From: "Angus Prune" Subject: Re: look here... Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body References: <1998071102073900.WAA28598@ladder01.news.aol.com> Message-ID: <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 21 Date: Sun, 12 Jul 1998 23:32:53 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: chartwell.centrenet.co.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 00:32:53 BST Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!btnet-peer!btnet-feed1!btnet!news-reader.bt.net!not-for-mail Silk Dick wrote in article <1998071102073900.WAA28598@ladder01.news.aol.com>... > (for JHM)... a private message sent over a public medium. heheheheh... > (snippity snip private chit chat) Hello Silk You mentioned in an earlier thread that you thought you smelled a spammer. In this thread I think that I do. Why don't you just mail this gibberish & save us all from some of the garbage that we have to sift through daily in order to find relevant posts? You Qvpx Urnq! Regards Prune ###### From: silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Lines: 31 Message-ID: <1998071302461700.WAA05605@ladder03.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder03.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 13 Jul 1998 02:46:17 GMT References: <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!ibm.net!news.freedom2surf.net!btnet-peer!btnet!newsfeed.internetmci.com!204.59.152.222!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey03.news.aol.com!not-for-mail In article <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT>, "Angus Prune" writes: >Why don't you just mail this gibberish & save us all from some of the >garbage that we have to sift through daily in order to find relevant posts? I'm a crusader for the virtues of PGP. (it's public domain software, btw...) anyone interested, please reply, and I'll attach it to an e-mail and send it to you. this PGP stuff was so advanced when it came out (and still is!) that the U.S. gov't BANNED it from export outside of the U.S.! can you imagine? what a laugh! they feared (rightfully!) that if the USSR / Ruskies got their hands on it, WE wouldn't be able to break THEIR coded messages! Imagine the value of the number 2 raised to the 1023rd power... 2^1023 has over 300 zeros in it! (a trillion only has TWELVE zeros in it!) This is how many combinations there are, then MUTIPLY that by the incredibly long passphrases you may enter! (ie: your own secret passwords...) and you quickly see that decryption quickly becomes a fairy tale... anywayz... that's why I thought I'd introduce the concept to anyone who'd care to give it a whirl... Pleasant Dreams |-) Silk Richard.Silk@Juno.Com SilkDick@aol.com Pager #615-923-1696 ###### Path: ccw.ch!usenet From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: 13 Jul 1998 21:29:08 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 82 Message-ID: References: <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT> <1998071302461700.WAA05605@ladder03.news.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) writes: > In article <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT>, "Angus Prune" > writes: > > >Why don't you just mail this gibberish & save us all from some of the > >garbage that we have to sift through daily in order to find relevant posts? Here I have to give Angus right. Personal messages don't belong in newsgroups. Thats what email is for. > I'm a crusader for the virtues of PGP. (it's public domain software, btw...) > anyone interested, please reply, and I'll attach it to an e-mail and > send it to you. Now that would make an monster-mail. Email attachments bloat the data being transported by 33% relative to Web surfing. Also this will lead to disappointment if you and the other use fifferent ones of Windows/Macintosh/Unix at the 2 ends. Giving them the URL would be better: http://www.ifi.uio.no/pgp/ > this PGP stuff was so advanced when it came out (and still is!) that the U.S. > gov't BANNED it from export outside of the U.S.! can you imagine? what a > laugh! The U.S. export laws forbid exporting without license (difficult to get) any kryptographic scheme using more than 48 bit (presently) keys. PGP uses 128 bit. And PG being available as source code is not licenseable at all. > they feared (rightfully!) that if the USSR / Ruskies got their hands > on it, WE wouldn't be able to break THEIR coded messages! Wrong. They fear that criminals* will use it. *insert your favourite bogeyman: drug/arms dealers, terrorists... The USSR government (same as the US gov) had equivalent technology 10-15 years before PGP was written. Terrorists got it from the USSR and drug/arms dealers can smuggle floppies without trouble. The maths in PGP was documented in magazines 20 years ago. > Imagine the value of the number 2 raised to the 1023rd power... > 2^1023 has over > 300 zeros in it! (a trillion only has TWELVE zeros in it!) This is how many > combinations there are, then MUTIPLY that by the incredibly long passphrases > you may enter! (ie: your own secret passwords...) and you quickly see that > decryption quickly becomes a fairy tale... No multiply. PGP can be cracked by breaking either the passphrase or the RSA key (usually 1024 bit) or the IDEA session key (128 bit). Any of these takes more computer than is available on this planet at the moment if you want to use brute force trying. The big question is whether the NSA knows some super whiz maths* that gets PGP into their range. *they employ more mathematicians than any other organisation worldwide. Guess why? > that's why I thought I'd introduce the concept to anyone who'd care > to give it a whirl... But a.oob is really not the place to do it. Really no security relevant stuff here. And don't forget psychic spying. Encryption is one thing, but having a spy get the unencrypted stuff direct from your brain sort of subverts it. BTW: my PGP key is on my private homepage. -- private: Neil.Franklin@ccw.ch.remove http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/ office: franklin@arch.ethz.ch.remove http://caad.arch.ethz.ch/~franklin/ WinCE car, crashing soon on a road near you ###### From: Andreas Manthey Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 18:46:52 +0300 Organization: University of Oulu Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT><1998071302461700.WAA05605@ladder03.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: tk4.oulu.fi Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Sender: aman@tk4 In-Reply-To: Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-stkh.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed1.funet.fi!ousrvr3.oulu.fi!tk4!aman > >> this PGP stuff was so advanced when it came out (and still is!) that the U.S. >> gov't BANNED it from export outside of the U.S.! can you imagine? what a >> laugh! > >The U.S. export laws forbid exporting without license (difficult to >get) any kryptographic scheme using more than 48 bit (presently) keys. >PGP uses 128 bit. And PG being available as source code is not >licenseable at all. > When German gov. officials learned 1 or 2 years ago that people could send emails and other data which couldn't easily be deciphered by their intelligency services, they really freaked out. They started big talk about security using that usual "drugs & terrorists" babbling. Finally they decided - now get this - to ban the use of cryptographics generally. Imagine _that_! What a big laugh... What hypocrites... But I don't know what really became of this (ie, any acts or something). Definitely off topic, I know. But a nice anecdote. :) Bye, Andreas ###### From: Linda Stead Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 23:08:18 +0000 Organization: Oregon Public Networking Lines: 33 Message-ID: <35ABE4E2.6828@jeffnet.org> References: <01bdaddc$9de0aec0$LocalHost@DEFAULT><1998071302461700.WAA05605@ladder03.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: jeffnet.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03Gold (Win95; I) Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!news-peer.sprintlink.net!news-backup-east.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!206.102.31.251!news.cmc.net!news.efn.org!not-for-mail Andreas Manthey wrote: > > > > >> this PGP stuff was so advanced when it came out (and still is!) that the U.S. > >> gov't BANNED it from export outside of the U.S.! can you imagine? what a > >> laugh! > > > >The U.S. export laws forbid exporting without license (difficult to > >get) any kryptographic scheme using more than 48 bit (presently) keys. > >PGP uses 128 bit. And PG being available as source code is not > >licenseable at all. > > > > When German gov. officials learned 1 or 2 years ago that people could send > emails and other data which couldn't easily be deciphered by their > intelligency services, they really freaked out. They started big talk about > security using that usual "drugs & terrorists" babbling. Finally they > decided - now get this - to ban the use of cryptographics generally. > Imagine _that_! What a big laugh... What hypocrites... But I don't know > what really became of this (ie, any acts or something). > > Definitely off topic, I know. > But a nice anecdote. :) > > Bye, > Andreas I believe our government (United States) and the encryption software companies are currently arguing this very question. The banking industry wants good encryption programs but the government is worried that the drug dealers will use them to do their business. Both legitimate points. ls ###### From: silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Lines: 128 Message-ID: <1998071504150700.AAA00318@ladder01.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 15 Jul 1998 04:15:07 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!152.163.199.19!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail In article , Neil Franklin writes: [silk wrote:] >> I'm a crusader for the virtues of PGP. (it's public domain software, btw...) >> anyone interested, please reply, and I'll attach it to an e-mail and >> send it to you. >Now that would make an monster-mail. Email attachments bloat the data >being transported by 33% relative to Web surfing. um... I'd attach it to personal e-mail. as far as I know, I can't attach to a newsgroup post, but I *can* embed in an NG post. But unless you already had PGP, it wouldn't be of much use now, would it? :-) >Also this will lead to disappointment if you and the other use >[different] ones of Windows/Macintosh/Unix at the 2 ends. >my copy is DOS based. Works with Dos on up thru win '98 (using dos prompts). not tooooo many folk out here with Unix as their NG platforms... :-) >Giving them the URL would be better: http://www.ifi.uio.no/pgp/ hey! thanks! maybe I can get something Windows -interactive!? >The U.S. export laws forbid exporting without license (difficult to get) any kryptographic scheme using more than 48 bit (presently) keys. PGP uses 128 bit. try 1024 bit!! >And PG being available as source code is not licenseable at all. "licenseable"? perhaps not. but *obtainable*, I'm sure it is. >> they feared (rightfully!) that if the USSR / Ruskies got their hands >> on it, WE wouldn't be able to break THEIR coded messages! > >Wrong. They fear that criminals* will use it. >*insert your favourite bogeyman: drug/arms dealers, terrorists... not wrong. You just included a more specific domain of "bogeys." >The USSR government (same as the US gov) had equivalent technology >10-15 years before PGP was written. Terrorists got it from the USSR >and drug/arms dealers can smuggle floppies without trouble. which makes all these *SILLY* movies of puter whizzes cracking encrypted discs SOOOO damned ridiculous! :-) >The maths in PGP was documented in magazines 20 years ago. hm! > Imagine the value of the number 2 raised to the 1023rd power... 2^1023 has over >> 300 zeros in it! (a trillion only has TWELVE zeros in it!) This is how many >> combinations there are, then MUTIPLY that by the incredibly long passphrases >> you may enter! (ie: your own secret passwords...) and you quickly see >that decryption quickly becomes a fairy tale... > >No multiply. using brute force, yes, multiply. I don't know EXACTLY which character strokes PGP can or cannot read off the keyboard, BUT: let's say it could only read A to Z. that's 26 characters. Say the passphrase was only 8 characters long. That would give you something like 26^8th power combinations, ASSUMING you already had the 1024 bit encrypted secret keyfile. But the number of characters readable is at LEAST 37 + punctuation characters, raised to the Nth power, because Lord knows how MANY characters PGP will allow in a passphrase! I had a vision once of what the mathematical construct of the PGP key would look like if it were an actual entity. Strongly resembled the Asteroid of Armageddon! :-) > PGP can be cracked by breaking either the passphrase or the RSA key (usually 1024 bit) or the IDEA session key (128 bit). you have to break the 1024 bit key PLUS the passphrase! (right?) and what's the IDEA session key? something to do with time and date of key creation? >Any of these takes more computer than is available on this planet at the >moment if you want to use brute force trying. the only brute force that'll work is threatening the life of the individual to give up the secret keyfile and the passphrase! > >The big question is whether the NSA knows some super whiz maths* that >gets PGP into their range. well, that's ONE way... >> that's why I thought I'd introduce the concept to anyone who'd care >> to give it a whirl... > >But a.oob is really not the place to do it. Really no security >relevant stuff here. And don't forget psychic spying. Encryption is >one thing, but having a spy get the unencrypted stuff direct from your >brain sort of subverts it. but here's the rub: would you divulge something psychically which you would NOT divulge consciously?? Hm!..... >BTW: my PGP key is on my private homepage. why not post the radix64 version here? like this... -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- Version: 2.6.2 mQCNAzKFkGgAAAEEALmh+W4Mg1kOtzj2EobNcMX/RfSuqj/pfwu3U5lslJb6onHo J34X9j9TrdLG/6UnvfyyEOzEIyB2e0ao+pS9ZgRkpbS5DMiOoiTOfHT1COXhB85C Usv6nCbFzMI65tMaNFQNxHFJTnBJbff5CCL8GELciJYcHD9gVMT56BeLaeOVAAUR tClSaWNoYXJkIENhcmwgU2lsayA8UmljaGFyZC5TaWxrQEp1bm8uQ29tPg== =sQpS -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- works just as well... (public key of RC Silk) Pleasant Dreams |-) Silk Richard.Silk@Juno.Com SilkDick@aol.com Pager #615-923-1696 ###### From: silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Lines: 20 Message-ID: <1998071504150800.AAA00322@ladder01.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 15 Jul 1998 04:15:08 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news.idt.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!152.163.199.19!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail In article , Andreas Manthey writes: > Finally they >decided - now get this - to ban the use of cryptographics generally. >Imagine _that_! What a big laugh... What hypocrites... But I don't know >what really became of this (ie, any acts or something). wanna hear something scary? the US Gov't has laws which FORCE cryptographic companies to include "FBI back doors" in their chips and encryption routines which allows FBI folk with wire tap orders to jack into the conversations, unobserved... thank GOD PGP was written BEFORE these laws! :-) Pleasant Dreams |-) Silk Richard.Silk@Juno.Com SilkDick@aol.com Pager #615-923-1696 ###### Path: ccw.ch!usenet From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: 15 Jul 1998 22:01:17 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 100 Message-ID: References: <1998071504150700.AAA00318@ladder01.news.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) writes: > writes: > >Now that would make an monster-mail. Email attachments bloat the data > >being transported by 33% relative to Web surfing. > I'd attach it to personal e-mail. as far as I know, I can't attach to a > newsgroup post, but I *can* embed in an NG post. Email attachments and NG embedding are just two different names for essentially the same technique (MIME, Multipourpose Internet Mail Extension, a.k.a. Massively Increases Megabytes Exchanged). In both cases every 3 bytes of file get converted to 4 bytes of base64/radix64 code. > >Also this will lead to disappointment if you and the other use > >[different] ones of Windows/Macintosh/Unix at the 2 ends. > my copy is DOS based. Works with Dos on up thru win '98 (using dos prompts). > not tooooo many folk out here with Unix as their NG platforms... :-) I know quite a few Mac and Unix users. Has to do with my job (Unix admin at an University with large Mac population) and friends (includes an Unix user group). More nearer to the discussion, I am writing this on an Unix box :-). I would not misstreat a computer with MicroShit stuff. > >The U.S. export laws forbid exporting without license (difficult to get) any > > kryptographic scheme using more than 48 bit (presently) keys. PGP uses 128 > try 1024 bit!! To be more precise PGP uses 2 cascaded encrytion schemes. The actual message is encrypted using IDEA (International Data Encryption Algorithm) that uses an (randomly chosen) 128 bit key. That key is then RSA (Rivest Shamir Adleman) encrypted with the 512..2048 bit public key of the recipient. > >And PG being available as source code is not licenseable at all. > "licenseable"? perhaps not. but *obtainable*, I'm sure it is. Thanks to an legal loophole. Exporting books can not be forbidden (some freedom of press law), so the PGP folks publisch PGP in radix64 as an single print book and export that to Norway, where it is scanned in and OCRed. > >> combinations there are, then MUTIPLY that by the incredibly long passphras > >No multiply. > using brute force, yes, multiply. > that's 26 characters. Say the passphrase was only 8 characters long. That > would give you something like 26^8th power combinations, ASSUMING you already I was imprecise there. The bits in _each_ of passphrase, RSA key and IDEA key multiply. But after that you can not multiply the 3 resulting numbers, because each is an independant faillure point. So you get something like 1/(1/pass+1/RSA+1/IDEA). That formula is only a rough estimate, for more my maths is insufficient :-). > > can be cracked by breaking either the passphrase or the RSA key (usually > 1024 bit) or the IDEA session key (128 bit). > you have to break the 1024 bit key PLUS the passphrase! (right?) Nope. Breaking any of the 3 is enough. But thats still an big job. > and what's the IDEA session key? something to do with time and date of key See above on cascading. > >Any of these takes more computer than is available on this planet at the > >moment if you want to use brute force trying. > only brute force that'll work is threatening the life of the individual to > give up the secret keyfile and the passphrase! That is actually a lot easier. Or bug their computer. Or trick them into giving out the passphrase (a.k.a. social engineering). > but here's the rub: would you divulge something psychically which you would > NOT divulge consciously?? Hm!..... Most likely. Such as all thoughts I have ever thought. Many RVers say that there exists no secrecy at all. > >BTW: my PGP key is on my private homepage. > why not post the radix64 version here? like this... To save space. http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/pgp_pub_key.asc -- private: Neil.Franklin@ccw.ch.remove http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/ office: franklin@arch.ethz.ch.remove http://caad.arch.ethz.ch/~franklin/ WinCE car, crashing soon on a road near you ###### pgp key moved to: http://neil.franklin.ch/Personal/pgp_pub_key.asc home page generally moved to: http://neil.franklin.ch/ ###### From: silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Message-ID: <1998071712143900.IAA08270@ladder01.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 17 Jul 1998 12:14:39 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader Lines: 60 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!uknet!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer!btnet!newsfeed.internetmci.com!152.163.199.19!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail In article , Neil Franklin writes: > >Email attachments and NG embedding are just two different names for >essentially the same technique (MIME, Multipourpose Internet Mail >Extension, a.k.a. Massively Increases Megabytes Exchanged). In both >cases every 3 bytes of file get converted to 4 bytes of base64/radix64 >code. I disagree. I can sit here and type ;alsdkjqwoeriuqeoas;ldkaorqiuwer, or just as easily copy and paste the same type of stuff from a radix 64 PGP file. And PGP tries to ZIP the file BEFORE encrypting as well! (Thus reducing bytes transmitted) >More nearer to the discussion, I am writing this on an Unix box :-). >I would not misstreat a computer with MicroShit stuff. #SU #CHMOD 666 :-) >> >And PG being available as source code is not licenseable at all. >> "licenseable"? perhaps not. but *obtainable*, I'm sure it is. > >Thanks to [a] legal loophole. Exporting books can not be forbidden >(some freedom of press law), so the PGP folks [publish] PGP in >radix64 as an single print book and export that to Norway, where it >is scanned in and OCRed. ha!! :-) I was thinking rather, just how EASY it is to put it on a website, and some schmuck in Russia decides to click on your web link! >I was imprecise there. The bits in _each_ of passphrase, RSA key and >IDEA key multiply. But after that you can not multiply the 3 resulting >numbers, because each is an independant faillure point. > >So you get something like 1/(1/pass+1/RSA+1/IDEA). That formula is >only a rough estimate, for more my maths is insufficient :-). interesting...thanks. >> but here's the rub: would you divulge something psychically which you would >> NOT divulge consciously?? Hm!..... >Most likely. Such as all thoughts I have ever thought. >Many RVers say that there exists no secrecy at all. hmmm................ >To save space. http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/pgp_pub_key.asc because I don't http very much... Pleasant Dreams |-) Silk Richard.Silk@Juno.Com SilkDick@aol.com Pager #615-923-1696 ###### Path: ccw.ch!usenet From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: 17 Jul 1998 23:49:15 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 55 Message-ID: References: <1998071712143900.IAA08270@ladder01.news.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) writes: > writes: > >Extension, a.k.a. Massively Increases Megabytes Exchanged). In both > >cases every 3 bytes of file get converted to 4 bytes of base64/radix64 > >code. > I disagree. I can sit here and type ;alsdkjqwoeriuqeoas;ldkaorqiuwer, or just > as easily copy and paste the same type of stuff from a radix 64 PGP > file. Erm. we were talking about dragging an archive (most likely already compressed) containing PGP software into an email, not about the cost of PGPing an message. > >More nearer to the discussion, I am writing this on an Unix box :-). > >I would not misstreat a computer with MicroShit stuff. > > #SU > #CHMOD 666 > :-) Wrong*. Unix commands are case sensitive... chonsp:ttyp0:root:~# SU bash: SU: command not found chonsp:ttyp0:root:~# CHMOD 666 bash: CHMOD: command not found chonsp:ttyp0:root:~# *actually there exist a loophole you can pull yourself out of. I wonder if you know it. > >Thanks to [a] legal loophole. Exporting books can not be forbidden > >(some freedom of press law), so the PGP folks [publish] PGP in > >radix64 as an single print book and export that to Norway, where it > >is scanned in and OCRed. > ha!! :-) I was thinking rather, just how EASY it is to put it on a website, > and some schmuck in Russia decides to click on your web link! That would be "making available" and would be illegal. > >To save space. http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/pgp_pub_key.asc > because I don't http very much... Perhaps the effect of writing too much Usenat? (Now where do I know that from :-)) -- private: Neil.Franklin@ccw.ch.remove http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/ office: franklin@arch.ethz.ch.remove http://caad.arch.ethz.ch/~franklin/ WinCE car, crashing soon on a road near you ###### Message-ID: <35B29CB1.C35B7A14@out.of.body> Date: Mon, 20 Jul 1998 11:26:09 +1000 From: Craig Organization: Deja Vous X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... References: <1998071504150700.AAA00318@ladder01.news.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.18.28.55 X-Trace: 20 Jul 1998 15:04:43 +1000, 203.18.28.55 Lines: 3 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.idt.net!newsfeed.axxsys.net!uunet!in4.uu.net!nap-ns1!203.18.28.55 -- ->crackers at comcirc dot com dot au<- ###### From: silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Lines: 30 Message-ID: <1998072204201100.AAA00404@ladder01.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder01.news.aol.com X-Admin: news@aol.com Date: 22 Jul 1998 04:20:10 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: AOL Offline Reader Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-lond.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!nntp.news.xara.net!xara.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!152.163.199.19!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey01.news.aol.com!not-for-mail In article , Neil Franklin writes: >*actually there exist a loophole you can pull yourself out of. I wonder >if you know it. > it involves defining your own commands in terms of unix commands. >> ha!! :-) I was thinking rather, just how EASY it is to put it on a >website, >> and some schmuck in Russia decides to click on your web link! > >That would be "making available" and would be illegal. HA! let 'em sue me! :-) >> >To save space. http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/pgp_pub_key.asc >> because I don't http very much... > >Perhaps the effect of writing too much [Usenet]? (Now where do I know >that from :-)) Hm! perhaps my 10,000 plus posts which may be found via Deja News?? Pleasant Dreams |-) Silk Richard.Silk@Juno.Com SilkDick@aol.com Pager #615-923-1696 ###### Path: ccw.ch!usenet From: Neil Franklin Newsgroups: alt.out-of-body Subject: Re: look here... Date: 23 Jul 1998 00:16:11 +0200 Organization: My own Private Self Lines: 26 Message-ID: References: <1998072204201100.AAA00404@ladder01.news.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.3/Emacs 19.34 silkdick@aol.com (Silk Dick) writes: > In article , Neil Franklin > writes: > > >*actually there exist a loophole you can pull yourself out of. I wonder > >if you know it. > > > it involves defining your own commands in terms of unix commands. Nope. That also works, but is totally unelegant. A brute force method. I was thinking of an method that allows you to use upper case without any work (appart from once pressing the shift key), which is why I called it an loophole. I will give you an second attempt to find it! Hint: it consists of exploiting an totally non obvious feature of the terminal drivers. -- private: Neil.Franklin@ccw.ch.remove http://www.ccw.ch/Neil.Franklin/ office: franklin@arch.ethz.ch.remove http://caad.arch.ethz.ch/~franklin/ WinCE car, crashing soon on a road near you