From: Alan Frisbie Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 11:02:56 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3FC255E0.60409@Flying-Disk.com> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 (NSCD7.01) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 47 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14212 John R. Strohm wrote: > This is an even more off-the-wall idea. > > Around the time all this neat stuf was happening, there was a company called > Imlac, that made a vector graphics machine called a PDS-1. The main > processor looked a LOT like a 16-bit pdp8, as I recall, and there were also > instructions intended to be executed by a display list processor that shared > the RAM with the main processor. > > So, has anyone cooked up a proper emulator for it? I just stumbled across this thread, so I apologize for the late arrival. I have an actual Imlac PDS-1D sitting across the room from me right now. I also have an almost complete spare one, but the processor box suffers the indignity of sitting out in the weather on the patio (sorry, no more space indoors). I also have a couple boxes of documentation and print sets, along with several paper tapes for it. The working one has the big 21-inch monitor in the wood-grain box, with a detached keyboard. The "spare" (not a -D) one has the all-in-one monitor/keyboard (with one broken key). Both of them have the lights/switches boxes. What does the "-D" indicate? If it stands for "Disk", mine does not have one. Long ago, I copied all the paper tapes to RX01 floppy disks so I could download the Imlac from my PDP-11. The last time I had it powered up (1984), I played Spacewar on it. My intent is to make sure it is still in running condition and then donate it to the Computer History Museum, if they are interested in it. I may have to replace the electrolytic capacitors, as they have probably gone bad by now. The insulation on the power cord had started to crumble, so that's another maintenance item. As for their history, the "spares" one (S/N 118) came from an auction in Los Angeles sometime around 1980. The working one (S/N 150) came from UCLA a year or two later. Alan ###### From: lukevaxhacker@excite.com (Bill Maddox) Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 Date: 24 Nov 2003 16:40:10 -0800 Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 43 Message-ID: References: <3FC255E0.60409@Flying-Disk.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.209.4.196 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1069720811 32199 127.0.0.1 (25 Nov 2003 00:40:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 00:40:11 +0000 (UTC) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!postnews1.google.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14213 Alan, I'm fairly sure the museum would be interested in this. The museum has sponsored one sucessful restoration effort to date, bringing an IBM 1620 back to life, and I believe another effort is gearing up to restore the PDP-1, which was once running Space War when it was on display at DEC's Marlboro facility. There was quite a bit of concern during the 1620 project about maintaining the historical integrity of the machine, careful bringup procedures with respect testing power supplies, reforming capacitors, and so on, and the people involved in that project may have a lot of useful advice to pass on. Both Lee Courtney and Dave Babcock were involved with the 1620 project and would be good people to contact. Lee is the Volunteer Coordinator and is listed in the staff directory on the museum website. I'm sure that either he or the curatorial staff could put you in touch with Dave. If by chance the museum is not interested (which I imagine would only happen if they already have an Imlac or two in the collection already), a few folks on the classic computing mailing list (www.classiccmp.org) would probably sell their first-born for one of these machines... ;) Take care, --Bill Alan Frisbie wrote: > I have an actual Imlac PDS-1D sitting across the room from me > right now. I also have an almost complete spare one, but > the processor box suffers the indignity of sitting out in the > weather on the patio (sorry, no more space indoors). > > I also have a couple boxes of documentation and print sets, along > with several paper tapes for it. > ... > My intent is to make sure it is still in running condition and > then donate it to the Computer History Museum, if they are > interested in it. I may have to replace the electrolytic > capacitors, as they have probably gone bad by now. The > insulation on the power cord had started to crumble, so that's > another maintenance item. > ... ###### From: "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777> Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 19:41:20 -0500 Organization: Sprint Advanced Network Services Lines: 32 Message-ID: References: <3FC255E0.60409@Flying-Disk.com> Reply-To: "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777> NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.244.111.148 X-Trace: news.utelfla.com 1069806427 15072 208.244.111.148 (26 Nov 2003 00:27:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.utelfla.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 00:27:07 +0000 (UTC) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed.cgocable.net!news.sprintnetops.net!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14223 A little topic drift: > I'm fairly sure the museum would be interested in this. The museum > has sponsored one sucessful restoration effort to date, bringing an > IBM 1620 back to life, and I believe another effort is gearing up to > restore the PDP-1, which was once running Space War when it was on > display at DEC's Marlboro facility. There was quite a bit of concern > during the 1620 project about maintaining the historical integrity of > the machine, careful bringup procedures with respect testing power > supplies, reforming capacitors, and so on, and the people involved in > that project may have a lot of useful advice to pass on. The PDP-1 was rescued from the MIT Surplus Properties Office by the MIT Electronics Research Society circa 1976, and we had it up and running Spacewar at our facilities in Room 20B-119. (I should note that a great deal of that "up and running" business was thanks to Dave Felsendthal {sic?}, along with other MITERS members.) It was traded to DEC for picking rights to their salvage bins. I never saw the -1 at DEC, but it was up and running Spacewar at The Boston Computer Museum in the early '80s. By that time somebody had more or less stripped the machine of all its historical provenance and "restored" it back to some sort of factory-fresh state. Given the -1 was in a chaotic state before Dave worked on it (Professor Jack Dennis and generations of his graduate students had made a *lot* of modifications over the years, and documentation was problematical.), yet he got it to work in a few weeks, and it was "clean" before it was shipped west from TBCM, there should really be no reason why the machine couldn't be made to run without a lot of grief. For a short while I was in contact with a Mike Chaponis, IIRC, about the -1's restoration. Whatever became of that effort? ###### From: aek@spies.com (Al Kossow) Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:37:48 -0800 (PST) Organization: Spies In the Wire Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: spies.com X-Trace: 25 Nov 2003 22:41:41 -0800, spies.com Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!logbridge.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!enews.sgi.com!news.spies.com!unknown!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14224 From article , by "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777>: > For a short while I was in contact with a > Mike Chaponis, IIRC, about the -1's restoration. Whatever became of that > effort? > Mike is the person is the team lead for the restoration effort. Are you sure this machine is the same one you are thinking of? I saw the insides tonight, and it is a 12k machine built around 1963 with magtape, dectape card punch and a rand tablet interface. It also has hardware multiply/divide. An online log of the restoration effort is at http://wiki.pdp-1.org/ ###### From: "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777> Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 14:10:09 -0500 Organization: Sprint Advanced Network Services Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777> NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.244.111.154 X-Trace: news.utelfla.com 1069872957 18463 208.244.111.154 (26 Nov 2003 18:55:57 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.utelfla.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 18:55:57 +0000 (UTC) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed.cgocable.net!news.sprintnetops.net!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14225 > > For a short while I was in contact with a > > Mike Chaponis, IIRC, about the -1's restoration. Whatever became of that > > effort? > > > > Mike is the person is the team lead for the restoration effort. > > Are you sure this machine is the same one you are thinking of? > I saw the insides tonight, and it is a 12k machine built around > 1963 with magtape, dectape card punch and a rand tablet interface. > It also has hardware multiply/divide. > > An online log of the restoration effort is at http://wiki.pdp-1.org/ AFAIK, the PDP-1 at TBCM came from DEC's museum, and DEC got it from MITERS, which got it from the MIT Surplus Properties Office, which got it probably from the Research Lab in Electronics, which, so far as I know, got it from Moses when he brought it down off the mountain with the Tablets. The -1 was in highly-modified condition when it left MITERS, and the -1 at TBCM was "factory fresh", so a lot of doing was done somewhere along the way. Pending research to ascertain the facts, I would be skeptical of any makers marks you might find. Also, I've heard rumors that the Silicon Valley museum has 2 PDP-1s around, the world's known stock, so this could be the other one. ###### Sender: eric@ruckus.brouhaha.com From: Eric Smith Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 References: <3FC255E0.60409@Flying-Disk.com> Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy. Date: 02 Dec 2003 23:33:56 -0800 Message-ID: Lines: 9 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii NNTP-Posting-Host: ruckus.brouhaha.com X-Trace: 2 Dec 2003 23:39:53 -0800, ruckus.brouhaha.com Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.spies.com!ruckus.brouhaha.com Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14229 lukevaxhacker@excite.com (Bill Maddox) writes: > The museum > has sponsored one sucessful restoration effort to date, bringing an > IBM 1620 back to life, and I believe another effort is gearing up to > restore the PDP-1, Info on the PDP-1 Restoration project may be found at: http://wiki.pdp-1.org/ http://www.pdp-1.org/ ###### Sender: eric@ruckus.brouhaha.com From: Eric Smith Newsgroups: alt.sys.pdp10 Subject: Re: Imlac PDS-1 References: Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy. Date: 03 Dec 2003 00:04:42 -0800 Message-ID: Lines: 24 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii NNTP-Posting-Host: ruckus.brouhaha.com X-Trace: 3 Dec 2003 00:10:40 -0800, ruckus.brouhaha.com Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.spies.com!ruckus.brouhaha.com Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.sys.pdp10:14230 "Geoffrey G. Rochat" <777geoff777@777pkworks777.777com777> writes: > Also, I've heard rumors that the Silicon Valley > museum has 2 PDP-1s around, the world's known stock, so this could be the > other one. The CHM has three PDP-1s. One is a production model, apparently a PDP-1/C or PDP-1/D, though we haven't found any model number or serial number plate on the machine. This is the machine that ran Spacewar! at TCM in Boston. It was on display in the "Visible Storage" area until recently when it was moved into the new restoration lab. Photos are at: http://gallery.brouhaha.com/pdp1_production Another is temporarily in Europe. It is apparently also a production machine, but we don't have much information on it. This is believed to be the machine from MIT. The third is a prototype machine. It was built in three bays (racks) of a different style than the four bays used in production machines, and does not have an attached console. It's possible that this is the PDP-1/A. Or it might be the "third machine similar to the 1/A and 1/B" described in _Computer Engineering_: http://wiki.pdp-1.org/index.cgi?PDP-1Prototype Photos are at: http://gallery.brouhaha.com/pdp1_prototype