Message-ID: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> From: The Original Ken Reply-To: sculpt@privatei.com Organization: fractal in nature X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: No way to get home Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 121 Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 10:22:40 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.131.176.177 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 944328277 204.131.176.177 (Sat, 04 Dec 1999 10:24:37 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 10:24:37 MDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.datacomm.ch!newscore.gigabell.net!news0.de.colt.net!colt.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!pulsar.dimensional.com!dimensional.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it with you. (from my journal) December 3, 1999 2:00am-3:25am This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 hour and 25 minutes. One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to another dimension. In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about 10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the 50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected from my body I couldn't even do that. At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very disturbing scene. This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or drugged when I went to bed. I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me wonder a little. Ken ###### From: "Jerry Adams" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 12:52:33 -0800 Lines: 142 Message-ID: <82bpui$3fd$1@news.laserlink.net> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust5.tnt29.dfw5.da.uu.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!skynet.be!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!uunet!zur.uu.net!ffx.uu.net!news.laserlink.net!not-for-mail One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was seated in a chair. My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I don't know for sure. The Original Ken wrote in message <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com>... >I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it >with you. > >(from my journal) > >December 3, 1999 >2:00am-3:25am > >This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I >should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the >internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human >soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. > >I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken >place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that >when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made >me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the >vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't >remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. >What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from >universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles >and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 >hour and 25 minutes. > >One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high >rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like >glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of >crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My >destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard >through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view >the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the >branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. >She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head >through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I >enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to >another dimension. > >In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with >a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags >and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about >him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by >surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my >hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase >him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but >I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The >first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene >I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the >air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. > >Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about >10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away >and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to >get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was >prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back >through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but >always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting >frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. > >One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street >from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the >50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls >that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar >area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some >traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. > >I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting >frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I >had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during >an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my >physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected >from my body I couldn't even do that. > >At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of >whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some >birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and >knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet >since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the >eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became >visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that >can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She >looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the >direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with >a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could >help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch >folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't >know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. >Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a >surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very >disturbing scene. > >This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the >trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to >help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of >bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit >and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the >rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I >tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy >and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or >drugged when I went to bed. > >I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the >grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for >real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a >stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. >Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to >that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which >is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted >bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by >this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very >well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a >comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked >that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just >said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That >would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. >I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me >wonder a little. > >Ken > > > ###### From: "carolisle" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 20:31:20 -0000 Lines: 135 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Message-ID: <384ad410_2@news2.vip.uk.com> X-Report: Report abuse to abuse@vip.uk.com X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.176.194.174 NNTP-Posting-Host: 10.250.101.2 X-Trace: 5 Dec 1999 21:07:31 GMT, 10.250.101.2 X-Report: Report abuse to abuse@vip.uk.com Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newspeer.te.net!news.indigo.ie!diablo.theplanet.net!diablo2!newsfeed.icl.net!iclnet!news1.vip.uk.com!10.250.101.2 The Original Ken wrote in message news:38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com... > I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it > with you. > > (from my journal) > > December 3, 1999 > 2:00am-3:25am > > This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I > should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the > internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human > soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. > > I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken > place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that > when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made > me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the > vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't > remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. > What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from > universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles > and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 > hour and 25 minutes. > > One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high > rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like > glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of > crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My > destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard > through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view > the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the > branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. > She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head > through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I > enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to > another dimension. > > In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with > a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags > and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about > him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by > surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my > hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase > him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but > I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The > first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene > I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the > air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. > > Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about > 10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away > and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to > get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was > prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back > through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but > always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting > frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. > > One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street > from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the > 50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls > that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar > area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some > traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. > > I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting > frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I > had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during > an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my > physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected > from my body I couldn't even do that. > > At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of > whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some > birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and > knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet > since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the > eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became > visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that > can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She > looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the > direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with > a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could > help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch > folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't > know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. > Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a > surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very > disturbing scene. > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > drugged when I went to bed. > > I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the > grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for > real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a > stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. > Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to > that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which > is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted > bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by > this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very > well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a > comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked > that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just > said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That > would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. > I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me > wonder a little. > > Ken > Hi Ken, Wow! What a trip . . . and to think I moan I can't get out of my bedroom (that'll teach me not to whinge.) Wonderful adventure but would have scared the living daylights out of me if I couldn't get back. I wonder if it helps bring you back if you think hard about somebody you love? I don't expect it will put you off - let's face it, white water rafting would seem tame after that. Love carol ###### From: John Fitzsimons Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 11:14:34 +1100 Organization: Optus Internet Lines: 43 Message-ID: References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <82bpui$3fd$1@news.laserlink.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: mdcax43-150.dialup.optusnet.com.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news1.mpx.com.au 944575241 15542 198.142.162.150 (7 Dec 1999 14:00:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@mpx.com.au NNTP-Posting-Date: 7 Dec 1999 14:00:41 GMT X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/1.3.8.0 X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.7/32.534 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!feed2.news.luth.se!luth.se!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!news-feed1.tiac.net!howland.erols.net!newspeer.monmouth.com!intgwpad.nntp.telstra.net!news1.optus.net.au!optus!news.mpx.com.au!not-for-mail On Sat, 4 Dec 1999 12:52:33 -0800, "Jerry Adams" wrote: >One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in >common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird >thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. >These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of >the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them >prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came >to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my >imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first >try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I >concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" >gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was >seated in a chair. >My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. >I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily >encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I >don't know for sure. < snip > You can create a mental gate. Others can create a mental gate. Sometimes such "gates" occupy the same space i.e. interpenetrate. The ability to travel through any mental construct is dependant on who created it in the first place. Not all constructs (thought-forms) have the same degree of solidity. Some people's mind's are stronger than others and/or they spend more time in creating. Fortunately, even strong "negative" thought-forms will start melting if a hot, bright, light is directed at them. A handy thing to remember if ever faced with walls/barriers when travelling. Regards, John. -- **************************************************** ,-._|\ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia. / Oz \ johnf@melbpc.org.au, Fidonet 3:633/309 \_,--.x/ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm v http://www.alphalink.com.au/~johnf/ ###### Message-ID: <3851CA51.CEBB8C68@privatei.com> From: The Original Ken Reply-To: sculpt@privatei.com Organization: fractal in nature X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <82s4km$qmi$3@supernews.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 187 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 20:51:45 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.131.176.200 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 944884447 204.131.176.200 (Fri, 10 Dec 1999 20:54:07 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 20:54:07 MDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!pulsar.dimensional.com!dimensional.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail Carol White wrote: > Hi Ken, Hi Carol, > Wow! What a trip . . . and to think I moan I can't get out of my bedroom > (that'll teach me not to whinge.) I don't know how many OBEs you have had, but one thing I've noticed is that as a person becomes more experienced with OBE then spending time in one's bedroom decreases. I'm only guessing here but I suspect that there is something about this whole thing that follows a natural progression. When one is just starting out, the bedroom is the first (and last) place that a person visits. This may be nothing more than a kind of initiation where the bedroom is the first step so the OBEer doesn't get too disoriented and can move around in an environment that they feel comfortable in (and because it's easier to get back). Or maybe it's the only plane that is accessable until skills are developed. It's tough to say. But from the posts I've read and from my own experience it seems that the bedroom is the first place that a newcomer to the OBE plane experiences. As skills develop, once you separate, you find yourself moving on very very quickly and as it stands with me it's next to impossible to spend any time in my bedroom or my immediate environment for more than the time it takes to get out and then zoom......But don't wince about this. There is a lot to do in the bedroom. There is a lot of exploring to do with looking at your surroundings and developing an appreciation for your new astral senses. It won't take long for you to move on. Here's a tip. Once you find yourself out, take extra care to get involved with your room. Pay extra attention to what you are seeing, feeling, smelling, and touching (touching as opposed to passive feeling). It's important to develop these skill, because you need them as you move on. I'm thinking about posting more about how to stay out longer since I seem to be pretty good at it, but I have to think about it some more so I don't accidently mislead anyone with bad advice. > Wonderful adventure but would have scared > the living daylights out of me if I couldn't get back. I wonder if it helps > bring you back if you think hard about somebody you love? I wouldn't know. I seem to be pretty bad at developing relationships and even though I fall in love a lot, sometimes when I OBE I just prefer to let my feelings toward people I love fall by the wayside and instead I just focus on developing my skills at being in the astral. I like developing relationships with people I meet on the astral and when I'm there, that's all that matters and all I think about. It's sort of my resting time from waking reality and I prefer to explore who I'm with and what I'm doing, rather than spending time thinking about my other (waking) reality. But thanks for the idea. If I find myself in that situation again, I think it would be a really good idea to try your suggestion (assuming I'm in love at the time) to get me back. > I don't expect it will put you off - let's face it, white water rafting > would seem tame after that. I've done white water rafting (Colorado you know) and yep, this was much more intense. Ken > Love carol > > The Original Ken wrote in message > news:38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com... > > I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it > > with you. > > > > (from my journal) > > > > December 3, 1999 > > 2:00am-3:25am > > > > This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I > > should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the > > internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human > > soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. > > > > I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken > > place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that > > when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made > > me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the > > vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't > > remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. > > What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from > > universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles > > and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 > > hour and 25 minutes. > > > > One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high > > rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like > > glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of > > crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My > > destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard > > through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view > > the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the > > branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. > > She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head > > through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I > > enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to > > another dimension. > > > > In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with > > a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags > > and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about > > him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by > > surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my > > hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase > > him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but > > I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The > > first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene > > I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the > > air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. > > > > Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about > > 10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away > > and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to > > get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was > > prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back > > through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but > > always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting > > frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. > > > > One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street > > from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the > > 50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls > > that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar > > area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some > > traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. > > > > I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting > > frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I > > had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during > > an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my > > physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected > > from my body I couldn't even do that. > > > > At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of > > whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some > > birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and > > knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet > > since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the > > eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became > > visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that > > can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She > > looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the > > direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with > > a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could > > help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch > > folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't > > know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. > > Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a > > surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very > > disturbing scene. > > > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > > drugged when I went to bed. > > > > I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the > > grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for > > real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a > > stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. > > Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to > > that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which > > is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted > > bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by > > this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very > > well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a > > comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked > > that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just > > said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That > > would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. > > I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me > > wonder a little. > > > > Ken > > > > > > ###### Message-ID: <3851CE0D.D8A6B617@privatei.com> From: The Original Ken Reply-To: sculpt@privatei.com Organization: fractal in nature X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 66 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:07:41 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.131.176.200 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 944885401 204.131.176.200 (Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:10:01 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:10:01 MDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newshunter!cosy.sbg.ac.at!newsfeed.Austria.EU.net!peerbox.kpnqwest.net!EU.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail John Garrison wrote: > The Original Ken wrote: > > > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > > drugged when I went to bed. > > > > Ken > > I can relate to this part. I have woken up before in the middle of the > night and went to get up then just sorta fell limp to the floor with the > room kinda spinning alittle, Like I had had way to much to drink, but > yet was still sober and thinking clearly. I usually try to drag myself > to the door, sometimes I try to get up and stumble to the door, but I > always snap back to reality before I get to the door. > It was this occurance that first got me interested in OBE. Hi John, You have a tricky name, almost clicked you off before I realized my mistake. :) I had another OBE yesterday that was short but very wierd that relates to this. I was lying on the right side of my bed face down with my head turned toward the right. I went OBE from that position (consciousness shift, not movement) and as soon as it happened something got into bed beside me (the left side of the bed). I could feel the bed move and the blankets rustle and there was definitely someone there. I was in sleep paralysis and couldn't move my head to see and I wasn't separating so I couldn't move my astral head so I was stuck. I didn't like the idea of not being able to see who or what was there and I was freaking out. Mostly because this has never happened to me before. Usually entities leave me well enough alone until I'm out and cruising around (I'm lucky that way) so this was a first and unexpected. Anyway, I had no choice but to move my physical head, which of course broke the shift in consiousness and of course once I turned my head there was nothing to see. I had chills. I was tempted to do more OBEing since I was at that place where I could do so but I opted against it because of my unfamiliarity with this new experience. I didn't want to go OBE and find some savage beast next to me (of couse it could have turned out to be a warm and wonderful woman but I didn't have a coin to flip). I know this goes against everything I practice. I always refuse to let fear get the better of me when projecting. But this one was just a little too close to home and I just felt that I should let it go till another time lest I slide into somekind of new fear mode that might set me back. Sometimes it's easy to say "yea so what" when you are distanced from it, but while it's happening, your common sense gets the better of you. I think I made the right decision, but still, I'm disappointed in myself for having let this situation get the better of me. Ken > > > -- > http://www.scinomaly.org : Science outside the norm. ###### Message-ID: <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> From: The Original Ken Reply-To: sculpt@privatei.com Organization: fractal in nature X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 8 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:09:33 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.131.176.200 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 944885513 204.131.176.200 (Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:11:53 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 21:11:53 MDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newshunter!cosy.sbg.ac.at!newsfeed.Austria.EU.net!peerbox.kpnqwest.net!blackbush.xlink.net!unlisys!news.snafu.de!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!pulsar.dimensional.com!dimensional.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail Jerry, I wanted to reply to your post here but my reader expired before I could answer. If you have a record of it, could you post your reply again. I remember I wanted to respond, but I don't remember what it was that I wanted to respond to. Thanks. Ken ###### From: "Carol White" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 00:01:46 -0000 Organization: RemarQ http://www.remarQ.com Lines: 259 Message-ID: <82s4km$qmi$3@supernews.com> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.140.3.223 X-Trace: 944870870 LGTBT6QCL03DFD48CC uk26.supernews.com X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@remarq.com X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!feed2.news.luth.se!luth.se!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!remarQ70!rQdQ!supernews.com!remarQ.com!remarQ69!not-for-mail The Original Ken wrote in message news:38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com... > I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it > with you. > > (from my journal) > > December 3, 1999 > 2:00am-3:25am > > This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I > should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the > internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human > soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. > > I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken > place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that > when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made > me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the > vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't > remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. > What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from > universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles > and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 > hour and 25 minutes. > > One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high > rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like > glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of > crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My > destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard > through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view > the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the > branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. > She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head > through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I > enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to > another dimension. > > In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with > a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags > and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about > him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by > surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my > hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase > him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but > I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The > first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene > I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the > air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. > > Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about > 10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away > and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to > get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was > prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back > through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but > always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting > frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. > > One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street > from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the > 50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls > that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar > area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some > traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. > > I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting > frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I > had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during > an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my > physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected > from my body I couldn't even do that. > > At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of > whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some > birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and > knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet > since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the > eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became > visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that > can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She > looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the > direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with > a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could > help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch > folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't > know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. > Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a > surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very > disturbing scene. > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > drugged when I went to bed. > > I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the > grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for > real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a > stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. > Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to > that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which > is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted > bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by > this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very > well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a > comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked > that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just > said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That > would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. > I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me > wonder a little. > > Ken > Hi Ken, Wow! What a trip . . . and to think I moan I can't get out of my bedroom (that'll teach me not to whinge.) Wonderful adventure but would have scared the living daylights out of me if I couldn't get back. I wonder if it helps bring you back if you think hard about somebody you love? I don't expect it will put you off - let's face it, white water rafting would seem tame after that. Love carol The Original Ken wrote in message news:38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com... > I had an OBE last night the really flipped me out. Thought I'd share it > with you. > > (from my journal) > > December 3, 1999 > 2:00am-3:25am > > This certainly was one of the most disturbing OBEs I have ever had. I > should preface by saying that I had just spent the entire evening on the > internet in alt.out-of-body discussing my philosophies about the human > soul. This may or may not have contributed to having this OBE. > > I actually had a very short OBE just before 2:00 but it may have taken > place from within a dream. I don't remember much about it except that > when I awoke I could remember the feeling of the vibrations and it made > me wonder if I could have another. Well another I did. I struck up the > vibrations almost as soon as I had closed my eyes again. I don't > remember exiting, but there was a lot about this OBE I don't remember. > What I do remember is traveling a lot, a whole lot. I was going from > universe to universe, sometimes traveling hundreds, thousands of miles > and perhaps more to get to my destinations. The time out lasted about 1 > hour and 25 minutes. > > One of the excursions I remember was when I was traveling at a very high > rate of speed and suddenly found myself passing through what seemed like > glittering streamers hanging in the air as if passing through a web of > crystals. It was a stunning sight at such a high speed. My > destination was some middle aged ladies view of a beautiful backyard > through a picture window. We gazed through the window together to view > the large oak/maple trees with a fine mist weaving it's way through the > branches. It almost looked as if it was painted it was so beautiful. > She asked me if I liked the view and I said yes. I poked my head > through the window but the perspective of the view was spoiled so I > enjoyed it once again from behind it. I left and went whizzing off to > another dimension. > > In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with > a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags > and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about > him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by > surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my > hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase > him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but > I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The > first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene > I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the > air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. > > Like I said, I visited a number of dimensions and after seeing about > 10-15 or so, I grew weary and a little nervous that I was so far away > and didn't really have a perception of where I was or how I was going to > get back, but decided that making an effort to return to my body was > prudent. Well to say the least it was difficult. I traveled back > through what seemed like familiar paths home, (intuition wise), but > always just ended up in one more dimension. Finally I was getting > frantic and made a supreme effort to get back. > > One scene that I went through was a familiar scene just up the street > from where I live and there was a parade going on. The era was in the > 50s and the town looked a little different with some murals on walls > that don't have murals. I knew that even though I was in a familiar > area, I was certainly not in a familiar time and still had some > traveling to do to get back to where I needed to be. > > I continued to travel through more dimensions and was really getting > frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I > had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during > an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my > physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected > from my body I couldn't even do that. > > At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of > whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some > birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and > knowledgeable person. I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet > since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the > eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became > visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that > can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She > looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the > direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with > a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could > help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch > folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't > know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. > Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a > surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very > disturbing scene. > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > drugged when I went to bed. > > I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the > grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for > real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a > stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. > Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to > that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which > is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted > bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by > this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very > well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a > comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked > that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just > said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That > would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. > I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me > wonder a little. > > Ken > > > ###### Message-ID: <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> From: John Garrison X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 30 Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 01:44:03 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp37.ts3-2.newportnews.visi.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 20:44:03 EST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-fra.pop.de!newsfeed.direct.ca!newsxfer.visi.net!firenze.visi.net!not-for-mail The Original Ken wrote: > > This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the > trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to > help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of > bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit > and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the > rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I > tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy > and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or > drugged when I went to bed. > > Ken I can relate to this part. I have woken up before in the middle of the night and went to get up then just sorta fell limp to the floor with the room kinda spinning alittle, Like I had had way to much to drink, but yet was still sober and thinking clearly. I usually try to drag myself to the door, sometimes I try to get up and stumble to the door, but I always snap back to reality before I get to the door. It was this occurance that first got me interested in OBE. -- http://www.scinomaly.org : Science outside the norm. ###### From: "Jerry Adams" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 02:59:17 -0800 Lines: 32 Message-ID: <82t4c4$n1c$1@news.laserlink.net> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust72.tnt10.dfw5.da.uu.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newspeer.te.net!news.indigo.ie!news-out.cwix.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!europa.netcrusader.net!192.148.253.68!netnews.com!newsfeed1.nyc1.globix.net!uunet!nyc.uu.net!ffx.uu.net!news.laserlink.net!not-for-mail OK. Here it is. It is not a true OOBE experience but it is a related technique with a similar incident: One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was seated in a chair. My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I don't know for sure. The Original Ken wrote in message <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com>... >Jerry, I wanted to reply to your post here but my reader expired before >I could answer. If you have a record of it, could you post your reply >again. I remember I wanted to respond, but I don't remember what it was >that I wanted to respond to. >Thanks. > >Ken > ###### Message-ID: <3852881C.1040FF0E@privatei.com> From: The Original Ken Reply-To: sculpt@privatei.com Organization: fractal in nature X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> <82t4c4$n1c$1@news.laserlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 41 Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 10:21:32 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.131.176.164 X-Trace: wormhole.dimensional.com 944933073 204.131.176.164 (Sat, 11 Dec 1999 10:24:33 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 10:24:33 MDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!feed2.news.luth.se!luth.se!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!pulsar.dimensional.com!dimensional.com!wormhole.dimensional.com!not-for-mail Ah yes, I wanted to say that I guess I may have done pathworking and not known it. I had a hypnogogic image once that for the first time I was actually able to explore rather than just look at. It started out as a big steel industrial doorway going into a hallway. Normally I would just be able to examine the doorway from where I was and not be able to get nearer to it or move around it. But this one time I was able to actually move my awareness toward the door and down the hallway. It was so much fun! It wasn't an OBE, it was probably more like RV. I knew I was still in bed and could feel my center of awareness still being in the bed with me (in other words I wasn't separated), but I was still able to see down this hallway and move around the corner to another door and so on, guiding myself to wherever I wanted to go. Quite a thrilling experience. Does this sound like pathworking to you? Ken Jerry Adams wrote: > OK. Here it is. It is not a true OOBE experience but it is a related > technique with a similar incident: > > One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in > common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird > thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. > These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of > the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them > prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came > to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my > imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first > try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I > concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" > gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was > seated in a chair. > > My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. > I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily > encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I > don't know for sure. > ###### From: Haunter@castles.com (Haunter) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 11:11:41 GMT Organization: AlteredState Imaging/Psi App/WCS Lines: 45 Message-ID: <385430b6.627155009@cnews.newsguy.com> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> <82t4c4$n1c$1@news.laserlink.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-427.newsdawg.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!skynet.be!newsfeed.stanford.edu!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!enews.sgi.com!pln-w!spln!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews3 Mornin' Jerry/Ken: I would agree with your assessment, Jerry. In my own travels, I found that obsticles like that were self-generated and were created in order to go beyond that barrier and reach your next step of advancement. Obviously, it is a subconscious creation, but once you've been through the process a number of times, you learn to recognize it for what it is...yourself testing yourself....go with it and learn from it, is my advice. Haunter On Sat, 11 Dec 1999 02:59:17 -0800, "Jerry Adams" wrote: >OK. Here it is. It is not a true OOBE experience but it is a related >technique with a similar incident: > >One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in >common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird >thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. >These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of >the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them >prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came >to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my >imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first >try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I >concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" >gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was >seated in a chair. > >My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. >I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily >encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I >don't know for sure. > >The Original Ken wrote in message <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com>... >>Jerry, I wanted to reply to your post here but my reader expired before >>I could answer. If you have a record of it, could you post your reply >>again. I remember I wanted to respond, but I don't remember what it was >>that I wanted to respond to. >>Thanks. >> >>Ken >> > ###### Message-ID: <385242B0.23ED391C@visi.net> From: John Garrison X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.12-20 i586) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE0D.D8A6B617@privatei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 62 Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 12:24:10 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp37.ts3-2.newportnews.visi.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 07:24:10 EST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!howland.erols.net!netnews.com!newsswitch.lcs.mit.edu!newsxfer.visi.net!firenze.visi.net!not-for-mail The Original Ken wrote: > Hi John, > > You have a tricky name, almost clicked you off before I realized my mistake. > :) Yeah, when I first returned to the group and saw the subject "to garrison" I thought people were talking to me, it was quite confusing. :) > > I had another OBE yesterday that was short but very wierd that relates to > this. I was lying on the right side of my bed face down with my head turned > toward the right. I went OBE from that position (consciousness shift, not > movement) and as soon as it happened something got into bed beside me (the > left side of the bed). I could feel the bed move and the blankets rustle and > there was definitely someone there. I was in sleep paralysis and couldn't > move my head to see and I wasn't separating so I couldn't move my astral head > so I was stuck. I didn't like the idea of not being able to see who or what > was there and I was freaking out. Mostly because this has never happened to > me before. Usually entities leave me well enough alone until I'm out and > cruising around (I'm lucky that way) so this was a first and unexpected. > Anyway, I had no choice but to move my physical head, which of course broke > the shift in consiousness and of course once I turned my head there was > nothing to see. I had chills. I was tempted to do more OBEing since I was at > that place where I could do so but I opted against it because of my > unfamiliarity with this new experience. I didn't want to go OBE and find some > savage beast next to me (of couse it could have turned out to be a warm and > wonderful woman but I didn't have a coin to flip). I know this goes against > everything I practice. I always refuse to let fear get the better of me when > projecting. But this one was just a little too close to home and I just felt > that I should let it go till another time lest I slide into somekind of new > fear mode that might set me back. Sometimes it's easy to say "yea so what" > when you are distanced from it, but while it's happening, your common sense > gets the better of you. I think I made the right decision, but still, I'm > disappointed in myself for having let this situation get the better of me. > Don't feel too bad, everytime I try to intentionaly project something scares me back in. I am a big coward when it comes to this stuff. :) > Ken > -- http://www.scinomaly.org : Science outside the norm. ###### From: "Jerry Adams" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 12:34:07 -0800 Lines: 55 Message-ID: <82u6ud$br8$1@news.laserlink.net> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> <82t4c4$n1c$1@news.laserlink.net> <385430b6.627155009@cnews.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust105.tnt10.dfw5.da.uu.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!peerbox.kpnqwest.net!blackbush.xlink.net!noris.net!newsfeed.tli.de!news-fra.pop.de!uunet!ams.uu.net!uunet!zur.uu.net!ffx.uu.net!news.laserlink.net!not-for-mail Oops! I misread your post. Seems I just woke up. ;) Haunter wrote in message <385430b6.627155009@cnews.newsguy.com>... >Mornin' Jerry/Ken: >I would agree with your assessment, Jerry. In my own travels, I found >that obsticles like that were self-generated and were created in order >to go beyond that barrier and reach your next step of advancement. >Obviously, it is a subconscious creation, but once you've been through >the process a number of times, you learn to recognize it for what it >is...yourself testing yourself....go with it and learn from it, is my >advice. >Haunter > >On Sat, 11 Dec 1999 02:59:17 -0800, "Jerry Adams" >wrote: > >>OK. Here it is. It is not a true OOBE experience but it is a related >>technique with a similar incident: >> >>One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in >>common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird >>thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. >>These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of >>the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them >>prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came >>to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my >>imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first >>try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I >>concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" >>gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was >>seated in a chair. >> >>My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. >>I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily >>encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I >>don't know for sure. >> >>The Original Ken wrote in message <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com>... >>>Jerry, I wanted to reply to your post here but my reader expired before >>>I could answer. If you have a record of it, could you post your reply >>>again. I remember I wanted to respond, but I don't remember what it was >>>that I wanted to respond to. >>>Thanks. >>> >>>Ken >>> >> > ###### From: "Jerry Adams" Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 14:46:12 -0800 Lines: 78 Message-ID: <82ueso$hml$1@news.laserlink.net> References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> <3851ACA6.22B339E6@visi.net> <3851CE7D.282DEAFD@privatei.com> <82t4c4$n1c$1@news.laserlink.net> <3852881C.1040FF0E@privatei.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 1cust101.tnt10.dfw5.da.uu.net X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!uunet!ams.uu.net!ffx.uu.net!news.laserlink.net!not-for-mail In many ways it does. For example, the gate I mentioned is usually visualized as a door. You saw a steel door. In pathworking the operator imagines or formulates a "body" or just his awareness traveling towards the door and then through it. The terrain beyond the door is some times imagined as a hallway. For a cabalistic pathworking an astral temple is formulated with the exits hidden behind curtains which have symbols of the paths beyond. The paths themselves are imagined populated with things pertaining symbolically to the path and later to the destination sphere or realm. Along the way are branching paths often with other doors or gates, like in your experience. Jungian psychologists and magicians believe that this realm is shared in common between all sentient life. It is possible that you accidentally tapped into this level of consciousness. Normally it is a conscious effort to do so. It is used for self analysis and altering personal patterns, and acts of personal alchemy or magick. The Original Ken wrote in message <3852881C.1040FF0E@privatei.com>... >Ah yes, I wanted to say that I guess I may have done pathworking and not known >it. I had a hypnogogic image once that for the first time I was actually able >to explore rather than just look at. It started out as a big steel industrial >doorway going into a hallway. Normally I would just be able to examine the >doorway from where I was and not be able to get nearer to it or move around it. >But this one time I was able to actually move my awareness toward the door and >down the hallway. It was so much fun! It wasn't an OBE, it was probably more >like RV. I knew I was still in bed and could feel my center of awareness still >being in the bed with me (in other words I wasn't separated), but I was still >able to see down this hallway and move around the corner to another door and so >on, guiding myself to wherever I wanted to go. Quite a thrilling experience. >Does this sound like pathworking to you? > >Ken > >Jerry Adams wrote: > >> OK. Here it is. It is not a true OOBE experience but it is a related >> technique with a similar incident: >> >> One time I was using a technique called pathworking. It has some things in >> common with OOBE but is mostly guided visualization or imagination. Weird >> thing is that uninvited elements begin popping up to complicate the works. >> These are regarded to be symbolic of things going on in the deeper levels of >> the mind by magicians and by psychologists (of some schools). One of them >> prevented me from getting to my mental goal and I "fled" back the way I came >> to my imaginary gate. It was my "gate", meaning I created it in my >> imagination and was thus it's sole operator and custodian. Well, on my first >> try to get through "my" gate, I slammed into an invisible "wall". I >> concentrated and regathered myself and on my second attempt got through "my" >> gate and reunited my mentally constructed body to my actual body which was >> seated in a chair. >> >> My point is I tried to get "home" and could not, at least on the first try. >> I have no Idea why, but I expect that all such journeys may temporarily >> encounter such a problem. I think that it is temporary and harmless, but I >> don't know for sure. >> > > > ###### X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/1.3.8.0 From: John Fitzsimons Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: No way to get home Message-ID: References: <38494DE0.4900D1C4@privatei.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.7/32.534 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 116 Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 11:53:34 +1100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.26.98.7 X-Complaints-To: abuse@telstra.net X-Trace: nsw.nnrp.telstra.net 945219229 203.26.98.7 (Wed, 15 Dec 1999 11:53:49 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 11:53:49 EST Organization: Customer of Telstra Big Pond Direct Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newshunter!cosy.sbg.ac.at!newsfeed.Austria.EU.net!newscore.univie.ac.at!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!intgwpad.nntp.telstra.net!nsw.nnrp.telstra.net!not-for-mail On Sat, 04 Dec 1999 10:22:40 -0700, The Original Ken wrote: < snip > >In another dimension was a recurring figure. A man sized creature with >a half burned off face exposing his skull. He was dressed in torn rags >and looked nasty as heck. Once I saw him I remembered something about >him. What I remembered was the fact that if I were to capture him by >surprise then he could be captured, but if he saw me first, then my >hands would just pass right through him and I would be unable to chase >him away. I knew this about him from a previous encounter with him, but >I don't remember when the encounter was, it was only a memory. The >first few times, he saw me first and he mocked me, but in another scene >I was able to surprise him and I grabbed him and tossed him through the >air but he was un-alive on contact, rather like a doll. Possibly a thought-form. < snip > >frustrated about my inability to get back to my body. Later, after I >had awoken I was curious as to why I was unable to do what I did during >an earlier OBE where I was on another planet and simply moved my >physical finger remotely to get back, but it seems I was so disconnected >from my body I couldn't even do that. In this sort of situation you could consider thinking of how you "physically" look. Like what you see when looking in a mirror. This "thinking of yourself" should help you to be drawn back to the object of your thinking.........yourself. >At some point I ended up at a place where there were some people, one of >whom was a young pretty woman around 18 with a green hued face and some >birthmarks and black hair. She struck me as being a wise and >knowledgeable person. Perhaps one of your own spirit guides/helpers. > I went to her and asked her if I was awake yet >since it seemed I was in a normal setting. She looked me right in the >eyes, paused, then said, "no". This disappointed me, and I became >visibly depressed. I asked her how do I get home, is there anyone that >can help me. She said "You need to talk to Bill, he can help you." She >looked over her shoulder and called for Bill. I walked over in the >direction of her glance and met up with a very tall middle aged man with >a big shaggy brown/gray beard and a big smile. I asked him if he could >help me get home and with a friendly gesture handed me a 4 sq. inch >folded piece of paper with cotton glued between the folds. I didn't >know what this was for but it was obviously going to be of some help. >Holding the paper prompted me to say a prayer of sorts (this was a >surprise). I was then drawn away from the scene and into a new, very >disturbing scene. Saying a prayer is often a help when OOB. Praying before an OOB is generally a better idea though. One will not always be alert enough to remember while OOB. >This new scene was my familiar bedroom and I was waking out of the >trance which is what I had hoped for. I was glad that Bill was able to >help, but there was something terribly terribly wrong. I crawled out of >bed and felt like I was drugged to the gills. The room was dimly lit >and very distorted. I looked down at the rug and the patterns in the >rug were swirling as if looking through a lens with syrup on it. I >tried to walk but I was nearly unable to stand because I was so dizzy >and disoriented. I was confused about my state since I was not drunk or >drugged when I went to bed. >I fought with all my strength to see more clearly and to shake the >grogginess away when suddenly I seemed to break through and awoke for >real this time, in my real bed. It seemed that the groggy state was a >stepping stone to allow me to break out of my separation from my body. >Bill seemed to have known this and that is why he some how guided me to >that place. I was surprised he didn't just get me back directly, which >is what I thought had happened at first when I got to this distorted >bedroom, but it all worked out. I was back but I was so wierded out by >this whole thing. It had most definitely occurred to me that I may very >well have not been able to find my way back, and I would have become a >comatose person, or dead. I couldn't help but think when I had asked >that young woman if someone could help me, she very well could have just >said, "I'm sorry, but your body died, and this is your new home." That >would have really blown me away. That would have been it for me. Wow. >I was lucky this time. Would I be that lucky next time? Makes me >wonder a little. That would depend on a number of factors. Unless you are in the habit of talking to dead people then you will not hear much about people going OOB and not returning. "Unexplained" deaths are not overly newsworthy. Maybe a trip to ; http://www.geocities.com/Paris/LeftBank/1700/index.html is required ? As many people don't know as much as you do, and/or don't know about psychic protection, they can have worse situations than yours. That is what enables those who know about magic to be so effective in non-physical realms. They have little/no opposition. While people tell others that they cannot have "negative OOB experiences" etc. people will believe that and leave themselves far more vulnerable than they need to be. I assume that you have heard the saying "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread ?" Regards, John. -- **************************************************** ,-._|\ John Fitzsimons - Melbourne, Australia. / Oz \ johnf@melbpc.org.au, Fidonet 3:633/309 \_,--.x/ http://www.vicnet.net.au/~johnf/welcome.htm v http://www.alphalink.com.au/~johnf/