerson" posted the following: >Chris Kern wrote in message >news:388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com... > >> Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not >> played Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and >> rabt. > >Well, I suspect there are probably several of us here who have and >found it amusing. It has been a LONG time since I've looked at the >'roguelike' hierarchy, so I wouldn't have seen it otherwise. Well, if people find it funny ^_^ -Chris ###### From: jsavard@domain.ctry (John Savard) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 17:29:51 GMT Organization: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet Lines: 16 Message-ID: <38835122.27878967@news.prosurfr.com> References: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> <388220d5.43649018@news.wxs.nl> <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: c9169-006.prosurfr.com X-Trace: burn.ab.videon.ca 948155194 8041 24.108.84.20 (18 Jan 2000 00:26:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 18 Jan 2000 00:26:33 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newshunter!cosy.sbg.ac.at!news-feed.inet.tele.dk!bofh.vszbr.cz!europa.netcrusader.net!199.60.229.5!newsfeed.direct.ca!cyclone.bc.net!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!news.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12642 ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) wrote, in part: >Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not played >Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and rabt. I think people who have even just heard of Dungeons and Dragons can get the humor in it; and lots of people have played Rogue or Moria or Castle of the Winds, if not Angband. I remember some time ago seeing on the Web a similar piece, criticizing Tolkien because such a powerful wizard as Gandalf only used "a few low-level spells"...this time comparing The Lord of the Rings to D&D. John Savard (jsavardecnabca) http://www.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/crypto.htm ###### From: ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 04:35:47 GMT Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 15 Message-ID: <3883ed8d.41798635@enews.newsguy.com> References: <20000115220947.13032.00000124@ng-ft1.aol.com> <388220d5.43649018@news.wxs.nl> <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> <38835122.27878967@news.prosurfr.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-866.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!pln-w!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews4 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12625 On Mon, 17 Jan 2000 17:29:51 GMT, jsavard@domain.ctry (John Savard) posted the following: >ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) wrote, in part: > >>Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not played >>Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and rabt. > >I think people who have even just heard of Dungeons and Dragons can >get the humor in it; and lots of people have played Rogue or Moria or >Castle of the Winds, if not Angband. Yeah, that was my later thought. Well, enjoy ^_^ -Chris ###### From: wilbur07@aol.com (Wilbur07) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Lines: 7 NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder06.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 18 Jan 2000 06:25:55 GMT References: <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Message-ID: <20000118012555.18862.00000843@ng-ce1.aol.com> Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!howland.erols.net!portc02.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12622 >Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not played >Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and rabt. Oh, sorry Chris, but I thought it would be amusing to more than a few people. I sure got a kick out of it! Mark Constantino ###### From: ckern@netnitco.net (Chris Kern) Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 16:56:45 GMT Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 14 Message-ID: <38849b2d.1439463@enews.newsguy.com> References: <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> <20000118012555.18862.00000843@ng-ce1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-522.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!pln-w!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews1 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12621 On 18 Jan 2000 06:25:55 GMT, wilbur07@aol.com (Wilbur07) posted the following: >>Unfortunately, that means very little to people who have not played >>Angband -- there is a reason I didn't post that to aft and rabt. > >Oh, sorry Chris, but I thought it would be amusing to more than a few people. >I sure got a kick out of it! Well, I figured most Angband players would (and you've been posting to rgra for longer than me, which is over three years!) But it's OK, apparently some people enjoyed it. -Chris ###### From: "Öjevind Lång" Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien References: <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> <20000118012555.18862.00000843@ng-ce1.aol.com> <38849b2d.1439463@enews.newsguy.com> Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup Lines: 14 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.151.35.70 X-Complaints-To: news-abuse@swip.net X-Trace: nntpserver.swip.net 948232882 212.151.35.70 (Tue, 18 Jan 2000 23:01:22 MET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 23:01:22 MET DST Organization: A Customer of Tele2 X-Sender: s-774765@d212-151-35-70.swipnet.se Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 23:03:49 +0100 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.tli.de!newsfeed1.swip.net!swipnet!nntpserver.swip.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12706 Chris Kern hath written: [snip] >Well, I figured most Angband players would (and you've been posting to >rgra for longer than me, which is over three years!) But it's OK, >apparently some people enjoyed it. I enjoyed it, and I have not even heard of Angband. Öjevind ###### User-Agent: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 5.01 (1630) Subject: Re: From the Angband Newsgroup From: Gary Patterson Newsgroups: rec.arts.books.tolkien Message-ID: References: <388290c0.15174525@enews.newsguy.com> <20000118012555.18862.00000843@ng-ce1.aol.com> <38849b2d.1439463@enews.newsguy.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: sllst1p19.ozemail.com.au X-Trace: ozemail.com.au 948234004 203.108.69.163 (Wed, 19 Jan 2000 09:20:04 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 09:20:04 EST Organization: OzEmail Pty Ltd, Australia Distribution: world Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 09:20:38 +1100 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!194.25.134.126.MISMATCH!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.icl.net!netnews.com!newsfeed.concentric.net!newsfeed.ozemail.com.au!ozemail.com.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch rec.arts.books.tolkien:12709 > Öjevind Lång wrote > > I enjoyed it, and I have not even heard of Angband. > But, you've got a computer and it's the classic (but not necessarily, -or even very- accurate) game from the Tolkien mythos. Have a look at the following sites: http://thangorodrim.angband.org/ http://www.phial.com/angband/ I played it for months on my Mac, even though it uses a text-based map. I feel it has more depth than games like Diablo (which is infinitely better looking and actually has sound).