From: "William Bliss" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Lines: 49 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: X-Trace: NDkgTm9BdXRoVXNlciBURUxPQ0lUWS1gRUFERVJTIDY0LjM0LjIzOC4yMjUgIE1vbiwgMDYgQXVn!IAAwMDEgMDg6MzI6NDYgUERU X-Abuse-Info: Please forward ALL headers when reporting abuse. X-Complaints-To: abuse@bb.directv.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:32:46 PDT Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 11:24:34 -0400 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!telocity-west!TELOCITY!newsrump.sjc.telocity.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:69966 My current DSL provider (DirectvInternet) has very poor usenet service -see below. I am seriously thinking of starting my own free public NNTP news server for just the alt.out-of-body group and indefinitely retaining all (non-spam) posts. So I have two questions. The first is: 1) Are there others out there who would like a news server, for just a.oob, with very long retention (and possibly spam filtering)? If I get enough "yea" responses to (1) then: 2) Does anyone know a news administrator who might give me a stable (bi-directional) NNTP newsfeed? A commercial account that charges only for bytes downloaded would be ok as long as the price is reasonable. As a last resort: 3) Is there a way to connect the news server component of Microsoft's IIS (or Exchange) to an existing remote news server so that it appears to be just another news-reader? Background: (obviously I'm new to NNTP stuff) Currently a full usenet newsfeed absorbs about 2GB of disk space per day. For this reason it is understandable that news administrators set expiration dates to (typically) a few months. My understanding is that the easiest way to get a feed is to find other news administrators willing to exchange feeds. But my own little server wouldn't have any value, in this respect, to other admins. I think my machine could handle 50-100 simultaneous NNTP logins which seems reasonable for this ng as long as people don't use it as their primary server and do remember to logoff. Please email me (or post) if you have comments. Thanks Wm --- I hate to speak negatively about anyone, but: to those considering subscribing to DirectvInternet's DSL (was Telocity) don't expect stable Email or NNTP services. Right now their news server is only providing 3 days of retention on alt.oob and everytime they restart the system (too often) they don't bother to pickup any missed posts. ###### From: Craig Shillington Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 16:29:49 +1000 Organization: Deja Vous Lines: 77 Message-ID: <3B70DC5D.65BC1934@ozemu.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp70.horsham.ozemu.com (203.24.252.70) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 997252497 6405380 203.24.252.70 (16 [27978]) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,ja Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!ppp70.horsham.ozemu.COM!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:69873 Hi William, > > My current DSL provider (DirectvInternet) has very poor > usenet service -see below. I am seriously thinking of starting > my own free public NNTP news server for just the alt.out-of-body > group and indefinitely retaining all (non-spam) posts. > > So I have two questions. The first is: > 1) Are there others out there who would like a news server, > for just a.oob, with very long retention (and possibly spam filtering)? > > If I get enough "yea" responses to (1) then: > 2) Does anyone know a news administrator who might give > me a stable (bi-directional) NNTP newsfeed? A commercial > account that charges only for bytes downloaded would be ok > as long as the price is reasonable. > > As a last resort: > 3) Is there a way to connect the news server component of > Microsoft's IIS (or Exchange) to an existing remote news > server so that it appears to be just another news-reader? > > Background: > (obviously I'm new to NNTP stuff) > > Currently a full usenet newsfeed absorbs about 2GB of disk > space per day. For this reason it is understandable that news > administrators set expiration dates to (typically) a few months. > My understanding is that the easiest way to get a feed is to > find other news administrators willing to exchange feeds. But > my own little server wouldn't have any value, in this respect, > to other admins. > > I think my machine could handle 50-100 simultaneous NNTP > logins which seems reasonable for this ng as long as people > don't use it as their primary server and do remember to logoff. > > Please email me (or post) if you have comments. > > Thanks > Wm > > --- > I hate to speak negatively about anyone, but: to those considering > subscribing to DirectvInternet's DSL (was Telocity) don't expect > stable Email or NNTP services. Right now their news server is only > providing 3 days of retention on alt.oob and everytime they restart > the system (too often) they don't bother to pickup any missed posts. I'm not using my ISP's news feed for the posts .... I use a free public news server which Dorothy got me onto and haven't had any trouble with it at all since using it from about a year or so ago. When I come back to the NG from being away for a while, there is always 1000 or so messages I can download, so I guess they keep them for a while .... I know I miss the occasional post ... but I don't think I miss much. The only downside is that with each session, I have to type in a username and password ... plus, you have to register as a user to be able to receive the feeds. The upside, they don't have binaries (afaik) so maybe that's why they can keep the messages longer. Plus, no matter what ISP I go through, I always have the same feed. :) Craig -- The sure way to make a thing impossible- -is to think it so. --- Franklin -- alt.out-of-body Sign in List http://out-of-body.tripod.com/signin.html Janice's alt.out-of-body Homepage http://www.geocities.com/janice240obe/index.html ###### From: "William Bliss" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body References: <3B6F0F2C.1D4F98D9@Home.com> Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Lines: 27 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: X-Trace: wMXSvJ2zh4aap4GXgNKmt769sbumq9+gt7O2t6Ch0sTG3MHG3MDBytzAwMfS0qWXlt7SwsrSs4eV!0sDCwsPSw8LIxsPIw8DSoram X-Abuse-Info: Please forward ALL headers when reporting abuse. X-Complaints-To: abuse@bb.directv.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 10:41:12 PDT Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 13:32:55 -0400 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!telocity-west!TELOCITY!newsrump.sjc.telocity.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:69962 Hi Tien, "Tien Yen" wrote in message news:3B6F0F2C.1D4F98D9@Home.com... [...] > I was disappointed when my provider dropped from 1 month down to 1 > week. Three days is pretty crappy. I guess, I just like seeing each thread in its full context. > Can't help with any of the technical stuff, but my first impression is > that it's probably a lot of bother to you. Well, my goal is to establish a web site dedicated to OBE research. Adding support for a news server shouldn't be that much extra work once it is up and running. > I find that my current > service is adequate, and I look up the odd missed post on google. Me too, It's awkward but it works. I've heard rumors that Google is talking about reducing their archives. :( Wm ###### Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!not-for-mail From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Date: 08 Aug 2001 22:49:18 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 80 Message-ID: <6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: chonsp.franklin.ch X-Trace: chonsp.franklin.ch 997303759 1527 10.0.3.2 (8 Aug 2001 20:49:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@chonsp.franklin.ch NNTP-Posting-Date: 8 Aug 2001 20:49:19 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.4 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:69969 "William Bliss" writes: > usenet service -see below. I am seriously thinking of starting > my own free public NNTP news server for just the alt.out-of-body > group and indefinitely retaining all (non-spam) posts. Nice idea. I have also been thinking of doing it, but just don't have enough time. Too many other projects. As for Spam, are you just counting commercial stuff (not worth the trouble of removing, as 1..3%) or also the a.a crossposted crap (a lot and auto-filter-able)? > 1) Are there others out there who would like a news server, > for just a.oob, with very long retention (and possibly spam filtering)? My present one is OK. > 3) Is there a way to connect the news server component of > Microsoft's IIS (or Exchange) to an existing remote news > server so that it appears to be just another news-reader? Hmmm. To everyone the OS he likes to use. But have you taken in account the problems of having an MS OS 24h online? Virii? Worms? Break ins? Crashing after remote patching? > Currently a full usenet newsfeed absorbs about 2GB of disk More than 10G per day, for a full feed (with binaries and pictures groups, AFAIK (was 6G 4 years ago, said my then ISP). > space per day. For this reason it is understandable that news > administrators set expiration dates to (typically) a few months. Usually only a few weeks, in my experience. > My understanding is that the easiest way to get a feed is to > find other news administrators willing to exchange feeds. But > my own little server wouldn't have any value, in this respect, > to other admins. For an 1 group server any other server (or better multiple ones, so you get all posts) will do, using client-style download. That is how my own local 6-group server works. > I think my machine could handle 50-100 simultaneous NNTP > logins which seems reasonable for this ng as long as people > don't use it as their primary server and do remember to logoff. Logoff is automatic when leaving the newsreader. Mine even drops if I go and eat or spend too long writing an post. And even using yours as primary server for a.oob should be no problem until _way_ over 100 users. 100 users is only 4 per hour, so even if an average users spend 1h reading and posting, you only have 4 users at a time. Any decent server software can stand 1000 logins at a time. OK, Exchange has a bad reputation as resource hog. But I don't think it is that bad. > Please email me (or post) if you have comments. Here I have one to add: I have in my local server my entire (fairly complete, estimate >95%) a.oob downloads since begin of 1998. If you want 70000 posts from the last 3.5 years to seed your server, I will gladly send you a copy. Not quite Googles 5 years but getting close. -- Neil Franklin, neil@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng HTL/BSc, Sysadmin, Archer, Roleplayer - Intellectual Property is Intellectual Robbery ###### From: "William Bliss" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body References: <6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch> Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Lines: 133 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: <7Fpc7.7094$33.1138524@newsrump.sjc.telocity.net> X-Trace: w8HB0ryds4eGmqeBl4DSpre+vbG7pqvfoLeztregodLExtzBxtzAwcrcwMDH0tKll5be0sLK0rOH!ldLAwsLD0sDAyMfLyMHD0qK2pg== X-Abuse-Info: Please forward ALL headers when reporting abuse. X-Complaints-To: abuse@bb.directv.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2001 22:59:31 PDT Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 01:51:16 -0400 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!204.94.211.44!enews.sgi.com!telocity-west!TELOCITY!newsrump.sjc.telocity.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:70004 Hi Neil, "Neil Franklin" wrote in message news:6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch... > "William Bliss" writes: > > > usenet service -see below. I am seriously thinking of starting > > my own free public NNTP news server for just the alt.out-of-body > > group and indefinitely retaining all (non-spam) posts. > > Nice idea. I have also been thinking of doing it, but just don't have > enough time. Too many other projects. Me too! I really don't know what I'm getting myself into, that's probably why I'm considering it. :) > As for Spam, are you just counting commercial stuff (not worth the > trouble of removing, as 1..3%) or also the a.a crossposted crap (a > lot and auto-filter-able)? Auto-filtering? Yes! But I'm also considering the act of moderating the really OT posts (if the tools I have even allow for that?). This brings up lots of social/ethical questions that would need to be discussed by the users. > > 1) Are there others out there who would like a news server, > > for just a.oob, with very long retention (and possibly spam filtering)? > > My present one is OK. > > > > 3) Is there a way to connect the news server component of > > Microsoft's IIS (or Exchange) to an existing remote news > > server so that it appears to be just another news-reader? > > Hmmm. To everyone the OS he likes to use. Ok! I'm out of the OS closet. Yes! Finally! Hello! My name is William and I'm a Microsoft developer. My excuse for supporting an evil monopolistic enterprise is that I'm still rebounding from a painful commercial lesson I learned regarding the Amiga. > But have you taken in > account the problems of having an MS OS 24h online? Virii? Worms? > Break ins? Crashing after remote patching? Mostly No, to all that. My philosophy is don't put anything on a connected computer that has any value. But you put me at a moral disadvantage. If I defend myself by saying things like "my Window 2000 Server has run for a year without crashing" then you can rightfully claim that I'm promoting an evil empire. >> Currently a full usenet newsfeed absorbs about 2GB of disk > > More than 10G per day, for a full feed (with binaries and pictures > groups, AFAIK (was 6G 4 years ago, said my then ISP). I stand corrected. But don't the binaries and pictures make up the vast majority of that 10G? > > space per day. For this reason it is understandable that news > > administrators set expiration dates to (typically) a few months. > > Usually only a few weeks, in my experience. Some one else also said that to me. I must have been very lucky with my ISPs up till recently. > > My understanding is that the easiest way to get a feed is to > > find other news administrators willing to exchange feeds. But > > my own little server wouldn't have any value, in this respect, > > to other admins. > > For an 1 group server any other server (or better multiple ones, so > you get all posts) will do, using client-style download. That is how > my own local 6-group server works. > > > > I think my machine could handle 50-100 simultaneous NNTP > > logins which seems reasonable for this ng as long as people > > don't use it as their primary server and do remember to logoff. > > Logoff is automatic when leaving the newsreader. Mine even drops if I > go and eat or spend too long writing an post. > > And even using yours as primary server for a.oob should be no problem > until _way_ over 100 users. 100 users is only 4 per hour, so even if an > average users spend 1h reading and posting, you only have 4 users at a > time. > > Any decent server software can stand 1000 logins at a time. Great! That's a big relief as I was hoping to use the machine as an App server as well. > OK, > Exchange has a bad reputation as resource hog. But I don't think it is > that bad. I couldn't say, either, as I'm just now starting to hit the books on Exchange 5.5, IIS, dotnet and all the other MS diversionary propagandie. > > > Please email me (or post) if you have comments. > > Here I have one to add: I have in my local server my entire (fairly > complete, estimate >95%) a.oob downloads since begin of 1998. If you > want 70000 posts from the last 3.5 years to seed your server, I will > gladly send you a copy. Not quite Googles 5 years but getting close. That would be way cool! Except, now I need to get my act together... I may have a line on a newsfeed. I'll let you know if that works out. > -- > Neil Franklin, neil@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ > Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng HTL/BSc, Sysadmin, Archer, Roleplayer > - Intellectual Property is Intellectual Robbery Thanks Neil Wm PS: I took a look at your web site and noticed your interest in FPGA programming. I'm hoping to do some signal processing work in in that area fairly soon but I'm dreading the learning curve. By the way. How do you model the PDP's punched paper tape? :) ###### Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!not-for-mail From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Date: 09 Aug 2001 21:26:56 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 79 Message-ID: <6ur8uluj9b.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch> References: <6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch> <7Fpc7.7094$33.1138524@newsrump.sjc.telocity.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: chonsp.franklin.ch X-Trace: chonsp.franklin.ch 997385216 370 10.0.3.2 (9 Aug 2001 19:26:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@chonsp.franklin.ch NNTP-Posting-Date: 9 Aug 2001 19:26:56 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.4 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:70013 "William Bliss" writes: > "Neil Franklin" wrote in message > news:6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch... > > "William Bliss" writes: > > > > As for Spam, are you just counting commercial stuff (not worth the > > trouble of removing, as 1..3%) or also the a.a crossposted crap (a > > lot and auto-filter-able)? > > Auto-filtering? Yes! But I'm also considering the act of moderating > the really OT posts (if the tools I have even allow for that?). That one may be difficult (read: writing custon code). Usenet moderation is based on writer->(hidden)mail->moderator->post-> senet->readers. Here you are getting stuff at the usenet point and wanting to re-moderate. I doubt that will be available as pre-done code. > This > brings up lots of social/ethical questions that would need to be > discussed by the users. The traditional moderation problem. > > But have you taken in > > account the problems of having an MS OS 24h online? Virii? Worms? > > Break ins? Crashing after remote patching? > > Mostly No, to all that. My philosophy is don't put anything on a > connected computer that has any value. :-) Also a way to do it. > >> Currently a full usenet newsfeed absorbs about 2GB of disk > > > > More than 10G per day, for a full feed (with binaries and pictures > > groups, AFAIK (was 6G 4 years ago, said my then ISP). > > I stand corrected. But don't the binaries and pictures make up > the vast majority of that 10G? I have heard numbers up to 90% for them. But the rest is still an awfull lot. > > > Please email me (or post) if you have comments. > > > > Here I have one to add: I have in my local server my entire (fairly > > complete, estimate >95%) a.oob downloads since begin of 1998. If you > > want 70000 posts from the last 3.5 years to seed your server, I will > > gladly send you a copy. Not quite Googles 5 years but getting close. > > That would be way cool! > Except, now I need to get my act together... > I took a look at your web site and noticed your interest in FPGA > programming. I'm hoping to do some signal processing work in > in that area fairly soon but I'm dreading the learning curve. A bit steep. But rewarding. The cutting edge of programming. > By the way. How do you model the PDP's punched paper tape? :) Not implemented yet, but intend to masquerade an RS232 line as an paper tape reader. -- Neil Franklin, neil@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng HTL/BSc, Sysadmin, Archer, Roleplayer - Intellectual Property is Intellectual Robbery ###### From: "The Original Ken" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body References: <6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch> Subject: Re: OT: Help starting a high retention news server for alt.oob Lines: 20 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Message-ID: <9c0e7.97$mr3.3005@wormhole.dimensional.com> Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2001 20:42:02 -0600 NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.241.33.29 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 997756805 216.241.33.29 (Mon, 13 Aug 2001 20:40:05 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2001 20:40:05 MDT Organization: Interlink Advertising Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news-out.visi.com!hermes.visi.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:70137 Neil Franklin wrote in message news:6ug0b2e0q9.fsf@chonsp.franklin.ch... > > Here I have one to add: I have in my local server my entire (fairly > complete, estimate >95%) a.oob downloads since begin of 1998. If you > want 70000 posts from the last 3.5 years to seed your server, I will > gladly send you a copy. Not quite Googles 5 years but getting close. > Wow, that's impressive. Good job! This may come in handy some day. Ken > > -- > Neil Franklin, neil@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ > Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng HTL/BSc, Sysadmin, Archer, Roleplayer > - Intellectual Property is Intellectual Robbery