From: "Dreamtime" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Intrigued.... Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 21:25:44 +0100 Organization: Customer of Energis Squared Lines: 28 Message-ID: <8pjf77$6n5$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: modem-895.pigeon.dialup.pol.co.uk X-Trace: newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk 968704039 6885 62.137.119.127 (11 Sep 2000 20:27:19 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Sep 2000 20:27:19 GMT X-Complaints-To: abuse@theplanet.net X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!RRZ.Uni-Koeln.DE!news.netcologne.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!blackbush.xlink.net!uni-erlangen.de!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!newsfeed.icl.net!ldn-newsfeed.speedport.net!newsfeed.speedport.net!diablo.theplanet.net!news.theplanet.net!newspost.theplanet.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:50676 Hello, I am relatively new to the newsgroup and so I may be slightly behind. I keep reading the posts by skeptics (and it is good to have the other views) and I am intrigued as to whether any of them have studied modern physics, especially quantum physics, which has already revolutionised our view of the brain (and the non-local self - the astral body?) with uncanny links to Eastern thought. Many top scientists have already produced incredible insights. It is not so hard to see why there is so much excitement. Sub-atomic physics has shown the atomic level to defy current 'rational' modes of thinking and calls (heralds?) a new holistic view of the universe. Of the many experiements conducted in particle accelerators we seem to find atoms thats defy the laws that were supposedly so rigid in the newtonian view of the universe. Information appears to travel much faster than the speed of light, atoms can be in more than one place at one time, time takes on a more and more paradox like quality (only a paradox to our current conception - no time or one time is accepted in almost all mystical circles - for a good scientific rationalisation I recommend Ouspenskys Tertium Organum for a start), and the viewer seems to take an active role in the creation of the outside world (that is really modern psychologies view also). This are just a few among the insights. Seeing as the all important brain is made of atoms like everything else, isn't it time to maybe consider that some of this apparent mumbo-jumbo may actually be just as sensible and even more scientifically based than our now outdated newtonian conceptions? Ron. ###### From: "Dark Sage" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: Intrigued.... Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 17:49:03 -0400 Lines: 45 Message-ID: <8pjk81$ejo$1@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <8pjf77$6n5$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk> X-Trace: Hfn0YWG2LvZgTEyj7h5TThMJXZ5ss8AHtQu64PP/qtw= X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Sep 2000 21:53:05 GMT X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news.uni-stuttgart.de!uni-erlangen.de!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!xfer13.netnews.com!netnews.com!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:50657 Quantum Physicis?!?! quantum entanglement, EPR experiment, Copenhagen interpretation, coherence/decoherence, probabilities and Bell's theorem, and at last the poor health of Schrodinger's cat.... what is that stuff! ;) The scientific methods strength is also its weakness; 1) it must be observable, 2)it must be repeatable to believe what we observe 'today' constitutes all possibilities seems a little narrow minded. After all two VERY WELL proven theories Theory of Relativity and Quantum Theory are at odds against each other, yet both have been proved ad eundem gradum(to the same degree). Enter Brain Greene and 'superstring' theory, of course; that theory has been around for >20yrs and is continually 'revamped'. It's been theorized; for superstring theory to exist, it will require perhaps an additional 8 forces (opposed to the current 4, or 3(electro-weak force @ certain energy levels)) to support superstring theory. My take: We're still in the infancy of our understanding. As our ability to 'observe' improves, so will our understanding. Albert (ya know) declare in 1917 that he couldn't image the atom ever being split, Ernest Ruthford didn't listen to him; even he (Albert) had the special and general theory of relativity to his name. 2 years later, Ernest split the atom. Perhaps as a more direct answer: It seems we still don't understand how the behavior of sub-atomic particle (as they flicker in and out of existence) support the behavior of materials they compose. Say, which newsgroup am I on...... ;) Comments welcome. :) ###### From: hawksmoor@dial.pipex.com (Julia Hawkes-Moore) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: Intrigued.... Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 22:24:42 GMT Organization: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views of UUNET WorldCom Lines: 15 Message-ID: <39bd5acd.22868408@news.dial.pipex.com> References: <8pjf77$6n5$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk> Reply-To: hawksmoor@dial.pipex.com NNTP-Posting-Host: useraj72.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: lure.pipex.net 968711912 1720 62.188.133.201 (11 Sep 2000 22:38:32 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Sep 2000 22:38:32 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!RRZ.Uni-Koeln.DE!news.netcologne.de!fr.clara.net!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!ldn-newsfeed.speedport.net!newsfeed.speedport.net!newsfeed.icl.net!join.news.pipex.net!pipex!grot.news.pipex.net!pipex!tube.news.pipex.net!pipex!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:50694 On Mon, 11 Sep 2000 21:25:44 +0100, "Dreamtime" wrote: > Seeing as the all important >brain is made of atoms like everything else, isn't it time to maybe consider >that some of this apparent mumbo-jumbo may actually be just as sensible and >even more scientifically based than our now outdated newtonian conceptions? > >Ron. Welcome , Ron. Once the validity of this is recognised by the individual, time and space have no limitations. We can travel out-of-body, converse with the living and the dead, and heal both. Control the atoms of your own brain, and the infinite is open to you in all her opulent variety. Love from Julia ###### From: hawksmoor@dial.pipex.com (Julia Hawkes-Moore) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: Intrigued.... Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 22:32:00 GMT Organization: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views of UUNET WorldCom Lines: 35 Message-ID: <39bd5bbd.23107441@news.dial.pipex.com> References: <8pjf77$6n5$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk> <8pjk81$ejo$1@bob.news.rcn.net> Reply-To: hawksmoor@dial.pipex.com NNTP-Posting-Host: userbq35.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: lure.pipex.net 968712349 2016 62.188.146.129 (11 Sep 2000 22:45:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Sep 2000 22:45:49 GMT X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/16.230 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news.uni-stuttgart.de!rz.uni-karlsruhe.de!schlund.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!tube.news.pipex.net!pipex!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.out-of-body:50693 On Mon, 11 Sep 2000 17:49:03 -0400, "Dark Sage" wrote: snipped >Comments welcome. :) Sheer poetry. Flirting with Eternity Flirting with eternity, Tangled up in Mobius strips, Made me begin to consider reaching for your hips. Flirting with eternity, And early Christian heresies, made my moral enlightenment Develop fantasies. Flirting with eternity, And the Folk-influence of Brahms Helped me to transubstantiate Across the room into your arms. Flirting with eternity, And the Nietzchian nemesis Helped me to conceptualise The texture of your kiss. Flirting with eternity, And the universe inside your head Reminds me - the one place I don't philosophise Is bed. Love from Julia.