Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed.uk.ibm.net!sackheads.org!ibm.net!news-lond.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!news.demon.co.uk!demon!aguazul.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail From: jim@aguazul.demon.co.uk (Jim Peters) Newsgroups: alt.hackers Subject: A tale of hot mice Date: 19 May 1998 16:22:57 +0100 Organization: Aguazul Approved: me@my.place Message-ID: <6js84h$9hq$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: aguazul.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: aguazul.demon.co.uk:158.152.135.59 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 895593127 nnrp-11:14759 NO-IDENT aguazul.demon.co.uk:158.152.135.59 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0] Lines: 49 Yes, I too am wasting a valuable ObHack due to propagation-related excitment. I've had a reoccuring problem with my PC for a couple of years now. The mouse would intermittently stop working, either in one direction (up-down or left-right) or both. I've tried all kinds of things to fix the problem. Sometimes reseating the plug in the back of the machine worked, sometimes it didn't. After a while (a long while) I noticed that it happened especially on sunny days when the sun shines over my desk for a couple of hours in the afternoon. I erected pieces of cardboard and so on to protect the machine, and the problem seemed to be less, but it still occurred. I suspected that the heat of the day was making the PC case expand and stretch the motherboard, making some bad solder joint worsen its connection, and hence cause the problem. The speaker in the PC works once in a blue moon - sometimes it surprises me we a beep on boot-up - so I lumped these two problems together as "dodgy motherboard". However, at last I believe I have found the problem. I noticed that when the sun is on my desk, part of the mouse mat is lit and part in shadow. I wonder if the sun on the mouse makes a difference ... Well it does, and hence my ObHack: ObHack: When my mouse sticks, rather than frantically jiggling connectors behind the machine, I hold my hand on the mouse for 10-20 secs. This cools it enough, and sure enough, first one direction then the other unsticks as I waggle the mouse. Maybe reaching behind the machine cast a shadow over the mouse, and that cured the problem (intermittently) before. The question now is why the mouse is sensitive. Does it have dodgy solder joints ? My favourite theory right now is that the little detectors on the slotted wheels use infra-red light, so the radiation from the heat was drowning the signals. I'm sure someone will put me right if my Physics is all wrong on this point. Hmmm ... just the speaker problem remains unsolved now. -- Jim Peters / __ | \ Aguazul / /| /| )| /| / )|| \ jim@aguazul. \ (_|(_|(_|(_| )(_|I / www.aguazul. demon.co.uk \ ._) _/ / demon.co.uk ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!195.99.66.215!news-feed1.eu.concert.net!btnet-peer!btnet!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!news.demon.co.uk!demon!aguazul.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail From: jim@aguazul.demon.co.uk (Jim Peters) Newsgroups: alt.hackers Subject: Re: A tale of hot mice Date: 27 May 1998 11:50:23 +0100 Organization: Aguazul Approved: me@my.place Message-ID: <6kgr5f$ga$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> References: <6js84h$9hq$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: aguazul.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: aguazul.demon.co.uk:158.152.135.59 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 896278839 nnrp-07:21798 NO-IDENT aguazul.demon.co.uk:158.152.135.59 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX 1.3 950824BETA PL0] Lines: 65 Mouse theories are abounding !! I've recieved several E-mails following this post, several of which count as ObHacks, and could have been posted here. I will summarize the current list of theories, and open the field to wider discussion. I am mentioning valuable ideas from various people here, but not their names (I didn't ask) - they can take credit with their own posting if they wish. Crud on the mouse ball / rollers etc ------------------------------------ Several people have suggested that gunk on the rollers, either from smoking or just oily dust etc. may be causing the problem. I know this problem - I don't smoke, but I do cook in the same room, and I get a layer of crud building up on the rollers that I have to scrape off from time to time. It makes the mouse movements jerky and irregular, and eventually causes the mouse to stick in random ways at random times. Hairs on the mouse ball also seem to cause a similar problem. However, these do not explain the complete failure I experienced. Heat-expansion of mouse ball ---------------------------- I like this theory, and next time I get the problem, I will try taking the ball out and spinning the rollers with a finger to see if it really is the expanded ball getting stuck. I seem to remember trying this, but I'm not sure, so I can't discard this as an explanation for my problem. Light detectors affected by heat / sun rays ------------------------------------------- One person from Germany wrote saying that he solved the problem by painting the inside of his mouse black. He suggests that it is the sun-light itself and not the heat that interferes with the detectors and causes the problem. Someone else mentions that the detectors themselves are sensitive to heat, and I am guessing that this means that this impairs their ability to detect. Anyway, the field is open - I have to wait for another bright sunny day to experiment some more, and I guess that all mice are different, and what applies to my mouse might not apply to yours at all. Anyone else ... ? Ob-not-much-of-a-Hack-but-it-will-have-to-do: My doorbell wasn't working. Being two floors up and not having any volunteers handy, I had trouble testing it. However, I was confident that the problem wasn't with the wire or the button. So I slipped a knife into the cable just deep enough to touch both wires and imitate a push on the door-bell. No hack too small ... ? -- Jim Peters / __ | \ Aguazul / /| /| )| /| / )|| \ jim@aguazul. \ (_|(_|(_|(_| )(_|I / www.aguazul. demon.co.uk \ ._) _/ / demon.co.uk ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-penn.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.nacamar.de!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!news.demon.co.uk!demon!neutralino.demon.co.uk!neutralino.demon.com.uk!not-for-mail From: Kira L. Brown Newsgroups: alt.hackers Subject: Re: A tale of hot mice Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:41:12 +0100 Organization: norg! Technologies Sender: Kira L. Brown Approved: Automatically with Messenger! Message-ID: <484CDDC390%kbrown@neutralino.demon.com.uk> References: <6js84h$9hq$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> <6kgr5f$ga$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> Reply-To: kbrown@illusion.co.uk NNTP-Posting-Host: neutralino.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: neutralino.demon.co.uk:212.228.0.73 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 896284042 nnrp-09:29667 NO-IDENT neutralino.demon.co.uk:212.228.0.73 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: Messenger v1.34c for RISC OS X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.21ß X-Mangled: using ZapEmail's AST (ygolonhceT mapS-itnA) X-Apparently-From: kbrown@neutralino.demon.co.uk X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.60g X-NNTP-Poster: NewsHound v1.20 Lines: 31 In message <6kgr5f$ga$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> jim@aguazul.demon.co.uk (Jim Peters) wrote: [snip mice theories] It *isn't* thermal expansion of the mouseball. I've measured them accurately in both hot and cold states, and they don't change by much (typically less than 0.1 mm. over a 100 C range) so it's not that. Crud on the rollers does stop mice working, but usually not in both directions at once. Light coming through the casing *does* stop them working- it swamps the photodiodes that they use to detect infra red coming through the slotted wheel. Try shielding it from light and see. ObHack: Rejuvenating Blue-Tack (you know, the polymer putty for sticking posters and things) with the heat from my anglepoise lamp. Too lame? AnotherObHack: Rejuvenating totally dry Blue Tack using WD40 spray. Just a little, mind... kira. -- Kira L. Brown. Testing Zap 1.39. Brave or what? ###### Path: ccw.ch!elna.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.internetmci.com!204.210.0.20!proxye1.san.rr.com!not-for-mail Reply-To: "Big Bad Bob Frazier" From: "Big Bad Bob Frazier" Newsgroups: alt.hackers References: <6js84h$9hq$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> <6kgr5f$ga$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: A tale of hot mice Keywords: of mice and more mice Approved: yepperee Lines: 36 Organization: Disorganization MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 02 Jun 1998 03:55:08 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: dt091n0d.san.rr.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 01 Jun 1998 20:55:08 PDT Jim Peters wrote in message <6kgr5f$ga$1@aguazul.aguazul.demon.co.uk>... >Mouse theories are abounding !! I've recieved several E-mails >following this post, several of which count as ObHacks, and could have >been posted here. I will summarize the current list of theories, and >open the field to wider discussion. I am mentioning valuable ideas >from various people here, but not their names (I didn't ask) - they >can take credit with their own posting if they wish. Semiconductor components (like the ones in your mouse) are heat sensitive. Semiconductors will eventually reach a point of "thermal runaway" where elevated temperatures cause them to conduct to the point where they begin to heat up, which makes them conduct more, etc. etc. etc. (referred to as a positive temperature coefficient). Though it's not likely that your mouse is having a problem with thermal runaway, it's possible that the temperature is causing them to 'stay conducted', thus responding poorly to signal variations caused by mouse motion. When the signal strength is too low, it's as though the light sensor diodes were a "dead short", and you get no signal output. OBHACK - I once fixed a mouse by using a "wrong sized ball" and adding a cut spring from a retractable ball point pen behind one of the wheels. It "sorta worked". Hey, it was a bus mouse, and I couldn't get a replacement. I eventually gave up my extra serial port and went with a serial mouse. So, there ya go. -- Big Bad Bombastic Bob [how can I know the answer when I don't even know the question?] e-mail: BobF@RemoveThisObviousThing.mrp3.com REPORT ALL UBE/SPAM to the 'net abuse' newsgroup of your choice SPAM deletion on USENET is a public service! We should all participate in helping to clean up the SPAM.