From: Theo Markettos Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 24 Jun 2004 16:48:35 +0100 (BST) Organization: University of Cambridge, England Lines: 23 Sender: Theo Markettos Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: rapun.sel.cam.ac.uk Originator: theom@chiark.greenend.org.uk ([193.201.200.170]) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!213.253.16.105.MISMATCH!mephistopheles.news.clara.net!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!193.60.199.18.MISMATCH!feed2.jnfs.ja.net!jnfs.ja.net!rfcgr.mrc.ac.uk!pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:177557 I was just wondering... Roughly when were power supply decoupling capacitors first deemed necessary in circuit design? I'm thinking mostly logic circuits here, though I can see that audio/RF circuits might have needed them too. I suppose every DC PSU has a smoothing capacitor doing roughly the same job but I was more thinking about adding capacitors around the circuit to provide localised decoupling. Were they necessary in valve (vacuum tube) circuits? If not, in what technology did they first appear (RTL/DTL/TTL etc)? Was there any prior use in another field (say RF) and they were later used in logic circuit? The earliest boards I can remember (late 70s/early 80s) seem to have them on, but I haven't seen many earlier boards and can't say I've been looking for them specifically... Thanks, Theo -- Theo Markettos theo@markettos.org.uk Clare Hall, Cambridge atm26@cam.ac.uk CB3 9AL, UK http://www.markettos.org.uk/ ###### From: Paul Repacholi Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2004 18:43:16 +0800 Organization: none Lines: 28 Message-ID: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: grimiore.conceptual.net.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: nnrp.waia.asn.au 1090768775 30245 203.190.192.5 (25 Jul 2004 15:19:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@nnrp.waia.asn.au NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 25 Jul 2004 15:19:35 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.1001 (Gnus v5.10.1) Emacs/21.2 (gnu/linux) Cancel-Lock: sha1:Age6hZ8zKvYDHkZvpgQeeN3ejNw= Cache-Post-Path: grimiore.conceptual.net.au!unknown@203-190-196-002.dial.usertools.net X-Cache: nntpcache 2.3.3 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.primus.ca!news.primus.ca!chi1.usenetserver.com!news.usenetserver.com!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!news1.optus.net.au!optus!news.uwa.edu.au!nntp.waia.asn.au!198.32.212.248.MISMATCH!nnrp.waia.asn.au!127.0.0.1!nobody Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179483 Theo Markettos writes: > I was just wondering... > Roughly when were power supply decoupling capacitors first deemed > necessary in circuit design? Prior to 1934. > I'm thinking mostly logic circuits here, though I can see that > audio/RF circuits might have needed them too. I suppose every DC PSU > has a smoothing capacitor doing roughly the same job but I was more > thinking about adding capacitors around the circuit to provide > localised decoupling. Were they necessary in valve (vacuum tube) > circuits? If not, in what technology did they first appear > (RTL/DTL/TTL etc)? Was there any prior use in another field (say > RF) and they were later used in logic circuit? TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. -- Paul Repacholi 1 Crescent Rd., +61 (08) 9257-1001 Kalamunda. West Australia 6076 comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked. EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be. ###### From: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 00:30:26 +0000 (UTC) Organization: a2i network Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: green.rahul.net X-Trace: blue.rahul.net 1090801826 21232 192.160.13.49 (26 Jul 2004 00:30:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: support@rahul.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 00:30:26 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!cox.net!news-xfer.cox.net!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!wasp.rahul.net!blue.rahul.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179515 In article <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, Paul Repacholi wrote: [...] >TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and >CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. I disagree about CMOS. If has less need for bypass than TTL because the current spikes are smaller and the noise margin larger. -- -- kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge ###### From: K Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 08:31:07 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 17 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 4j1tqS6gdK5aMEl/wP5/tQcFee+/NxDnimLGDn/u5h41unRmUe X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news1.uni-leipzig.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179545 In article , kensmith@green.rahul.net says... > In article <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>, > Paul Repacholi wrote: > [...] > >TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and > >CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. > > I disagree about CMOS. If has less need for bypass than TTL because the > current spikes are smaller and the noise margin larger. It depends on the CMOS. HCMOS has a some fast edges and fairly high shoot-through current, IIRC. Bypassing of processors and FPGAs isn't a trivial art either (higher density, sure). -- Keith ###### From: "Airy R. Bean" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 15:07:47 +0100 Lines: 23 Message-ID: <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de LiYKSxDIBb2dkXSUe5pFLwKSIeqng5HG9et5mqsUdPSHJLgp+K X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179549 Long since known in Britland as the FGC solution.... "Got an instability problem?" "Yes" "Fit an FGC, then" "What's an, 'FGC'?" "A F**king Great Capacitor!" Theo Markettos wrote in article > I was just wondering... > > Roughly when were power supply decoupling capacitors first deemed > necessary in circuit design? > I'm thinking mostly logic circuits here, though I can see that > audio/RF circuits might have needed them too. I suppose every DC PSU > has a smoothing capacitor doing roughly the same job but I was more > thinking about adding capacitors around the circuit to provide > localised decoupling. Were they necessary in valve (vacuum tube) > circuits? If not, in what technology did they first appear > (RTL/DTL/TTL etc)? Was there any prior use in another field (say > RF) and they were later used in logic circuit? ###### From: Spehro Pefhany Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: Rather Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 20 Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.42.27.249 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rogers.com X-Trace: news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com 1090851371 24.42.27.249 (Mon, 26 Jul 2004 10:16:11 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 10:16:11 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!c03.atl99!c01.usenetserver.com!news.usenetserver.com!cyclone01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com!news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com.POSTED!12dc6cf53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179550 On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 15:07:47 +0100, the renowned "Airy R. Bean" wrote: >Long since known in Britland as the FGC solution.... > >"Got an instability problem?" >"Yes" >"Fit an FGC, then" >"What's an, 'FGC'?" >"A F**king Great Capacitor!" Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). Best regards, Spehro Pefhany -- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com ###### From: "Peter Ibbotson" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 15:24:24 +0100 Lines: 19 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: mailgate.lakeview.co.uk X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1090851863 29223 62.49.243.90 (26 Jul 2004 14:24:23 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:24:23 +0000 (UTC) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2142 X-Priority: 3 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2142 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!mutlu.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179551 "Airy R. Bean" wrote in message news:2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de... > Long since known in Britland as the FGC solution.... > > "Got an instability problem?" > "Yes" > "Fit an FGC, then" > "What's an, 'FGC'?" > "A F**king Great Capacitor!" Or the alternative approach, when a circuit always works with a scope probe attached, add a 90pf cap to ground and call it a filter. -- Work peteri@lakeview.co.uk.plugh.org | remove magic word .org to reply Home peter@ibbotson.co.uk.plugh.org | I own the domain but theres no MX ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:10:43 +0100 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 20 Message-ID: <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1090854643 27699 80.177.7.220 (26 Jul 2004 15:10:43 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 15:10:43 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031208 Cache-Post-Path: teapot.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.1.10 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news2.telebyte.nl!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179554 Airy R. Bean wrote: > Long since known in Britland as the FGC solution.... > "Got an instability problem?" > "Yes" > "Fit an FGC, then" > "What's an, 'FGC'?" > "A F**king Great Capacitor!" FGCs aren't inherently appropriate for high-speed work. That's why you have DLCs. Also you need such caps physically close to the offending chip, short trace-lengths... Or at least so I was told when a guy was trying to de-b0rk a rather optimistic board (components were hand-picked to make it work... bleah). Cheers, Rupert ###### From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.11 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.10) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 16 Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:24:05 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 159.134.254.111 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net 1090861037 159.134.254.111 (Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:57:17 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:57:17 GMT Organization: NTT/VERIO Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.moat.net!newspeer1.mlpsca01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net.POSTED!92c6ff8c!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179559 On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:10:43 +0100 Rupert Pigott wrote: > FGCs aren't inherently appropriate for high-speed work. That's > why you have DLCs. Also you need such caps physically close to > the offending chip, short trace-lengths... I recall some very neat 0.1uF caps that were flat with a pin in two corners designed to fit under a 16 pin DIL chip (or socket) to minimise trace lengths and maximise board den -- C:>WIN | Solar Thermal Systems The computer obeys and wins. | http://www.soleire.com/ You lose and Bill collects. | Directable Mirror Arrays | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Joe Pfeiffer Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 26 Jul 2004 11:16:01 -0600 Organization: New Mexico State University Lines: 16 Message-ID: <1b8yd6wuy6.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: viper.cs.nmsu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: bubba.nmsu.edu 1090862162 20179 128.123.64.114 (26 Jul 2004 17:16:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@bubba.nmsu.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 26 Jul 2004 17:16:02 GMT User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!msc1.onvoy!onvoy.com!lenny.tc.umn.edu!nunki.unm.edu!news.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179564 "Airy R. Bean" writes: > Long since known in Britland as the FGC solution.... > > "Got an instability problem?" > "Yes" > "Fit an FGC, then" > "What's an, 'FGC'?" > "A F**king Great Capacitor!" In the US, of course, this is known as a BFC. -- Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer Southwestern NM Regional Science and Engr Fair: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 18:43:14 +0100 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 20 Message-ID: <1090863793.701554@teapot.planet.gong> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1090863793 16255 80.177.7.220 (26 Jul 2004 17:43:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 17:43:13 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031208 Cache-Post-Path: teapot.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.1.10 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news.zanker.org!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179561 Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 16:10:43 +0100 > Rupert Pigott wrote: > >>FGCs aren't inherently appropriate for high-speed work. That's >>why you have DLCs. Also you need such caps physically close to >>the offending chip, short trace-lengths... > I recall some very neat 0.1uF caps that were flat with a pin > in two corners > designed to fit under a 16 pin DIL chip (or socket) to minimise trace lengths and > maximise board den Not sure I ever saw those. Mind you I don't think I'd class those as FGCs. HLCs perhaps. :) Cheers, Rupert ###### Sender: eric@ruckus.brouhaha.com From: Eric Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs X-Eric-Conspiracy: There is no conspiracy. Date: 26 Jul 2004 12:38:13 -0700 Message-ID: Lines: 7 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii NNTP-Posting-Host: ruckus.brouhaha.com X-Trace: news.spies.com 1090870694 64.62.206.2 (26 Jul 2004 12:38:14 -0700) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!enews.sgi.com!news.spies.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179569 Paul Repacholi writes: > TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and > CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. I thought that ECL (at least in the 10K/100K era) consumed an almost constant current, thus having relatively little need for bypassing? Or was that only true for differential stuff? ###### From: K Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 15:58:48 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 23 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de OihRs+f8SlAKgZA0U5yDFAGJTZg+QuTkSdz8I0BrjtMqFP51ND X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179571 In article , eric-no-spam-for- me@brouhaha.com says... > Paul Repacholi writes: > > TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and > > CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. > > I thought that ECL (at least in the 10K/100K era) consumed an almost > constant current, thus having relatively little need for bypassing? > Or was that only true for differential stuff? Most of the 10K/100K gates (not true so much of MSI stuff) had both output phases brought out. As long as one loaded both sides the dI/dT was small. Loading both phases wasn't usually a problem because one could use it to good advantage minimizing circuits/packages. IBM switched from ECL to TTL in its mainframes (308x) the power dissipation dropped, but the increase in dI/dT caused all sorts of problems (bypassing being a biggie). The subsequent systems went back to ECL largely because TTL didn't give the promised advantages. ECL's problems could more easily be handled (with tons of water ;-). -- Keith ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 22:22:11 +0100 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 25 Message-ID: <1090876930.813179@teapot.planet.gong> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1090876930 4052 80.177.7.220 (26 Jul 2004 21:22:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 21:22:10 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031208 Cache-Post-Path: teapot.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.1.10 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!proxad.net!proxad.net!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179575 K Williams wrote: > In article , eric-no-spam-for- > me@brouhaha.com says... > >>Paul Repacholi writes: >> >>>TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and >>>CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. >> >>I thought that ECL (at least in the 10K/100K era) consumed an almost >>constant current, thus having relatively little need for bypassing? >>Or was that only true for differential stuff? > Most of the 10K/100K gates (not true so much of MSI stuff) had both > output phases brought out. As long as one loaded both sides the > dI/dT was small. Loading both phases wasn't usually a problem > because one The line driving ability of ECL must have helped a ton for those big systems. On paper at least ECL looked like a great fit for the big iron of yesteryear. :) Cheers, Rupert ###### From: Keith Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2004 08:47:29 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 31 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <1090876930.813179@teapot.planet.gong> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de eORtLu8CGySR8GWOR920kglfV93dt/HkuVaiQzRdlg5I9IpZLU X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179596 In article <1090876930.813179@teapot.planet.gong>, roo@try-removing- this.darkboong.demon.co.uk says... > K Williams wrote: > > In article , eric-no-spam-for- > > me@brouhaha.com says... > > > >>Paul Repacholi writes: > >> > >>>TTL brought them out with a vengance, esp the faster versions, and > >>>CMOS even more. ECL wanted a cap per package at least as well. > >> > >>I thought that ECL (at least in the 10K/100K era) consumed an almost > >>constant current, thus having relatively little need for bypassing? > >>Or was that only true for differential stuff? > > > > > > Most of the 10K/100K gates (not true so much of MSI stuff) had both > > output phases brought out. As long as one loaded both sides the dI/dT > > was small. Loading both phases wasn't usually a problem because one > > The line driving ability of ECL must have helped a ton for those big > systems. On paper at least ECL looked like a great fit for the big > iron of yesteryear. :) Sure, but TTL on the 3080s worked more or less as well driving long transmission lines (open collector driver with the emitter tied to -1V and the terminator pulled-up to ground). The real difference was power (advantage TTL) and dI/dT (advantage ECL). ...cost (advantage CMOS;). -- Keith ###### From: "Kevin G. Rhoads" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 13:50:32 +0000 Organization: Physics and Astronomy Lines: 5 Message-ID: <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: d1w55821.kiewit.dartmouth.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: merrimack.Dartmouth.EDU 1091022497 27399 129.170.26.160 (28 Jul 2004 13:48:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@Dartmouth.EDU NNTP-Posting-Date: 28 Jul 2004 13:48:17 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.8 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!elk.ncren.net!news.bu.edu!newshost.Dartmouth.EDU!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179662 >I recall some very neat 0.1uF caps that were flat with a pin in two corners >designed to fit under a 16 pin DIL chip (or socket) Several companies made (& I think some still do) DIP sockets with 0.1 microF caps built in. ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 09:56:21 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 09:56:12 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> Lines: 17 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-1hgnzgbum5p/X+s0oucYR5MRYnPN84NI5NeWkhFx9HcxStQGkXjSUvG68mgxMvdts9PEUSsRaSxJyW2!0RhO9Pr/G21ISlvTvmoVarwQkRpgdwyraUQwAl7Lv8RAhaIkEX0srujRO7u1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179665 "Kevin G. Rhoads" wrote in message news:4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu... > >I recall some very neat 0.1uF caps that were flat with a pin in two corners > >designed to fit under a 16 pin DIL chip (or socket) > > Several companies made (& I think some still do) DIP sockets with > 0.1 microF caps built in. They are expensive, and not as effective as a simple cap supported by proper routing. I think their major market is as mistake fixers. They are better than nothing. ###### From: jmeyer@nektonresearch.com (Jim Meyer) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 28 Jul 2004 11:43:21 -0700 Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 34 Message-ID: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.12.177.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1091040201 7706 127.0.0.1 (28 Jul 2004 18:43:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 18:43:21 +0000 (UTC) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!proxad.net!postnews2.google.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179678 "Dave VanHorn" wrote in message news:<3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com>... > "Kevin G. Rhoads" wrote in message > news:4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu... > > >I recall some very neat 0.1uF caps that were flat with a pin in two > corners > > >designed to fit under a 16 pin DIL chip (or socket) > > > > Several companies made (& I think some still do) DIP sockets with > > 0.1 microF caps built in. > > They are expensive, and not as effective as a simple cap supported by proper > routing. > I think their major market is as mistake fixers. > They are better than nothing. The cap-in-socket devices that I remember were usually for wire-wrap applications in purely digital circuits. You know the ones, where a 20 by 30 matrix of TTL chips mught make one UART. (If you were lucky.) Anyway, it was always messy to add bypass caps to W-W assemblys. With those bypassed sockets, you didn't have to do anything special to get the power rails bypassed. One per chip, just like the ap notes said you were supposed to do it. It had nothing to do with fixing mistakes. It was a supremely effective device when routing was done with wire and you had to put in extra sockets with headers in order to install bypass caps and pull up/down resistors. You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence intended. Jim "Remembering when ICs were invented" Meyer ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 15:53:49 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 15:53:51 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> Lines: 22 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-2RNsOymFwDxGNRi+a9zzEJpSvBtKXsKfpbm5hxnTzuG32mR+iTyrcdndG8izxo1dYoJT2VHX9jkRNFa!j8nl9PoASahdgmM7Tp1Aklk69UMxyW30761f2cGJYJ5ojZ8qpJi7AW3epoG0 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179685 > It had nothing to do with fixing mistakes. It was a supremely > effective device when routing was done with wire and you had to put in > extra sockets with headers in order to install bypass caps and pull > up/down resistors. Well, it's better than nothing.. I used to solder the bypasses onto the WW sockets, first thing, before any other wiring goes on. I put the cap with it's body as close to the ground pin as possible. Having done that, then I would lay in the power lines, soldering them to the cap, as close to the cap's body as possible. Then the signals go in, not neatly in bundles, but directly point to point. Sometimes we used boards with ground plane, other times I had to lay that in, starred of course. > You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence intended. Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 22:25:49 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 21 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091050420 23840 80.176.76.181 (28 Jul 2004 21:33:40 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2004 21:33:40 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179688 I read in sci.electronics.design that Dave VanHorn wrote (in <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Wed, 28 Jul 2004: Someone else opined: >> You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence >intended. > >Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. For alt.folklore.computers, at least a journeyman jackanapes qualification should be a requirement for all posters. The WBTE degree confers the equivalent of Master Jackanapes status in respect of debunking responses in threads of more than four articles, on Thursdays. (;-) -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: jmeyer@nektonresearch.com (Jim Meyer) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 29 Jul 2004 06:22:36 -0700 Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 22 Message-ID: <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.12.177.6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1091107356 27789 127.0.0.1 (29 Jul 2004 13:22:36 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 13:22:36 +0000 (UTC) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.ip.ndsoftware.net!proxad.net!postnews2.google.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179725 John Woodgate wrote in message > > Someone else opined: > > >> You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence > >intended. > > > >Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. > > For alt.folklore.computers, at least a journeyman jackanapes > qualification should be a requirement for all posters. The WBTE degree > confers the equivalent of Master Jackanapes status in respect of > debunking responses in threads of more than four articles, on Thursdays. > (;-) Hmmmmm... I'm not quite sure what you said, but I'll defend your right to say it to the last drop of blood in your body. "opined?" Derived from that species of tree between npine and ppine? Jim "Doing it for money since '62" Meyer ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 08:27:17 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 08:27:26 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 13 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-eN7c1N8KrTk/7aJajCS1ZPb2Wm3Hmwl0Ew0PCeObxZydWuYHNViUf9b/Qi0Etd/u+Q11mcBxfdgpW2m!wzgx1LPAQewyDbaTYkjsDTx6ZfkN2cRglnDrn2LDTNLICn2ZkA5CckzN+syP X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179726 > > For alt.folklore.computers, at least a journeyman jackanapes > > qualification should be a requirement for all posters. The WBTE degree > > confers the equivalent of Master Jackanapes status in respect of > > debunking responses in threads of more than four articles, on Thursdays. > > (;-) > > Hmmmmm... I'm not quite sure what you said, but I'll defend your > right to say it to the last drop of blood in your body. Ok, so I'm not the only one that had trouble parsing that. :) ###### From: K Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 09:52:17 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 53 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de uXKI5xgtM6GGYs/GJypv9wBnPtPRuvjEtkGN3GuWoaIRgid9T6 X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179730 In article <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com>, dvanhorn@cedar.net says... > > > It had nothing to do with fixing mistakes. It was a supremely > > effective device when routing was done with wire and you had to put in > > extra sockets with headers in order to install bypass caps and pull > > up/down resistors. > > Well, it's better than nothing.. I'm not so sure about that. Bypass capacitors in East-Oshkosh ain't going to do Jack but take up real estate. > I used to solder the bypasses onto the WW sockets, first thing, before any > other wiring goes on. I put the cap with it's body as close to the ground > pin as possible. Having done that, then I would lay in the power lines, > soldering them to the cap, as close to the cap's body as possible. Ick! We used boards with the top and bottom plated and connected to Gnd/Vcc/Vee/whatever with machined pins in a suitable pattern for the logic of the day. We then soldered little teensie clips to the appropriate pins to connect them directly to the appropriate plane. If the design was all .300" center stuff I had boards with 20-pin footprints with pin 10 and 20 wired to Gnd/Vcc. If a 16-pin package was needed, simply short 18-19-20 with braid. After the power connections were made, we soldered the bypass caps to the VCC pin and to the ground plane, keeping leads as short as possible. Even ECL worked quite well on WW boards, as long as one followed these rules. > Then the signals go in, not neatly in bundles, but directly point to point. The best method I saw for this was the Gardner-Denver machines. Left/right/up/down until a 45 gets you to the pin of interest. This was too much trouble to do manually, so it was just shortest distance as you indicate. > Sometimes we used boards with ground plane, other times I had to lay that > in, starred of course. I learned early on to do it right. Trouble shooting power problems is no fun. It's power planes or someone else can have the fun. ;-) > > You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence > intended. > > Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. '74 ;-) (not counting my 4 years as a technician in college). -- Keith ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 09:53:35 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 09:53:45 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 38 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-fE7TrnVqS8CvMsvonDar0DYPU7tZUusoZDTgXombIJHYYWxPBAC2nDtPModIJVfZ76m840mitDJeW+m!6FDUTLnCe0XdzOg3aE0u0WcbImmV1MQO0pd/HizPTBhtREF4Ub0EQoKjfEfp X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179733 > Ick! We used boards with the top and bottom plated and connected to > Gnd/Vcc/Vee/whatever with machined pins in a suitable pattern for the > logic of the day. Never had much luck getting those. When I was into WW, I was in Hawaii. I know the boards you mean, I just never could lay hands on one. Still, just dumping current into a plane is not superior to proper bypassing. It's better than bad bypassing though. The first prototypes of the machines that stood the credit card industry on it's ear, were wire-wrapped by me. We took our standard terminal of the day, a 4 MHz Z-80 machine, tossed out everything we could live without, and put this into a hand-built lexan case that was a very close approximation of the final design. The space was rather tight, so I had to cut off the pins, and only use two spins, and no insulated wire around the posts. Even with that, the process of fitting the boards into the cases took a whole day, as I had to keep dremeling off parts of the chips to get them in there. They went from my desk, to Bill Melton's hand (Our CEO), in halliburton cases, and then directly with bill on a flight to SF, where they were presented to the board of directors at Visa. That's how the "Zon-Jr" began, and mostly what made verifone go from a few guys in a little office, to somewhere around 2000 people. > > Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. > > '74 ;-) (not counting my 4 years as a technician in college). I actually started working in electronics that same year, in high school, repairing video games. Pong doubles was new then.. But I was only counting the time from when I put on the Engineer hat. ###### From: K Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 11:13:52 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 55 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de MXcFRxhvkO91195xlD2t3AtxNoxu3jTgPh1X8wEqPEuLyUf8dI X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news1.uni-leipzig.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179736 In article , dvanhorn@cedar.net says... > > > Ick! We used boards with the top and bottom plated and connected to > > Gnd/Vcc/Vee/whatever with machined pins in a suitable pattern for the > > logic of the day. > > Never had much luck getting those. When I was into WW, I was in Hawaii. > I know the boards you mean, I just never could lay hands on one. We ordered them direct from Augat. I designed my own for one project and had Augat make 'em, for a "small" cost. They liked the layout so much they made a standard product out of it. > Still, just dumping current into a plane is not superior to proper > bypassing. > It's better than bad bypassing though. ...never said it was. Planes make proper bypassing far easier though. > The first prototypes of the machines that stood the credit card industry on > it's ear, were wire-wrapped by me. We took our standard terminal of the > day, a 4 MHz Z-80 machine, tossed out everything we could live without, and > put this into a hand-built lexan case that was a very close approximation of > the final design. The space was rather tight, so I had to cut off the pins, > and only use two spins, and no insulated wire around the posts. Even with > that, the process of fitting the boards into the cases took a whole day, as > I had to keep dremeling off parts of the chips to get them in there. I think we have a "hacker" here. ;-) I've cut pins off WW boards so they can stack denser in cages, but never cheated on the wraps. > They went from my desk, to Bill Melton's hand (Our CEO), in halliburton > cases, and then directly with bill on a flight to SF, where they were > presented to the board of directors at Visa. > > That's how the "Zon-Jr" began, and mostly what made verifone go from a few > guys in a little office, to somewhere around 2000 people. > > > > Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. > > > > '74 ;-) (not counting my 4 years as a technician in college). > > I actually started working in electronics that same year, in high school, > repairing video games. > Pong doubles was new then.. But I was only counting the time from when I put > on the Engineer hat. Same. I was a tech in college '70-'74 and an electronics (and pyrotechnics;) hobby in HS. -- Keith ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 10:35:00 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 10:35:10 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: <97udnf_0EfG5hJTcRVn-rw@comcast.com> Lines: 6 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-pAg6oNcWlLUgqmohU7Zk1fcHkcamfUAlmYgYLm86Gz4wBxZZQynjaHvgMB92NpSW6QDsQJC76XtAI/Y!WI+l12z26/faF5oQyB0D7tvcrKnQs5xisinniv9Lj7ndtG33dzYnwEryycPQ X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newspeer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179737 > I think we have a "hacker" here. ;-) Absolutely, THAT kind. ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 19:03:59 +0100 (BST) Organization: Dragonhill Systems Lines: 13 Message-ID: <20040729.1803.57040snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091127797 25601 158.152.92.150 (29 Jul 2004 19:03:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: SNews 1.31+mods(jlw030122/386) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!dsl.co.uk!bhk Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179749 On Thursday, in article krw@att.bizzzz "K Williams" wrote: > '74 ;-) (not counting my 4 years as a technician in college). Does the apostrophe stand in for the letters SN? -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "I don't use Linux. I prefer to use an OS supported by a large multi- national vendor, with a good office suite, excellent network/internet software and decent hardware support." ###### From: Gene Wirchenko Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 18:30:26 -0700 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <887jg09c9lp5g2jrfrq5p5quko5johi2lv@4ax.com> Reply-To: genew@mail.ocis.net References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 24 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179764 "Dave VanHorn" wrote: >> > For alt.folklore.computers, at least a journeyman jackanapes >> > qualification should be a requirement for all posters. The WBTE degree >> > confers the equivalent of Master Jackanapes status in respect of >> > debunking responses in threads of more than four articles, on Thursdays. >> > (;-) >> >> Hmmmmm... I'm not quite sure what you said, but I'll defend your >> right to say it to the last drop of blood in your body. > >Ok, so I'm not the only one that had trouble parsing that. >:) I parsed it fine, but what is "WBTE"? Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. ###### From: Gene Wirchenko Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 18:30:28 -0700 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <597jg01p5rvda3lr05vkr194k6f5tdm9u1@4ax.com> Reply-To: genew@mail.ocis.net References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 33 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.primus.ca!news.primus.ca!chi1.usenetserver.com!sjc1.usenetserver.com!news.usenetserver.com!sn-xit-02!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179765 jmeyer@nektonresearch.com (Jim Meyer) wrote: >John Woodgate wrote in message >> >> Someone else opined: >> >> >> You're obviously a wet behind the ears jackanapes. No offence >> >intended. >> > >> >Well, I've only been doing this stuff since '83. >> >> For alt.folklore.computers, at least a journeyman jackanapes >> qualification should be a requirement for all posters. The WBTE degree >> confers the equivalent of Master Jackanapes status in respect of >> debunking responses in threads of more than four articles, on Thursdays. >> (;-) > > Hmmmmm... I'm not quite sure what you said, but I'll defend your >right to say it to the last drop of blood in your body. > > "opined?" Derived from that species of tree between npine and >ppine? opin: var. of open: to start a conversation by stating a view. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 20:51:45 -0500 From: "Jack Peacock" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 18:51:45 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> Lines: 29 NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.18.133.20 X-Trace: sv3-S0RHRdZ15hvnOfP60e8mOR+SU7zw4otLXCosFHDBU8X0q3Ttxd38N+XWsQgft1hfS5qknOQvRq5g4lh!y9RhxzeKt4hY83xuZviKoWW5kYX9L3plEOOZ899OCb7YgOaPj815srJrZ+qNBFzkVmSS+YvMhVJi!RHw= X-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mpowercom.net!news.mpowercom.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179768 "Dave VanHorn" wrote in message news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... > The space was rather tight, so I had to cut off the pins, > and only use two spins, and no insulated wire around the posts. > While waiting for a clearance at an undisclosed location I volunteered to help out some techs wire wrapping backplanes for a project. I had done quite a bit of WW on S100 boards, so come the day I walk in with my trusty modified wrap tool ready to go. What ensued was an hours long argument on the merits of unmodified wrap (no insulation on the post) vs. modified (1-2 turns of insulation at the base). The EE claimed modified wasn't gas tight, I pointed out the posts cut into the wire exactly the same as unmodified so how was it not gas tight? He then argued it wasn't the "right way", I argued it should be as modified had better vibration tolerance (significant for reasons I can't elaborate on). His conclusion was that programmers didn't know squat about electronics and I should stick with coding. My parting shot was that my wirewrapped Z80 home system was more reliable than his company built "right way" one (he couldn't keep it running more than a month at a time, turned out his extensive use of an emulator pod, due to lack of programming skills, had worn out the CPU socket). I never cut pins though. Never know when you need that one last connection, so I always used 3-level posts. On S-100s the bus socket spacing was such that cutting pins or using 2-level posts wouldn't make a difference. I've seen wirewrapped Q-bus boards that had to use 2 level, and barely fit in the chassis. Jack Peacock ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 22:16:05 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2004 22:16:14 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: <0s2dnXWIQaHoIJTcRVn-vw@comcast.com> Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-o2Xv4I2E1IDOawT2pLEzZvpyMLFngsVQGOqG9WEMsyjfZr/w9IXpj+6K5qDVSYIMu+HKiqfcF7zaiCO!sLl826y++UTe0YkXO4ZhkDSfu5+LFoCOJDxCEY22ZHGEcv9qm6/vU5sRVbvy X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179771 > I never cut pins though. Never know when you need that one last connection, > so I always used 3-level posts. On S-100s the bus socket spacing was such > that cutting pins or using 2-level posts wouldn't make a difference. I've > seen wirewrapped Q-bus boards that had to use 2 level, and barely fit in the > chassis. > Jack Peacock Although the protos were runnable for years, they only had to last through that demo. I did know, one way or the other, that I wouldn't be adding anything to them. We had protoed the protos, on an S-100 card previously, so we knew the design was right. Pick up a Verifone Zon-Jr, and you have what that proto led to. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 06:13:52 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 11 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> <887jg09c9lp5g2jrfrq5p5quko5johi2lv@4ax.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091164948 14168 80.176.76.181 (30 Jul 2004 05:22:28 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 05:22:28 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!in2p3.fr!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179776 I read in sci.electronics.design that Gene Wirchenko wrote (in <887jg09c9lp5g2jrfrq5p5quko5johi2lv@4ax. com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Thu, 29 Jul 2004: > I parsed it fine, but what is "WBTE"? Wet Behind The Ears. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: Paul Burke Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 08:09:32 +0100 Lines: 13 Message-ID: <2mua9uFqejfuU1@uni-berlin.de> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407290522.6170528a@posting.google.com> <597jg01p5rvda3lr05vkr194k6f5tdm9u1@4ax.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de xIK8IQfVYDM+byDffPJ8oAVMnLXovqZb15IJ50bq/Sf+6KP/dI User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en, en-us In-Reply-To: <597jg01p5rvda3lr05vkr194k6f5tdm9u1@4ax.com> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179778 >> John Woodgate wrote in message >>>Someone else opined: >> "opined?" Derived from that species of tree between npine and >>ppine? > "O Pine", Prince Charles opined. Paul Burke ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 04 09:20:38 GMT Lines: 56 Message-ID: <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=J\N?_YUQ]1EMO7ZW7X@;i@0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9J:^[KE@1O@FNaRAVNS:^U:OH@:FUX1bD`Ej_dFm32bNEG X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.abs.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179782 In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, "Jack Peacock" wrote: >"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message >news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... >> The space was rather tight, so I had to cut off the pins, >> and only use two spins, and no insulated wire around the posts. >> >While waiting for a clearance at an undisclosed location I volunteered to >help out some techs wire wrapping backplanes for a project. I had done >quite a bit of WW on S100 boards, so come the day I walk in with my trusty >modified wrap tool ready to go. What ensued was an hours long argument on >the merits of unmodified wrap (no insulation on the post) vs. modified (1-2 >turns of insulation at the base). The EE claimed modified wasn't gas tight, >I pointed out the posts cut into the wire exactly the same as unmodified so >how was it not gas tight? He then argued it wasn't the "right way", I >argued it should be as modified had better vibration tolerance (significant >for reasons I can't elaborate on). His conclusion was that programmers >didn't know squat about electronics and I should stick with coding. My >parting shot was that my wirewrapped Z80 home system was more reliable than >his company built "right way" one (he couldn't keep it running more than a >month at a time, turned out his extensive use of an emulator pod, due to >lack of programming skills, had worn out the CPU socket). > >I never cut pins though. Never know when you need that one last connection, >so I always used 3-level posts. On S-100s the bus socket spacing was such >that cutting pins or using 2-level posts wouldn't make a difference. I've >seen wirewrapped Q-bus boards that had to use 2 level, and barely fit in the >chassis. That's the downside of going to college. My brother "designs" test boxes; they're the kind you walk into and do nasty stuff to your gear. He was never taught how to put his design on paper, so they take a college type to "transfer" the design into something that can be read so more boxes can be made. College type "corrects" his stuff; he takes one look at it and says "Won't work". College type wants to know why not and my brother can't tell him in terms taught in college. College type argues and my brother says, "Ok, build it." And it doesn't work. Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something else I've forgotten]. How do you train somebody to communicate this stuff on paper? /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Fri, 30 Jul 04 10:55:30 GMT Lines: 30 Message-ID: <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=U8a4bgP`odbo?iRBY^D>, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, > "Jack Peacock" wrote: >>"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message >>news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... >Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody >should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something >else I've forgotten]. I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. having a heirarchy. Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place at one time. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Sender: gregm@europa.pienet Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> From: Greg Menke Message-ID: Lines: 31 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: 30 Jul 2004 08:56:55 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 162.33.158.68 X-Complaints-To: abuse@toad.net X-Trace: news.abs.net 1091192217 162.33.158.68 (Fri, 30 Jul 2004 08:56:57 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 08:56:57 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed.mathworks.com!nntp.abs.net!news.abs.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179791 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > In article <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, > jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, > > "Jack Peacock" wrote: > >>"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message > >>news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... > > > >Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody > >should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something > >else I've forgotten]. > > I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an > new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces > three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. > > I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort > heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. > having a heirarchy. > > Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm > recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place > at one time. > Nah, the GOP brain-rot has set in. You don't have it as bad as Dubya though. Gregm ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 30 Jul 2004 17:33:43 GMT Lines: 42 Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de YMnMPFM2B/M8OScQ2D9gDA5u3mmde/7WlMuS0NALpsOFXWFcel User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179804 On Fri, 30 Jul 04 10:55:30 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >>Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody >>should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something >>else I've forgotten]. Agreed. > > I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an > new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces > three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. > > I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort > heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. > having a heirarchy. Hmm, sorting on first fields, then resorting on another? > > Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm > recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place > at one time. > Local radio here has[d] a reporter in Boston, generally Democrat sympathiser kinda, but he reported that he never saw a political gathering so controlled. PS, the world IS nuts, or rather organized under logic we don't understand. PPS, was Teddy Kennedy there?.. -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong ###### From: Patrick Scheible Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 30 Jul 2004 12:48:29 -0700 Organization: Ye 'Ol Disorganized NNTPCache groupie Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cache-Post-Path: yasure!unknown@cascadia.drizzle.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 38 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179808 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > In article <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, > jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, > > "Jack Peacock" wrote: > >>"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message > >>news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... > > > >Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody > >should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something > >else I've forgotten]. > > I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an > new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces > three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. Can I write it in Icon instead? > I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort > heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. > having a heirarchy. Even in software for libraries. Library automators like to write software that lets you look things up by keyword, and then get the user to sort through hundreds or thousands of results that are almost but not quite what they want. Several layers of subsorts -- author, title, publisher, date -- seems to be an alien concept. > Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm > recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place > at one time. I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... -- Patrick ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 17:42:05 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2004 17:42:23 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 7 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-aXaYiRd/nZINJrqYfhYC1uW08kdD6Fs1sjSLBoKeQKWni+TjMybfcTGJER5D5Jl/ahWActK010LWEuu!WVVBgo3uQ3yHaV3EX6RCLgguMwgNbQ2udZy9ajysKwHIKm+z3CMshrS5lFnN X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179817 > I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of > voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... I always knew I was smarter than average :) ###### From: Giles Todd Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 00:47:22 +0200 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: g@todd.nu Cancel-Lock: sha1:gqMLIbA/3eFIJn436MFqOytZD9k= References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-NFilter: 1.2.1-b1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 8 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!phb!nobody Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179818 On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany wrote: > Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). "Condenser", shirley. Giles. ###### From: stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb45@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.5.2 UNIX) Date: 31 Jul 2004 05:05:54 GMT Lines: 14 NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Jul 2004 05:05:54 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62-241-190-175.dsl.pipex.com X-Trace: 1091250354 news-text.dial.pipex.com 6446 62.241.190.175:22701 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!newsgate.cistron.nl!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!lnewsoutpeer01.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsinpeer01.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsoutpeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsinpeer00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179827 On 30 Jul 2004 12:48:29 -0700, Patrick Scheible wrote: > >Can I write it in Icon instead? Good heavens, is that still around? I used to use it in the old DOS days, some good ideas in there... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb .at. dial .dot. pipex .dot. com (Remove any digits from the addresses when mailing me.) The future was never like this! ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 30 Jul 04 23:25:39 -0800 Organization: http://newsguy.com Lines: 20 Message-ID: <639.707T1952T14052460@kltpzyxm.invalid> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-292.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) *UNREGISTERED* Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.tele.dk!bofh.vszbr.cz!news.radio.cz!195.85.130.72!feeder1.essentkabel.com!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news2.euro.net!newsfeed.news2me.com!newsfeed3.easynews.com!newsfeed1.easynews.com!easynews.com!easynews!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news4 Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179829 In article , g@prullenbak.todd.nu (Giles Todd) writes: >On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany > wrote: > >> Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). > >"Condenser", shirley. Over here, a condenser is what you find on the back of a refrigerator. And don't call me, surely. -- /~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! ###### From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: <20040731091953.60fc47e0.steveo@eircom.net> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.11 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.10) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 17 Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 09:19:53 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 159.134.254.200 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net 1091265361 159.134.254.200 (Sat, 31 Jul 2004 09:16:01 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 09:16:01 GMT Organization: NTT/VERIO Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!newspeer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net.POSTED!92c6ff8c!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179838 On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 00:47:22 +0200 Giles Todd wrote: > On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany > wrote: > > > Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). > > "Condenser", shirley. Shirley has a joule box ? -- C:>WIN | Solar Thermal Systems The computer obeys and wins. | http://www.soleire.com/ You lose and Bill collects. | Directable Mirror Arrays | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:43:42 +0100 Lines: 14 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> Reply-To: Nick Spalding Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de FhCpQvkT+8bWdW4DoBn/YA+ha/ohHO7eHJ7xQAAWO+/90F7Cw= X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652 X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/2.0.0.1 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!feed.news.tiscali.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179839 Giles Todd wrote, in : > On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany > wrote: > > > Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). > > "Condenser", shirley. Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was in the submarine cable business in the '50s. -- Nick Spalding ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Sat, 31 Jul 04 10:12:10 GMT Lines: 42 Message-ID: <410b81fa$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=AclFbb3S\TgheY_02;De]g0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9jWGcB=CK@AknaRAVNS:^U:o]dn:lDeLf_` X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed.mathworks.com!nntp.abs.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179844 In article , Greg Menke wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> In article <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, >> jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, >> > "Jack Peacock" wrote: >> >>"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message >> >>news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... >> >> >> >Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody >> >should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something >> >else I've forgotten]. >> >> I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an >> new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces >> three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. >> >> I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort >> heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. >> having a heirarchy. >> >> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm >> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place >> at one time. >> > >Nah, the GOP brain-rot has set in. You don't have it as bad as Dubya >though. At least I can wait a month until that happens. It is not a coincidence that, the minute they opened the doors in Fleet Center to let the Dems go home, the air became hot. I'm now testing my fancy schmancy A/C that I can move around on wheels. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Sat, 31 Jul 04 10:18:27 GMT Lines: 55 Message-ID: <410b8373$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=8=4Zbn6DSRaRAVNS:^U:?]dn:lDeLf_0 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179845 In article , greymaus@yahoo.com wrote: >On Fri, 30 Jul 04 10:55:30 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >>>Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody >>>should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something >>>else I've forgotten]. > >Agreed. > >> >> I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an >> new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces >> three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. >> >> I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort >> heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. >> having a heirarchy. > >Hmm, sorting on first fields, then resorting on another? Yup. And then seeing the "order" of the data. I always liked the times when I could (justifyably) sort bottoms-up. >> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm >> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place >> at one time. >> > > >Local radio here has[d] a reporter in Boston, generally Democrat >sympathiser kinda, but he reported that he never saw a political >gathering so controlled. It helps you lock all the Dems in one cage and the outside is wall-to-wall cops with big fucking guns. > >PS, the world IS nuts, or rather organized under logic we don't >understand. Ah, thus I have to be nuts because I'm trying to make sense of it all :-). > >PPS, was Teddy Kennedy there?.. Oh, gawd, yes, even though the younger Dem generation is trying their damnedest to ignore him. The radio report "good news" this morning. Instead of costing $50 million, the security cost $40 million. Does this mean that the $10 million will be returned to the Federal Government? /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Sat, 31 Jul 04 10:22:35 GMT Lines: 55 Message-ID: <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=GZU2bTH2O]?HRA4;a?kkA00R]m=BkYWI7:6bU3OT9S9:WGcB=CK@Ak>aRAVNS:^U:?]dn:lDeLf_0 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179846 In article , Patrick Scheible wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> In article <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, >> jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >In article <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net>, >> > "Jack Peacock" wrote: >> >>"Dave VanHorn" wrote in message >> >>news:xP-dnY_0PtvykpTcRVn-og@comcast.com... >> >> >> >Building stuff is so important even if you're a PHB. Everybody >> >should work on a farm, work on a manufacturing line, and [something >> >else I've forgotten]. >> >> I still can't remember what I've forgotten but I just added an >> new one to the list. Write a COBOL program that produces >> three reports of five fields sorted three different ways. > >Can I write it in Icon instead? If it will teach you what the purpose of sorting is...sure. > >> I am encountering people who don't seem to know what sort >> heirarchies do and the purpose of 1. doing a sort and 2. >> having a heirarchy. > >Even in software for libraries. Library automators like to write >software that lets you look things up by keyword, and then get the >user to sort through hundreds or thousands of results that are almost >but not quite what they want. Several layers of subsorts -- author, >title, publisher, date -- seems to be an alien concept. That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. > >> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm >> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place >> at one time. > >I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of >voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. Not a single Democrat does. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 13:30:23 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091277523 13500 80.176.76.181 (31 Jul 2004 12:38:43 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 12:38:43 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeeds.phibee.net!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179853 I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sat, 31 Jul 2004: >Do people know about >alphabetical order these days? There's nothing in Google and it's ilk >that requires the knowledge. There is an ITU-R Report, on the TV systems used in various countries, which has (or certainly had) the English list of countries in the alphabetical order of their FRENCH names! So for Britain, or United Kingdom, you look under 'R' (Royaume Unie)! -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: Joe Pfeiffer Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 31 Jul 2004 10:12:51 -0600 Organization: New Mexico State University Lines: 13 Message-ID: <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: viper.cs.nmsu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: bubba.nmsu.edu 1091290371 1779 128.123.64.114 (31 Jul 2004 16:12:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@bubba.nmsu.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Jul 2004 16:12:51 GMT User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!ply1.onvoy!onvoy.com!feed.news.qwest.net!lenny.tc.umn.edu!nunki.unm.edu!news.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179884 Nick Spalding writes: > > > > "Condenser", shirley. > > Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was > in the submarine cable business in the '50s. They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. -- Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer Southwestern NM Regional Science and Engr Fair: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 12:02:06 -0500 From: "Jack Peacock" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:02:05 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 41 NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.18.133.20 X-Trace: sv3-NYUvjdxxoPUN9bU3bKFZ6nCEdJLUfUX+3UK9IrFzEAs/4f0QIkRCjWHcMvwrtnlc1aiqfqwK3CoCNcl!e8QdeJweYvLDreo9n4lSxSHxWVK2g/3J9kVzKg5p7jdUcQY6Af4jxKvI6cw0NuucVsLaUYoVqwXZ!LpA= X-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mpowercom.net!news.mpowercom.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179885 wrote in message news:410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com... > That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of > people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people > know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing > in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's > nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that > knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. > Alphabetical order is an entirely arbitrary ordering, even if it is widely used. It exists only as an aid to index when mechanical/electronic search methods aern't available. Given the shift to icons instead of words perhaps the loss of alpha ordering isn't all that much of a problem. Ever try an alpha sort on chinese text? (Actually there are sort orders for chinese, based on brush strokes for the characters, or in written japanese version of chinese ideograms using the katakana alphabet, though that's not 100% reliable). How many people still use phone books? I see people call for a number every day, even though there's a phone book next to the phone. > > I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. > Not a single Democrat does. > There's Joe Lieberman and Zel Miller, but they've been all but disowned by their own party. A commentator on the radio made an interesting point the other day. From about the 1840s till 2000 there was a lot of blurring between the two major parties, conservative democrats, liberal republicans, but the parties now are as polarized as in 1800 when the two party system started with Jefferson (democrat) vs. Adams (federalist now republican). History does seem to be repeating, the election in 1800 was a tie, as in 2000. Now if Cheney were to be involved in a duel with Clinton's Sec'y of the Treasury we'd come full circle. There was a terrorist threat back in 1800 too, the Barbary pirates. Jefferson finally was forced to act, sending in the Marines at Tripoli. Jack Peacock ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 18:29:39 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091295540 2217 80.176.76.181 (31 Jul 2004 17:39:00 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 17:39:00 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179892 I read in sci.electronics.design that Jack Peacock wrote (in ) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sat, 31 Jul 2004: >There was a terrorist threat back in 1800 too, the Barbary pirates. >Jefferson finally was forced to act, sending in the Marines at Tripoli. What language do they speak in Tripoli? (;-) -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 12:29:49 -0500 From: "Jack Peacock" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:29:49 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 15 NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.18.133.20 X-Trace: sv3-ZSokvlvT9FawGGThbh5Ef+m8N4892V0eb5mHkGxxUmjfPiuYv4jKkwPCJnui/6X0afNuoFzdZHpEqnv!tAs5FSDwD076w5gNu8WAeu7HpjsCF2iDUf0fYBiGnKCHjkZFu8lcl6QiU0nccevQZTMEN7BcsKRz!4Rg= X-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mpowercom.net!news.mpowercom.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179888 "Giles Todd" wrote in message news:uujlg0hlo11f569lp4145jojhebvfr2onc@4ax.com... > "Condenser", shirley. > Was watching a show on TV about Benjamin Franklin the other day, and his electrical experiments with lightning. There was a scene recreating an 18th century lab, and in the background on the table were big glass and foil Leyden Jars. The capacitance of jars wasn't much, around 500pf, but the 400KV voltage made up for it. When did the name switch to condenser? BTW it was Franklin who invented the "+" and "-" polarity terms on capacitors today. Jack Peacock ###### From: John Larkin Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:46:25 -0700 Organization: seldom if ever Message-ID: References: <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.91/32.564 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!feed.cgocable.net!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!in.100proofnews.com!tdsnet-transit!newspeer.tds.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!news.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179895 On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:02:05 -0700, "Jack Peacock" wrote: >There was a terrorist threat back in 1800 too, the Barbary pirates. >Jefferson finally was forced to act, sending in the Marines at Tripoli. > Jack Peacock > Piracy, actually. John ###### From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sat, 31 Jul 2004 20:49:05 +0100 Lines: 16 Message-ID: <0rtng01ql4dbc4l669qptro0lcdn7ggfml@4ax.com> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> Reply-To: Nick Spalding Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de yQXLIjAze/R6oVpRKsYbxg59hKXktgmHnyVXR0xwBg7nKhk0I= X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652 X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/2.0.0.1 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179901 Joe Pfeiffer wrote, in <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu>: > Nick Spalding writes: > > > > > > "Condenser", shirley. > > > > Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was > > in the submarine cable business in the '50s. > > They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. Would those be Japanese built? I came across a reference somewhere to the effect that the Japanese still use condenser. -- Nick Spalding ###### From: Joe Pfeiffer Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 31 Jul 2004 17:05:03 -0600 Organization: New Mexico State University Lines: 18 Message-ID: <1bd62beq1s.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> <0rtng01ql4dbc4l669qptro0lcdn7ggfml@4ax.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: viper.cs.nmsu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: bubba.nmsu.edu 1091315105 18413 128.123.64.114 (31 Jul 2004 23:05:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@bubba.nmsu.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Jul 2004 23:05:05 GMT User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!msc1.onvoy!onvoy.com!lenny.tc.umn.edu!nunki.unm.edu!news.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179910 Nick Spalding writes: > > > > They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. > > Would those be Japanese built? I came across a reference somewhere to > the effect that the Japanese still use condenser. Whoops, I take it back. I was going to say that Briggs and STratton still referred to the part as a condensor (though I don't think they have any engines using them in current production) and it turns out they call them capacitors in their on-line parts catalog. My repair manual (published 1994) still says condensor, though. -- Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer Southwestern NM Regional Science and Engr Fair: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### From: Patrick Scheible Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 31 Jul 2004 18:50:30 -0700 Organization: Ye 'Ol Disorganized NNTPCache groupie Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cache-Post-Path: yasure!unknown@cascadia.drizzle.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 14 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179916 stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) writes: > On 30 Jul 2004 12:48:29 -0700, Patrick Scheible wrote: > > > >Can I write it in Icon instead? > > Good heavens, is that still around? I used to use it in the old DOS > days, some good ideas in there... Yes, it's still around, though it's in its mature phase, no longer being developed. There's also Unicon, which started with Icon, added objects and more interfaces to the OS and some other things. -- Patrick ###### From: Patrick Scheible Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 31 Jul 2004 19:02:08 -0700 Organization: Ye 'Ol Disorganized NNTPCache groupie Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cache-Post-Path: yasure!unknown@cascadia.drizzle.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 30 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179917 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of > people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people > know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing > in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's > nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that > knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. Phone books, you say? There are several online phone directories, none of which require looking through an alphabetical list... Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an initial articles (a, an, the) explained. > >> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm > >> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place > >> at one time. > > > >I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of > >voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... > > I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. > Not a single Democrat does. Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad had unfinished business with? -- Patrick ###### From: stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb45@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.5.2 UNIX) Date: 01 Aug 2004 08:22:00 GMT Lines: 21 NNTP-Posting-Date: 01 Aug 2004 08:22:00 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62-241-188-226.dsl.pipex.com X-Trace: 1091348520 news-text.dial.pipex.com 6451 62.241.188.226:24664 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!nntpfeed.zonnet.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news-out2.kabelfoon.nl!83.128.0.10.MISMATCH!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!195.129.110.21.MISMATCH!bnewsfeed00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsinpeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179929 On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:29:49 -0700, Jack Peacock wrote: >"Giles Todd" wrote in message >news:uujlg0hlo11f569lp4145jojhebvfr2onc@4ax.com... >> "Condenser", shirley. >> >Was watching a show on TV about Benjamin Franklin the other day, and his >electrical experiments with lightning. There was a scene recreating an 18th >century lab, and in the background on the table were big glass and foil >Leyden Jars. The capacitance of jars wasn't much, around 500pf, but the >400KV voltage made up for it. When did the name switch to condenser? It had switched by 1892 - as far back as I could locate quickly, (in American Telegraphy, William Maver Jr.). The Jar as a unit of capacitance was in use up until WW2. -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb .at. dial .dot. pipex .dot. com (Remove any digits from the addresses when mailing me.) The future was never like this! ###### From: stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb45@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.5.2 UNIX) Date: 01 Aug 2004 08:22:01 GMT Lines: 18 NNTP-Posting-Date: 01 Aug 2004 08:22:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62-241-188-226.dsl.pipex.com X-Trace: 1091348521 news-text.dial.pipex.com 6451 62.241.188.226:24664 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news-out2.kabelfoon.nl!83.128.0.10.MISMATCH!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!195.129.110.21.MISMATCH!bnewsfeed00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsinpeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179930 On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:02:05 -0700, Jack Peacock wrote: > >A commentator on the radio made an interesting point the other day. From >about the 1840s till 2000 there was a lot of blurring between the two major >parties, conservative democrats, liberal republicans, but the parties now >are as polarized as in 1800 when the two party system started with Jefferson >(democrat) vs. Adams (federalist now republican). Here in the UK the opposite is happening - it's getting increasingly difficult to detect any difference between the three main parties. The faces change but the politics remain much the same. -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb .at. dial .dot. pipex .dot. com (Remove any digits from the addresses when mailing me.) The future was never like this! ###### From: stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb45@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.5.2 UNIX) Date: 01 Aug 2004 09:18:01 GMT Lines: 23 NNTP-Posting-Date: 01 Aug 2004 09:18:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62-241-189-166.dsl.pipex.com X-Trace: 1091351881 news-text.dial.pipex.com 6448 62.241.189.166:24690 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!uio.no!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!lnewsoutpeer01.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsinpeer01.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsoutpeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsinpeer00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179933 On 31 Jul 2004 18:50:30 -0700, Patrick Scheible wrote: >stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) writes: > >> On 30 Jul 2004 12:48:29 -0700, Patrick Scheible wrote: >> > >> >Can I write it in Icon instead? >> >> Good heavens, is that still around? I used to use it in the old DOS >> days, some good ideas in there... > >Yes, it's still around, though it's in its mature phase, no longer >being developed. There's also Unicon, which started with Icon, added >objects and more interfaces to the OS and some other things. Yea, after I sent my messages I had a goolgle and found the unix version of Icon which I've been playing with. -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb .at. dial .dot. pipex .dot. com (Remove any digits from the addresses when mailing me.) The future was never like this! ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Sun, 01 Aug 04 10:42:14 GMT Lines: 77 Message-ID: <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=LeC>5OQL7fKUMoj`]U1Sc@0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9JWGcB=CK@AkNaRAVNS:^U:OK1T>n=1>ABOk2, "Jack Peacock" wrote: > wrote in message >news:410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com... >> That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of >> people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people >> know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing >> in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's >> nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that >> knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. >> >Alphabetical order is an entirely arbitrary ordering, even if it is widely >used. It exists only as an aid to index when mechanical/electronic search >methods aern't available. Huh? How do those mechanical/electronic search methods find an item without sort of some flavor? > .. Given the shift to icons instead of words perhaps >the loss of alpha ordering isn't all that much of a problem. Ever try an >alpha sort on chinese text? (Actually there are sort orders for chinese, >based on brush strokes for the characters, or in written japanese version of >chinese ideograms using the katakana alphabet, though that's not 100% >reliable). > >How many people still use phone books? [emoticon raises hand] At least one..and my mom and dad and aunts and uncles and brothers and sisters. Not kids. > .. I see people call for a number every >day, even though there's a phone book next to the phone. Not in my family. Since Mom lives in Holland, she's asked to get the latest phone books and gives them to all the relatives living in Allegan. >> >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >> Not a single Democrat does. >> >There's Joe Lieberman and Zel Miller, but they've been all but disowned by >their own party. Yup. I saw a glimmer of hope went the commission report came out. Time will tell if they hold any special sessions. > >A commentator on the radio made an interesting point the other day. From >about the 1840s till 2000 there was a lot of blurring between the two major >parties, conservative democrats, liberal republicans, but the parties now >are as polarized as in 1800 when the two party system started with Jefferson >(democrat) vs. Adams (federalist now republican). History does seem to be >repeating, the election in 1800 was a tie, as in 2000. Now if Cheney were >to be involved in a duel with Clinton's Sec'y of the Treasury we'd come full >circle. I bet, if you looked, you could find a duel of some flavor. The treasurer was swung-doored over to BofA, wasn't he? > >There was a terrorist threat back in 1800 too, the Barbary pirates. >Jefferson finally was forced to act, sending in the Marines at Tripoli. I read about that in the US Navy history book I found at the dump. I thought those "pirates" were bandits doing illegal. Turned out they were getting paid by governments. I just found a book about the Dutch Republic and written in 1855. It picks up where the book I just read about the Medici left off. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Sun, 01 Aug 04 10:46:54 GMT Lines: 46 Message-ID: <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=T>7^_`Jl?T4Uc?a==OWl]90R]m=BkYWI7:6bU3OT9S9:WGcB=CK@Ak>aRAVNS:^U:?K1T>n=1>AB?k2, Patrick Scheible wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of >> people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people >> know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing >> in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's >> nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that >> knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. > >Phone books, you say? There are several online phone directories, >none of which require looking through an alphabetical list... > >Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need >to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an >initial articles (a, an, the) explained. At least they know what a sort is. I'm trying to explain the difference between sorting data that is in a field and data picked up based on an address in a field. The people who are now yelling at me think that the latter is a sort. They seem to have no concept of address, contents of an address, data vs address, indirection, etc. > >> >> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm >> >> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place >> >> at one time. >> > >> >I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of >> >voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... >> >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >> Not a single Democrat does. > >Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad >had unfinished business with? You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their nuclear bomb research back on? /BAH ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 13:32:08 +0100 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 68 Message-ID: <1091363529.494644@teapot.planet.gong> References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091363529 28448 80.177.7.220 (1 Aug 2004 12:32:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 12:32:09 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031208 Cache-Post-Path: teapot.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.1.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!fr.ip.ndsoftware.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179949 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > In article , > Patrick Scheible wrote: > >>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> >> >>>That sure seems to be the case. Is this another side effect of >>>people going online? I just had a waking nightmare...Do people >>>know about alphabetical order these days? There's nothing >>>in Google and it's ilk that requires the knowledge. There's >>>nothing in the online library catalogue that requires that >>>knowledge. About the only thing left is phone books. >> >>Phone books, you say? There are several online phone directories, >>none of which require looking through an alphabetical list... >> >>Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need >>to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an >>initial articles (a, an, the) explained. > At least they know what a sort is. I'm trying to explain the > difference between sorting data that is in a field and > data picked up based on an address in a field. The people > who are now yelling at me think that the latter is a sort. > They seem to have no concept of address, contents of an > address, data vs address, indirection, etc. > >>>>> Either I'm going nuts, the world is going nuts, or I'm >>>>> recovering from hearing too many Democrats in one place >>>>>at one time. >>>> >>>>I think the world is going nuts, as demonstrated by over 40% of >>>>voters saying they'll vote for the current administration again... >>> >>>I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >>>Not a single Democrat does. >> >>Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad >>had unfinished business with? > You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened > just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their > nuclear bomb research back on? I doubt that losing < 100 Phillipinos has had much of an impact on that particular bit of decision making. Following Iranian decision making is difficult because it has several power-centres, quite unlike say the UK or the US where the government is "king" as it were. Anyways, back to fighting the clouds of confusion that plague BAH... As far as that particular decision goes I suspect that they think they were next on the list anyway so they may as well continue. It is possible that they aren't actually making nuclear weapons, but in truth I suspect that Iran will be sorely tempted to follow Pakistan's example. Pakistan has been richly rewarded by the US since it developed missiles capable of delivering nuclear warheads to Tel Aviv. Cheers, Rupert ###### Sender: gregm@europa.pienet Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> From: Greg Menke Message-ID: Lines: 26 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: 01 Aug 2004 09:45:07 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 162.33.158.68 X-Complaints-To: abuse@toad.net X-Trace: news.abs.net 1091367909 162.33.158.68 (Sun, 01 Aug 2004 09:45:09 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 09:45:09 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed.mathworks.com!nntp.abs.net!news.abs.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179951 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > In article , > Patrick Scheible wrote: > >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> > >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. > >> Not a single Democrat does. > > > >Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad > >had unfinished business with? > > You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened > just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their > nuclear bomb research back on? > If Iran is the threat then why are we fooling around in Iraq? Oh thats right, Iran isn't on the Axis Of Evil. And 50 something non-combat personnel going home a month or so early has actually made a material difference in anything other than Dubya's PR? Really, BAH, this one isn't up to your usual standard of ideological zeal. Gregm ###### From: Patrick Scheible Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 01 Aug 2004 10:40:12 -0700 Organization: Ye 'Ol Disorganized NNTPCache groupie Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Cache-Post-Path: yasure!unknown@cascadia.drizzle.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b5 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-02!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179959 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened > just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their > nuclear bomb research back on? I think it has more to do with observing the fate of North Korea (very close to having a bomb now) vs. the fate of Iraq (no prospects of having a bomb in the near future). Clearly from Iran's point of view the best thing for a small country that the U.S. doesn't like much is to get a bomb as quickly as possible. -- Patrick ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 12:52:15 -0500 From: "Jack Peacock" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <1091363529.494644@teapot.planet.gong> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 10:52:14 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 25 NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.18.133.20 X-Trace: sv3-Ig9m3ZlIhCk513New2mYc1jKs6uU7swv/Rrkc0rT3Vp75dqt8U5bLHsDpQ0SJiSKPDsflVJv2h9cpRW!B1F34FaKA42bJTMnoYWnM//vvzhWkm5NYdmdqEmSih4Pis627JlwxEaz8RdwfqSuP3W4PvP4OPKZ!xyM= X-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: abuse@mpowercom.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mpowercom.net!news.mpowercom.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179962 "Rupert Pigott" wrote in message news:1091363529.494644@teapot.planet.gong... > Pakistan has been richly rewarded by the US > since it developed missiles capable of delivering nuclear warheads > to Tel Aviv. > I doubt any of those missles are aimed to the west. Pakistan has far more important targets much closer to home. In any case Israel has sufficient nuclear deterrent capability. Considering Israel now has some of the best of the old soviet design teams does anyone really doubt their fusion warheads won't work? Pakistan is a long way from matching the facilities in the Negev. Pakistan was not rewarded for going nuclear. For starters the US seized an order of critically needed fighters about to be sent to Pakistan, in order to give them some parity with the Indian air force's new MiG-29s. Pragmatism won out over principle when the war broke out in Afghanistan, so now Pakistan is an ally again. I'm under no illusion it will last, or that it's based on anything other than a desperate need for Pakistan to have someone backing them against India. The day the Kashmir border problem is solved I expect a terse notice that the US presence is no longer appreciated. Jack Peacock ###### From: John Larkin Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 11:04:27 -0700 Organization: seldom if ever Message-ID: References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.91/32.564 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 31 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.space.net!newsfeed.vmunix.org!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!news.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179965 On 01 Aug 2004 08:22:01 GMT, stanb45@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) wrote: >On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:02:05 -0700, Jack Peacock wrote: >> >>A commentator on the radio made an interesting point the other day. From >>about the 1840s till 2000 there was a lot of blurring between the two major >>parties, conservative democrats, liberal republicans, but the parties now >>are as polarized as in 1800 when the two party system started with Jefferson >>(democrat) vs. Adams (federalist now republican). > >Here in the UK the opposite is happening - it's getting increasingly difficult >to detect any difference between the three main parties. The faces change but >the politics remain much the same. The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the difference between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not very differentiated as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, but the Inside the Beltway power games attempt to polarize and overstate the situation. The recent Democratic convention had a glorious war hero offering us business incentives, lower defecits, and increased military spending; who woulda thunk it? I suspect the Repubs will pitch senior drug benefits and education to balance things up. They both know they must play to the center, because they both know there *is* a center. Simultaneous polarization and centralization make for some interesting absurdities. John ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 19:07:05 +0100 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 22 Message-ID: <1091383625.449975@teapot.planet.gong> References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <1091363529.494644@teapot.planet.gong> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091383625 22563 80.177.7.220 (1 Aug 2004 18:07:05 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 18:07:05 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; FreeBSD i386; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031208 Cache-Post-Path: teapot.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.1.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.zanker.org!news.amigo.co.uk!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!mutlu.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179966 Jack Peacock wrote: > "Rupert Pigott" wrote in > message news:1091363529.494644@teapot.planet.gong... > >>Pakistan has been richly rewarded by the US >>since it developed missiles capable of delivering nuclear warheads >>to Tel Aviv. >> > I doubt any of those missles are aimed to the west. Pakistan has > far more > important targets much closer to home. In any case Israel has sufficient They did actually make a point that while they were primarily intended for India, they could in fact hit Tel Aviv. He was quite explicit about that. I really wouldn't want to play chicken at that level to be honest. :P Cheers, Rupert ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 19:20:24 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 15 Message-ID: <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091384855 20205 80.176.76.181 (1 Aug 2004 18:27:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 18:27:35 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!mephistopheles.news.clara.net!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179969 I read in sci.electronics.design that John Larkin wrote (in ) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sun, 1 Aug 2004: >The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the difference >between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not very differentiated >as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of this thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite polarities. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: Giles Todd Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2004 23:34:21 +0200 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <25oqg0hc1av2r908gju900fh4f2m415nnt@4ax.com> Reply-To: g@todd.nu Cancel-Lock: sha1:ENGApazlmNVsSuInWDG2a2xV44g= References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-NFilter: 1.2.1-b1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 27 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!newsgate.cistron.nl!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!phb!nobody Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:179979 On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 10:29:49 -0700, "Jack Peacock" wrote: > Was watching a show on TV about Benjamin Franklin the other day, and his > electrical experiments with lightning. There was a scene recreating an 18th > century lab, and in the background on the table were big glass and foil > Leyden Jars. The capacitance of jars wasn't much, around 500pf, but the > 400KV voltage made up for it. When did the name switch to condenser? OED2 offers the following citations: 1782 Volta in Phil. Trans. LXXII. App. 8, I had rather call it a condenser of electricity..using a word which expresses at once the reason and cause of the phenomenon. 1790 W. Nicholson Nat. Philos. (ed. 3) II. 356 The condenser is of excellent use to ascertain the presence..of atmospherical electricity when the conductor is..slightly electrified. 1881 Spottiswoode in Nature No. 623. 546 We have Leyden jars or condensers for accumulating large charges. 1881 Maxwell Electr. & Magn. I. 50 Accumulators are sometimes called Condensers, but I prefer to restrict the term ‘condenser’ to an instrument which is used not to hold electricity but to increase its superficial density. 1943 Gloss. Terms Electr. Engin. (B.S.I.) 27 Capacitor, condenser, a piece of apparatus capable of storing electrical energy as electric stress in insulating material. 1968 Practical Motorist Oct. 205 Condenser or Capacitor. Giles. ###### Message-ID: <410DBA2C.B38DA1B1@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 17 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:02:57 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.143.54 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091426577 12.76.143.54 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:02:57 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:02:57 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180006 Giles Todd wrote: > On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany > >> Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). > > "Condenser", shirley. Are you sitting on the puffs in front of your cadenza wielding your mike. -- "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind." - Bush. "Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes. ###### From: Rich Grise Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> Lines: 20 Organization: As Little as Possible User-Agent: KNode/0.7.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Message-ID: Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:08:25 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 4.11.179.74 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verizon.net X-Trace: nwrddc04.gnilink.net 1091426905 4.11.179.74 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 02:08:25 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 02:08:25 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newshosting.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!spamkiller.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!nwrddc04.gnilink.net.POSTED!dd653b87!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180008 John Woodgate wrote: > I read in sci.electronics.design that John Larkin techTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote (in 4ax.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sun, 1 Aug 2004: > >>The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the difference >>between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not very differentiated >>as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, > > This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of this > thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite polarities. Mr. Woodgate, have I noted a new little twinkle in your eye these past few days? Whatever it is you're doing, please keep it up! ;-) Cheers! Rich ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:20:51 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 19 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <410DBA2C.B38DA1B1@yahoo.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091427835 26666 80.176.76.181 (2 Aug 2004 06:23:55 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 06:23:55 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news2.telebyte.nl!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!mephistopheles.news.clara.net!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180010 I read in sci.electronics.design that CBFalconer wrote (in <410DBA2C.B38DA1B1@yahoo.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: >Giles Todd wrote: >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany >> >>> Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). >> >> "Condenser", shirley. > >Are you sitting on the puffs in front of your cadenza wielding your >mike. Is that supposed to be British English? -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:28:58 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091428436 27238 80.176.76.181 (2 Aug 2004 06:33:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 06:33:56 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.zanker.org!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180011 I read in sci.electronics.design that Rich Grise wrote (in ) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: >Mr. Woodgate, have I noted a new little twinkle in your eye these past >few days? Whatever it is you're doing, please keep it up! ;-) I'll try to, but sooner or later Bill Sloman will object. (;-) -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: xray Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 08:29:58 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.142.86.150 X-Complaints-To: abuse@sonic.net X-Trace: typhoon.sonic.net 1091435398 64.142.86.150 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 01:29:58 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 01:29:58 PDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!HSNX.atgi.net!feed.news.sonic.net!typhoon.sonic.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180015 On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 19:20:24 +0100, John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that John Larkin techTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote (in 4ax.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sun, 1 Aug 2004: > >>The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the difference >>between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not very differentiated >>as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, > >This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of this >thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite polarities. But only due to transitions, no? The political decoupling caps must be very large to respond to the typically slow political transitions. Umm, but I forgot about noise. There is always lots of noise to decouple, and maybe some degree of poor decoupling is what allows slow transitions. Does this also explain why during periods of rapid changes there is a big increase in Current affairs posts? ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 04 09:37:43 GMT Lines: 22 Message-ID: <410e1cfa$0$2827$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=J5G@C4X>?h`>8FBk0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9jW0h^G2EO\OjaRAVNS:^U:oGKgOgT2lNAcj_dFm32bNEg X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.abs.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180019 In article , Patrick Scheible wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened >> just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their >> nuclear bomb research back on? > >I think it has more to do with observing the fate of North Korea (very >close to having a bomb now) vs. the fate of Iraq (no prospects of >having a bomb in the near future). Clearly from Iran's point of view >the best thing for a small country that the U.S. doesn't like much is >to get a bomb as quickly as possible. It also has to do with the UN being completely ineffectual. When the US is portrayed as being weakened, the extremists think that, if they just make a few more messes, they'll win and have the power and means to destroy western civilization. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 04 09:39:37 GMT Lines: 19 Message-ID: <410e1d6c$0$2827$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=nG0Em[_LKKHXRnZBHDoMYH0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9JW0h^G2EO\OJaRAVNS:^U:OGKgOgT2lNACj_dFm32bNEG X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!newshosting.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.abs.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180020 In article <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk>, John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that John Larkin techTHISnologyPLEASE.com> wrote (in 4ax.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Sun, 1 Aug 2004: > >>The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the difference >>between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not very differentiated >>as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, > >This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of this >thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite polarities. ROTFLMAO. Beaauuuutiful. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: Rich Grise Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> Lines: 12 Organization: As Little as Possible User-Agent: KNode/0.7.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Message-ID: Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 10:20:30 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 4.11.179.74 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verizon.net X-Trace: nwrddc02.gnilink.net 1091442030 4.11.179.74 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:20:30 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:20:30 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!spamkiller.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!nwrddc02.gnilink.net.POSTED!dd653b87!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180017 xray wrote: >>This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of this >>thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite polarities. > > But only due to transitions, no? The political decoupling caps must be > very large to respond to the typically slow political transitions. Umm, > but I forgot about noise. There is always lots of noise to decouple, and > maybe some degree of poor decoupling is what allows slow transitions. > Here, I t'ought dis poor decoupling was part of da gay mairridge problem? ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 04 10:39:24 GMT Lines: 51 Message-ID: <410e2b6f$0$2827$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=l`ohm@ZIkfD]9oWW3:4Y5M0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9JW0h^G2EO\OJaRAVNS:^U:OGKgOgT2lNACj_dFm32bNEG X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.abs.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180036 [spit] I don't think those guys want to read this. In article , Mikko Nahkola wrote: >In article <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> Patrick Scheible wrote: >>>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >>>Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need >>>to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an >>>initial articles (a, an, the) explained. > >> At least they know what a sort is. I'm trying to explain the >> difference between sorting data that is in a field and >> data picked up based on an address in a field. The people >> who are now yelling at me think that the latter is a sort. > >But, surely, a sort based on an indirect reference is still a sort? Only if there's a heirarchy imposed based on the characteristics of the data in a field....I would think. Here's the fight. A guy is retrieving posts and arranging them based on the list of message-ids listed in the reference line. He interchanges the term threading and sorting. I objected to his using the term sorting. I also objected because I noticed that he and a couple others are posting from an OS newsgroup and I got alarmed. They have never heard of the term sift. Didn't we use to do a data sift? My memory has gone and I can't recall a any conversation or its context when the guys used to term. >Sure, you need to have several sets of data to do that right, and it's >much more difficult to do if you want meaningful results, but ... I wouldn't call that a sort. I'd call it a collation or a merge or a retrieval list. > >> They seem to have no concept of address, contents of an >> address, data vs address, indirection, etc. > >Someone forgot to have a basic lesson? On the contrary, I'm getting called a fraud, stupid, uninformed, accused of spreading technobabble and ignorant of how code works. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <7c584d27.0408020400.2a87f16d@posting.google.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 04 10:48:31 GMT Lines: 24 Message-ID: <410e2d92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=JecfPfWXj_fheY_02;De]g0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9jn543_VTFR>haRAVNS:^U:oGKgOgT2lNAck2, bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill Sloman) wrote: >John Woodgate wrote in message news:... >> I read in sci.electronics.design that Rich Grise >> wrote (in ) about 'History of >> decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: >> >> >Mr. Woodgate, have I noted a new little twinkle in your eye these past >> >few days? Whatever it is you're doing, please keep it up! ;-) >> >> I'll try to, but sooner or later Bill Sloman will object. (;-) > >Perhaps not - John Woodgate does seem to be incorrigible. I do wonder >where he finds his decoupling capacitors for accomodating differences >in political polarity, but actually asking him would most likely just >trigger another play on words, justified only by facility of >prestidigitation. But can I buy one? /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 04 10:52:47 GMT Lines: 45 Message-ID: <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=RE@nK4XTc=e9AUn^oZf75j0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9jn543_VTFR>haRAVNS:^U:oGKgOgT2lNAck2, Greg Menke wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > > >> In article , >> Patrick Scheible wrote: >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> >> >> >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >> >> Not a single Democrat does. >> > >> >Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad >> >had unfinished business with? >> >> You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened >> just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their >> nuclear bomb research back on? >> > >If Iran is the threat then why are we fooling around in Iraq? It is a logical second step when tactics and strategy are contemplated. Why physically fight with people when an example next door might work? Getting Iraq back on its economic and production feet is also a win. When the next door neighbor flourishes because of access to middle class attainment, the poorer neighbors will want to do the same things. Iran's populace already wants to get into the middle class game; it's leaders don't want to because they might lose control of their power. /BAH > .. Oh >thats right, Iran isn't on the Axis Of Evil. And 50 something >non-combat personnel going home a month or so early has actually made >a material difference in anything other than Dubya's PR? Really, BAH, >this one isn't up to your usual standard of ideological zeal. > >Gregm > Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: Mikko Nahkola Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: mnahkola@trein.ntc.nokia.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Lines: 27 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 11:02:33 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 172.22.106.178 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@nokia.com X-Trace: news2.nokia.com 1091444553 172.22.106.178 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 14:02:33 EET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 14:02:33 EET DST Organization: Nokia Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!uio.no!newsfeed.kolumbus.fi!feeder2.news.jippii.net!feeder1.news.jippii.net!nntp.inet.fi!inet.fi!newsfeed1.nokia.com!news1.nokia.com!news2.nokia.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180021 In article <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > Patrick Scheible wrote: >>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >>Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need >>to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an >>initial articles (a, an, the) explained. > At least they know what a sort is. I'm trying to explain the > difference between sorting data that is in a field and > data picked up based on an address in a field. The people > who are now yelling at me think that the latter is a sort. But, surely, a sort based on an indirect reference is still a sort? Sure, you need to have several sets of data to do that right, and it's much more difficult to do if you want meaningful results, but ... > They seem to have no concept of address, contents of an > address, data vs address, indirection, etc. Someone forgot to have a basic lesson? -- Mikko Nahkola #include #Not speaking for my employer. No warranty. YMMV. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: Mikko Nahkola Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: mnahkola@trein.ntc.nokia.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Lines: 27 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 11:02:33 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 172.22.106.178 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@nokia.com X-Trace: news2.nokia.com 1091444553 172.22.106.178 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 14:02:33 EET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 14:02:33 EET DST Organization: Nokia Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.arcor.de!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feeder2.news.jippii.net!feeder1.news.jippii.net!nntp.inet.fi!inet.fi!newsfeed1.nokia.com!news1.nokia.com!news2.nokia.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180022 In article , John Woodgate wrote: > I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in >>Do people know about >>alphabetical order these days? There's nothing in Google and it's ilk >>that requires the knowledge. > There is an ITU-R Report, on the TV systems used in various countries, > which has (or certainly had) the English list of countries in the > alphabetical order of their FRENCH names! So for Britain, or United > Kingdom, you look under 'R' (Royaume Unie)! Um. Is it bad that I could think of a context where that _would_ make sense? In a way like "try this for reproducing the bug"... There's a rule that in various international contexts (flagpoles with every participant country's flag, that sort of thing) the countries are arranged in the alphabetical order of their French names. Or alternatively it could be that they forgot to re-sort after translating it from French. -- Mikko Nahkola #include #Not speaking for my employer. No warranty. YMMV. ###### From: bill.sloman@ieee.org (Bill Sloman) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 2 Aug 2004 05:00:07 -0700 Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 18 Message-ID: <7c584d27.0408020400.2a87f16d@posting.google.com> References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.131.10.18 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1091448007 27821 127.0.0.1 (2 Aug 2004 12:00:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 12:00:07 +0000 (UTC) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!postnews2.google.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180038 John Woodgate wrote in message news:... > I read in sci.electronics.design that Rich Grise > wrote (in ) about 'History of > decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: > > >Mr. Woodgate, have I noted a new little twinkle in your eye these past > >few days? Whatever it is you're doing, please keep it up! ;-) > > I'll try to, but sooner or later Bill Sloman will object. (;-) Perhaps not - John Woodgate does seem to be incorrigible. I do wonder where he finds his decoupling capacitors for accomodating differences in political polarity, but actually asking him would most likely just trigger another play on words, justified only by facility of prestidigitation. ----- Bill Sloman, Nijmegen ###### Message-ID: <410E3088.70CCE448@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 12:55:54 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.143.211 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091451354 12.76.143.211 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 12:55:54 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 12:55:54 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!wn13feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180048 John Woodgate wrote: > John Larkin wrote: > >> The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the >> difference between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not >> very differentiated as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, > > This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of > this thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite > polarities. The unit in question is "coupling impudence". -- "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind." - Bush. "Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes. ###### Sender: gregm@europa.pienet Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> From: Greg Menke Message-ID: Lines: 58 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: 02 Aug 2004 09:07:45 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 162.33.158.68 X-Complaints-To: abuse@toad.net X-Trace: news.abs.net 1091452067 162.33.158.68 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 09:07:47 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 09:07:47 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newshosting.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!diablo.voicenet.com!nntp.abs.net!news.abs.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180051 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > In article , > Greg Menke wrote: > >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > > > > > >> In article , > >> Patrick Scheible wrote: > >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> >> > >> >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. > >> >> Not a single Democrat does. > >> > > >> >Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad > >> >had unfinished business with? > >> > >> You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened > >> just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their > >> nuclear bomb research back on? > >> > > > >If Iran is the threat then why are we fooling around in Iraq? > > It is a logical second step when tactics and strategy are > contemplated. Why physically fight with people when an > example next door might work? Getting Iraq back on its > economic and production feet is also a win. When the next > door neighbor flourishes because of access to middle class > attainment, the poorer neighbors will want to do the same > things. Iran's populace already wants to get into the > middle class game; it's leaders don't want to because they > might lose control of their power. > Are you really crediting the current bunch in the White House with that much subtlety? Is it really a logical second step to be building infrastructure in Iraq while we cut funding for it in the US? And if you think Iraq is going to resemble a "functional county" anytime in the next decade without the US spending 10's of billions of dollars, the loss of hundreds of US lives and several hundreds of Iraqii lives every year, then I'm afraid whatever it is you're smoking is clouding your judgement. Fact is, we'll be lucky if we can even make Iraq look like Iran- brutal religious dictatorship and all. If we're not lucky, then when we get sick of it after a few years of attempted nationbuilding, we'll put some horror into power to at least minimize how many US resources are stuck over there. And then we'll watch the ethnic cleansing and internecine warfare destroy most everything we financed the construction of. But at least you'll be able to take comfort in the fact that Halliburton, Bechtel et al secured their profits while they could. Gregm ###### From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:38:15 +0100 Lines: 21 Message-ID: References: <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: Nick Spalding Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de eBCp1HBR+qlpkVLpoTO1lQCogsFpC2AdJv5ZLoZF7iXhlxt0o= X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652 X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/2.0.0.1 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180053 John Woodgate wrote, in : > I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in > <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling > capacitors', on Sat, 31 Jul 2004: > >Do people know about > >alphabetical order these days? There's nothing in Google and it's ilk > >that requires the knowledge. > > There is an ITU-R Report, on the TV systems used in various countries, > which has (or certainly had) the English list of countries in the > alphabetical order of their FRENCH names! So for Britain, or United > Kingdom, you look under 'R' (Royaume Unie)! The ITU started life as the International Telegraph Union in 1865 and was based in Paris. Its working language was French. It morphed into the present I Telecommunications U in 1947. -- Nick Spalding ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Mikko Nahkola Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2b6f$0$2827$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: mnahkola@trein.ntc.nokia.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: User-Agent: slrn/0.9.7.4 (Linux) Lines: 81 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:02:33 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 172.22.106.178 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@nokia.com X-Trace: news2.nokia.com 1091458953 172.22.106.178 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 18:02:33 EET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 18:02:33 EET DST Organization: Nokia Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!zen.net.uk!dedekind.zen.co.uk!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feeder2.news.jippii.net!feeder1.news.jippii.net!nntp.inet.fi!inet.fi!newsfeed1.nokia.com!news1.nokia.com!news2.nokia.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180054 In article <410e2b6f$0$2827$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > Mikko Nahkola wrote: >>In article <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com > wrote: >>> Patrick Scheible wrote: >>>>Our undergrads understand alphabetizing by one field, but most need >>>>to have subsorting explained. Many of them also need disregarding an >>>>initial articles (a, an, the) explained. >>> At least they know what a sort is. I'm trying to explain the >>> difference between sorting data that is in a field and >>> data picked up based on an address in a field. The people >>> who are now yelling at me think that the latter is a sort. >>But, surely, a sort based on an indirect reference is still a sort? > Only if there's a heirarchy imposed based on the characteristics > of the data in a field....I would think. Um. Therefore the determining criteria would include details beyond the immediate scope of the process as seen from the inside, as there is no way to determine whether or not such a hierarchy could exist otherwise, or whether or not such a hierarchy would be in any way meaningful. That is, you can use the ISO 9899 qsort() even if the operation wouldn't be a proper sort..? (the thing takes an array of data, and a pointer to an user-supplied thing that's supposed to tell it which of two members should be first.) (I think we had a bit of fun with such a case in a programming class once - the teacher wanted us to figure out how to roll our own, and didn't like it when I tried to rely on a standard part of the system runtime that he hadn't taught about yet.) > Here's the fight. A guy is retrieving posts and arranging them > based on the list of message-ids listed in the reference line. > He interchanges the term threading and sorting. I objected to > his using the term sorting. Well, to be honest, I've seen that usage often enough already - usually in the application's user interface. "Sort by: Date, Author, Subject, Thread" ... Oh well. We did know already that user-interface designers don't pay all that much attention to proper vocabulary - indeed, I've seen worse. Someone was good enough to make it "Arrange by: " ... sort of better, right? > They have never heard of the term sift. Didn't we use to > do a data sift? My memory has gone and I can't recall a > any conversation or its context when the guys used to term. I've never seen that in a computing context. But what do I know. >>Sure, you need to have several sets of data to do that right, and it's >>much more difficult to do if you want meaningful results, but ... > I wouldn't call that a sort. I'd call it a collation or a merge > or a retrieval list. Well, the distinctions between "sort" and "collate" aren't that specific after all - checking a couple of dictionaries here ... And both do translate to the same word in my native language too. Duh. Yes, "collate" would be more correct it seems. But it's a bigger word, thus it won't be used ... However, the end result could still be referred to as "sorted" it seems from the dictionary definitions..? And these are really just possibly overlapping subsets of "arranging" stuff. -- Mikko Nahkola #include #Not speaking for my employer. No warranty. YMMV. ###### Message-ID: <410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:34 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.139.180 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091459914 12.76.139.180 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:34 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:34 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!c03.atl99!c01.usenetserver.com!news.usenetserver.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180056 Mikko Nahkola wrote: > ... snip ... > > There's a rule that in various international contexts (flagpoles > with every participant country's flag, that sort of thing) the > countries are arranged in the alphabetical order of their French > names. The Olympics opening march uses the order of the host country language, with the host country proper last. IIRC -- "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind." - Bush. "Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes. ###### Message-ID: <410E5829.869B5667@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <410DBA2C.B38DA1B1@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:35 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.139.180 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091459915 12.76.139.180 (Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:35 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 15:18:35 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newshosting.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180057 John Woodgate wrote: > CBFalconer wrote: >> Giles Todd wrote: >>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany >>> >>>> Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). >>> >>> "Condenser", shirley. >> >> Are you sitting on the puffs in front of your cadenza wielding your >> mike. > > Is that supposed to be British English? Choose one from column A, one from column B, etc. :-) -- "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind." - Bush. "Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 16:19:59 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091460261 22134 80.176.76.181 (2 Aug 2004 15:24:21 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 15:24:21 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!in2p3.fr!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180058 I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: >When the next door neighbor flourishes because of access to middle class >attainment, the poorer neighbors will want to do the same things. >Iran's populace already wants to get into the middle class game; it's >leaders don't want to because they might lose control of their power. East Germany all over again. Maybe Israel should consider this effect in the context of their wall. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 16:21:59 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 12 Message-ID: References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091460262 22134 80.176.76.181 (2 Aug 2004 15:24:22 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 15:24:22 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180059 I read in sci.electronics.design that Mikko Nahkola wrote (in ) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Mon, 2 Aug 2004: >But, surely, a sort based on an indirect reference is still a sort? Sort of. It's a sorta sort. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: David Powell Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 18:54:23 +0100 Lines: 26 Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <410E3088.70CCE448@yahoo.com> Reply-To: ddotpowell@icuknet.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 5a+j1G3AwBnfh4dzlucozgYQX8ftaFE81Na89GiTBt4+ylHXHP X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180074 In article <410E3088.70CCE448@yahoo.com>, CBFalconer in alt.folklore.computers wrote: >John Woodgate wrote: >> John Larkin wrote: >> >>> The polarization of US politics is largely cosmetic, like the >>> difference between Coke and Pepsi. The actual populace is not >>> very differentiated as far as attitudes and preferred policies go, >> >> This is due to the decoupling capacitors which are the subject of >> this thread. They offer a low-impedance path between opposite >> polarities. > >The unit in question is "coupling impudence". Waste of time talking about caps and politicos. What they all need is a good choke. The old fashioned swinging choke would do the job, say every tenth one by alpha sort on surnames for starters, looping until the ripples cease. Regards, David P. ###### From: Giles Todd Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 23:21:22 +0200 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <5vbtg0hgqht1gghr756qqlci6qspbff4ip@4ax.com> Reply-To: g@todd.nu Cancel-Lock: sha1:gYjyX0izBbgvUU5kSFOSEpiwQi0= References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <410DBA2C.B38DA1B1@yahoo.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-NFilter: 1.2.1-b1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 16 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-06!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!phb!nobody Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180092 On Mon, 02 Aug 2004 06:02:57 GMT, CBFalconer wrote: > Giles Todd wrote: > > On Mon, 26 Jul 2004 14:16:11 GMT, Spehro Pefhany > > > >> Ah, 'ere in LeftPondia that would be a "BFC" (Big "Fat" Capacitor). > > > > "Condenser", shirley. > > Are you sitting on the puffs in front of your cadenza wielding > your mike. "Pouffes" and "credenza", shirley. Giles. ###### From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: <20040802203703.499c9607.steveo@eircom.net> References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3BMI2ACoRTDBFwwQ@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <410E3088.70CCE448@yahoo.com> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.11 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.10) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 12 Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:37:03 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 159.134.255.99 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net 1091519590 159.134.255.99 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 07:53:10 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 07:53:10 GMT Organization: NTT/VERIO Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!news-lond.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!newsfeed.yul.equant.net!newspeer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!verio!newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net.POSTED!92c6ff8c!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180123 On Mon, 02 Aug 2004 18:54:23 +0100 David Powell wrote: > Waste of time talking about caps and politicos. What they all need is A blasting cap in the right place would work wonders :) -- C:>WIN | Solar Thermal Systems The computer obeys and wins. | http://www.soleire.com/ You lose and Bill collects. | Directable Mirror Arrays | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Chaos Master Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 00:32:41 -0300 Organization: My old confused cr*ppy Win (3.11/98/NT)/Linux (2.4.26/2.6.5)/DOS(6.22) network. Does this counts as organization? Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de tOqYlXxAnXa2PTV0vMFklgVgVNGZws3pHROia58UHpAM1kgb4= User-Agent: MicroPlanet-Gravity/2.60.2060 X-Face: +%o=9Q&<0b`\Wc3rtL@DN'zy_Cf7u-k|Pw-mvoK{-CbfV_,*M8-*eS]Knab*=z(aU|g@RN96W$&W^Z-k9S#5Udi5i-'bbF";VrJGs9;VyO>Q/CP{ckjjNOEJzvzX~p`=++Im91|Y`^hbwQ}deP%71knuj:}&jZOz/CDdz]O(4H0>">gQj-.dxM)4L"DKT X-NNTP-Posting-Host: win98.beholder.marreka.no-ip.com X-Complain-This-To: newsmaster@marreka.no-ip.com X-UserName-Creator: admin Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180117 FATAL: panic at Nick Spalding, line 666, address spalding@iol.ie: > Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was > in the submarine cable business in the '50s. The 'condenser' term here in Brazil is still used. Specifically, it's used for BIG capacitors. -- Chaos Master-b®, posting from Brazil. REPLY TO GROUP! MSN: wizard_of_yendor@hotmail.com http://marreka.no-ip.com "You're guilty; the punishment is death for all who live." ###### From: "Richard Henry" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Lines: 20 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 23:54:33 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.101.156.44 X-Complaints-To: abuse@cox.net X-Trace: fed1read02 1091516075 68.101.156.44 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 02:54:35 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 02:54:35 EDT Organization: Cox Communications Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!peer01.cox.net!cox.net!p01!fed1read02.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180122 "CBFalconer" wrote in message news:410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com... > Mikko Nahkola wrote: > > > ... snip ... > > > > There's a rule that in various international contexts (flagpoles > > with every participant country's flag, that sort of thing) the > > countries are arranged in the alphabetical order of their French > > names. > > The Olympics opening march uses the order of the host country > language, with the host country proper last. IIRC That's going to be very interesting when the Olympics goes to China next round. ###### Message-ID: <410F6A43.D6D5235A@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 27 Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 10:45:45 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.139.14 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091529945 12.76.139.14 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 10:45:45 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 10:45:45 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn13feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180140 Richard Henry wrote: > "CBFalconer" wrote in message >> Mikko Nahkola wrote: >>> >> ... snip ... >>> >>> There's a rule that in various international contexts (flagpoles >>> with every participant country's flag, that sort of thing) the >>> countries are arranged in the alphabetical order of their French >>> names. >> >> The Olympics opening march uses the order of the host country >> language, with the host country proper last. IIRC > > That's going to be very interesting when the Olympics goes to > China next round. There are precedents. I don't know what they are, but check out the Seoul and Tokyo olympics. -- "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind." - Bush. "Churchill and Bush can both be considered wartime leaders, just as Secretariat and Mr Ed were both horses." - James Rhodes. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Tue, 03 Aug 04 10:53:28 GMT Lines: 80 Message-ID: <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=Q`MTPQUJ73nmjKjPmAkhZc0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9jO26QUO29S^jaRAVNS:^U:om0G[d>IB6GeBd6WP69]6Qb X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180149 In article , Greg Menke wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> In article , >> Greg Menke wrote: >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> > >> > >> >> In article , >> >> Patrick Scheible wrote: >> >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> >> >> >> >> >> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >> >> >> Not a single Democrat does. >> >> > >> >> >Seriously enough to go after terrorists instead of a regime Bush's dad >> >> >had unfinished business with? >> >> >> >> You have noticed that, since the US effort in Iraq had weakened >> >> just a little (Philipines running away), that Iran has turned their >> >> nuclear bomb research back on? >> >> >> > >> >If Iran is the threat then why are we fooling around in Iraq? >> >> It is a logical second step when tactics and strategy are >> contemplated. Why physically fight with people when an >> example next door might work? Getting Iraq back on its >> economic and production feet is also a win. When the next >> door neighbor flourishes because of access to middle class >> attainment, the poorer neighbors will want to do the same >> things. Iran's populace already wants to get into the >> middle class game; it's leaders don't want to because they >> might lose control of their power. >> > >Are you really crediting the current bunch in the White House with >that much subtlety? It doesn't matter. They are doing what needs to be done. I am hoping that this business isn't side-tracked because of politics and whinging people. > >Is it really a logical second step to be building infrastructure in >Iraq while we cut funding for it in the US? This sounds like something Kerry has been saying recently. Can you give me an example of where we've cut funding in building infrastructure in the US? > >And if you think Iraq is going to resemble a "functional county" >anytime in the next decade without the US spending 10's of billions of >dollars, the loss of hundreds of US lives and several hundreds of >Iraqii lives every year, then I'm afraid whatever it is you're smoking >is clouding your judgement. The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; Saddam had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. Afghanistan news I hear says they're doing very well very soon. I guess it helps to be a tad isolated from other Muslim countries who don't want you to succeed. > >Fact is, we'll be lucky if we can even make Iraq look like Iran- >brutal religious dictatorship and all. If we're not lucky, then when >we get sick of it after a few years of attempted nationbuilding, we'll >put some horror into power to at least minimize how many US resources >are stuck over there. And then we'll watch the ethnic cleansing and >internecine warfare destroy most everything we financed the >construction of. But at least you'll be able to take comfort in the >fact that Halliburton, Bechtel et al secured their profits while they >could. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 20:32:46 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 23 Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091561870 28576 80.176.76.181 (3 Aug 2004 19:37:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 19:37:50 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!in2p3.fr!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180192 I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Tue, 3 Aug 2004: >This sounds like something Kerry has been saying recently. Can you give >me an example of where we've cut funding in building infrastructure in >the US? The electricity suppliers claim chronic underinvestment, although they are also alleged to be in a better position than those in Europe. > >> [snip] > >The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; Saddam >had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. But I don't suppose that's his 'fault'! (;-) -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: <3froec.v8h2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Lines: 27 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:10:11 +0200 NNTP-Posting-Host: 84.118.152.200 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1091565050 84.118.152.200 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:30:50 MEST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 22:30:50 MEST Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!news2.euro.net!216.196.110.149.MISMATCH!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180196 In article , Chaos Master wrote: >FATAL: panic at Nick Spalding, line 666, address spalding@iol.ie: > >> Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was >> in the submarine cable business in the '50s. > >The 'condenser' term here in Brazil is still used. >Specifically, it's used for BIG capacitors. The term in Norwegian is Kondensator. Some people[1] tried to use "Kapasitor", but that never saw widespread use. -- mrr [1] There is a vaguely defined group of people that tend to "over-translate" all the well-defined terms we have adopted mustly from English. It has a strong PC-correctness tint. We say "batch" when we mean batch processing. Not "Satsvis kjÃring". Adopt the sounds, keep the precise technical meaning, and let it evolve to use local grammar. Like "chafffeur", which has become "sjÃfÃr" . -- mrr ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Lines: 70 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:37:25 +0200 NNTP-Posting-Host: 84.118.152.200 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1091566846 84.118.152.200 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:00:46 MEST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:00:46 MEST Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!news-fra1.dfn.de!news2.telebyte.nl!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180197 In article <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, wrote: >In article , > "Jack Peacock" wrote: >> wrote in message >>news:410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com... > >> .. I see people call for a number every >>day, even though there's a phone book next to the phone. > >Not in my family. Since Mom lives in Holland, she's asked to >get the latest phone books and gives them to all the relatives >living in Allegan. I find Google to be a lot more reliable than phone books or directories. >>> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >>> Not a single Democrat does. >>> >>There's Joe Lieberman and Zel Miller, but they've been all but disowned by >>their own party. > >Yup. I saw a glimmer of hope went the commission report came out. >Time will tell if they hold any special sessions. Have anyone actually seen a political program by Kerry and the Democrats? (or by Bush for that sake, although I'll give them until their convention to hammer one out). >>A commentator on the radio made an interesting point the other day. From >>about the 1840s till 2000 there was a lot of blurring between the two >major >>parties, conservative democrats, liberal republicans, but the parties now >>are as polarized as in 1800 when the two party system started with >Jefferson >>(democrat) vs. Adams (federalist now republican). History does seem to be >>repeating, the election in 1800 was a tie, as in 2000. Now if Cheney were >>to be involved in a duel with Clinton's Sec'y of the Treasury we'd come >full >>circle. > >I bet, if you looked, you could find a duel of some flavor. The >treasurer was swung-doored over to BofA, wasn't he? You cannot have duels if you ban handguns, you see. >>There was a terrorist threat back in 1800 too, the Barbary pirates. >>Jefferson finally was forced to act, sending in the Marines at Tripoli. > >I read about that in the US Navy history book I found at the dump. >I thought those "pirates" were bandits doing illegal. Turned out >they were getting paid by governments. I just found a book about >the Dutch Republic and written in 1855. It picks up where the >book I just read about the Medici left off. There is a distinction between "pirate" and "privateer" here. A "Privateer" is a pirate that has legal protection (as, they won't hang him) by some government; in exchange he preys upon ships from other countries. They seldom got paid, mostly they got to keep the loot. "One man's prate is another's privateer" is an old saying. -- mrr ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: Lines: 41 Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:44:04 +0200 NNTP-Posting-Host: 84.118.152.200 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1091566846 84.118.152.200 (Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:00:46 MEST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 23:00:46 MEST Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!193.154.160.102.MISMATCH!newsfeeder1.noc.eunet-ag.at!news.eunet.at!newsfeed.de.prserv.net!prserv.net!newsgate.cistron.nl!news.wiretrip.org!border2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180198 In article , Greg Menke wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >> In article , >> Greg Menke wrote: >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> > >> > >> >> In article , >> >> Patrick Scheible wrote: >> >> >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >Are you really crediting the current bunch in the White House with >that much subtlety? > >Is it really a logical second step to be building infrastructure in >Iraq while we cut funding for it in the US? > >And if you think Iraq is going to resemble a "functional county" >anytime in the next decade without the US spending 10's of billions of >dollars, the loss of hundreds of US lives and several hundreds of >Iraqii lives every year, then I'm afraid whatever it is you're smoking >is clouding your judgement. > >Fact is, we'll be lucky if we can even make Iraq look like Iran- >brutal religious dictatorship and all. If we're not lucky, then when >we get sick of it after a few years of attempted nationbuilding, we'll >put some horror into power to at least minimize how many US resources >are stuck over there. And then we'll watch the ethnic cleansing and >internecine warfare destroy most everything we financed the >construction of. But at least you'll be able to take comfort in the >fact that Halliburton, Bechtel et al secured their profits while they >could. You suggesting we should find one of "our crooks" to run the place? Pinochet is getting old, by he may have someone to recommend. -- mrr ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:39:45 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091569501 6784 80.176.76.181 (3 Aug 2004 21:45:01 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 21:45:01 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news.zanker.org!news.clara.net!wagner.news.clara.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180201 I read in sci.electronics.design that Morten Reistad wrote (in <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv. no>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Tue, 3 Aug 2004: >You cannot have duels if you ban handguns, you see. Large fish fillets or, even better, live eels, are acceptable substitutes and duelling with these is probably not illegal. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: Gene Wirchenko Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 15:02:44 -0700 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: genew@mail.ocis.net References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 25 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180206 "Richard Henry" wrote: >"CBFalconer" wrote in message >news:410E5684.AB23045D@yahoo.com... [snip] >> The Olympics opening march uses the order of the host country >> language, with the host country proper last. IIRC > >That's going to be very interesting when the Olympics goes to China next >round. Not really. They can use the alphabetical order of the Pinyin (Roman letters) transliteration of the name. They can also use the Chinese character dictionary order, which I believe is fixed. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. ###### From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: <20040804080551.78c277ed.steveo@eircom.net> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.11 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.10) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 08:05:51 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 159.134.255.241 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net 1091616780 159.134.255.241 (Wed, 04 Aug 2004 10:53:00 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 10:53:00 GMT Organization: NTT/VERIO Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newspeer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!verio!newsread1.dllstx09.us.to.verio.net.POSTED!92c6ff8c!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180243 On Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:37:25 +0200 Morten Reistad wrote: > In article <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, > wrote: > >I bet, if you looked, you could find a duel of some flavor. The > >treasurer was swung-doored over to BofA, wasn't he? > > You cannot have duels if you ban handguns, you see. Swords are far better dueling instruments than guns. You have a range of blunted weapons for points through first blood right up to "to the death". -- C:>WIN | Solar Thermal Systems The computer obeys and wins. | http://www.soleire.com/ You lose and Bill collects. | Directable Mirror Arrays | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Wed, 04 Aug 04 08:52:43 GMT Lines: 43 Message-ID: <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=noSmYSU>]4N>8dadjO>C2A0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9JNla2nUM?F[FaRAVNS:^U:OJ\j_;1Q^D4M>C5OJ=2C6QI X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180232 In article , John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in ><410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >capacitors', on Tue, 3 Aug 2004: > >>This sounds like something Kerry has been saying recently. Can you give >>me an example of where we've cut funding in building infrastructure in >>the US? > >The electricity suppliers claim chronic underinvestment, although they >are also alleged to be in a better position than those in Europe. The electricity suppliers are not (US) government owned. Therefore, how did the government cut thta infrastructure funding? As it is, Congress has passed all kinds of tax incentives but I haven't heard many that use it as plowing back into maintenance and development. A lot of this work has been duct-taped by Congress when they "privatized" the power industry. But there's nothing about funding from the general budget in any of this (that I know of). >> >>> >[snip] >> >>The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; Saddam >>had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. > >But I don't suppose that's his 'fault'! (;-) He was in the position of doing a lot of good for that country and he did start out that way. Then he got the power bug and started to think about owning the rest of the Islam world. This seems to be a common disease throughout the history of Islam rulers. Now, I understand that expansionism and empire was the mode of operation over a century ago. Everybody else stopped thinking that way. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Wed, 04 Aug 04 09:09:28 GMT Lines: 79 Message-ID: <4110b970$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=i;lYolg>T:WBSY?2J=5hANVPaRAVNS:^U:_;1k, Morten Reistad wrote: >In article <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, wrote: >>In article , >> "Jack Peacock" wrote: >>> wrote in message >>>news:410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com... >> >>> .. I see people call for a number every >>>day, even though there's a phone book next to the phone. >> >>Not in my family. Since Mom lives in Holland, she's asked to >>get the latest phone books and gives them to all the relatives >>living in Allegan. > >I find Google to be a lot more reliable than phone books or >directories. My folks are still too paranoid to go online; they read the newspapers and see what awful dangers are on the net. Besides, people read the phone book. They find out who is no longer where they used to be; then the gossiping fills in the blanks about whether these people died, moved, became antisocial, etc.. > >>>> I will vote for anybody who takes this terrorist threat seriously. >>>> Not a single Democrat does. >>>> >>>There's Joe Lieberman and Zel Miller, but they've been all but disowned by >>>their own party. >> >>Yup. I saw a glimmer of hope went the commission report came out. >>Time will tell if they hold any special sessions. > >Have anyone actually seen a political program by Kerry and the Democrats? Not yet which is why I look at their performance. Kerry is now blasting Bush for doing too little security too late. However, everything that Kerry and the DNC wanted to do during the convention week here (in Boston) was begging for Al Queda to strike. They tried their damnedest to create situations where a mass killing could be done. They picked the worst building; they tried to have the equivalent of a 4th of July Pops night; there were a couple of other minor attempts but I can't recall them. The news said that Kerry was going to put up his economic policy tomorrow (this item was aired Sunday, I think). There wasn't a smidgeon of reporting about the Democrat planks. The goal was to have a very big, expensive party. That's exactly what they had. However, since security was so tight, the partying didn't spill out into local businesses who claimed to have lost tons of money. A pizerria owner across the street from the Fleet Center had to close his business because he couldn't get supplied trucked in. So he put a sign out Closed Go Bush. The Dems went to court to get him to take it down; they lost. Al Jazeera put up a large banner in the Fleet Center which would have been seen by cameras. The Dems told them to take down and they did. The news item that I wanted followed up was the fact that the pigeons disappeared. I wanted to know why. All this time I thought the IQ level of those birds was very low; however, since they had the good sense to avoid Democrat critters, my estimation has risen. >(or by Bush for that sake, although I'll give them until their convention >to hammer one out). The planks they put together will probably be scary as hell. I wish the Democrats would take this terrorism seriously and not treat it as a whip to hit Republicans until they gain the White House. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Wed, 04 Aug 04 09:10:48 GMT Lines: 16 Message-ID: <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=b=lUQ4?CKcOVNO6ULNf_XB0R]m=BkYWIG:6bU3OT9S9JSQC5>5hANV@aRAVNS:^U:O;1k, John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that Morten Reistad > wrote (in <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv. >no>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Tue, 3 Aug 2004: > >>You cannot have duels if you ban handguns, you see. > >Large fish fillets or, even better, live eels, are acceptable >substitutes and duelling with these is probably not illegal. Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 18:21:30 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 11 Message-ID: <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091640157 15817 80.176.76.181 (4 Aug 2004 17:22:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 17:22:37 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180265 I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal rights people. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 18:34:49 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 52 Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091641353 6149 80.176.76.181 (4 Aug 2004 17:42:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 17:42:33 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!fr.ip.ndsoftware.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180266 I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >The electricity suppliers are not (US) government owned. Therefore, how >did the government cut thta infrastructure funding? The underinvestment dates from way back when the government was either the legal owner or the moneybag, AIUI. >As it is, Congress >has passed all kinds of tax incentives but I haven't heard many that use >it as plowing back into maintenance and development. That may be what the utilities want. >A lot of this work >has been duct-taped by Congress when they "privatized" the power >industry. But there's nothing about funding from the general budget in >any of this (that I know of). > > >>> >>>> >>[snip] >>> >>>The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; Saddam >>>had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. >> >>But I don't suppose that's his 'fault'! (;-) > >He was in the position of doing a lot of good for that country and he >did start out that way. Then he got the power bug and started to think >about owning the rest of the Islam world. That's my impression, too. >This seems to be a common >disease throughout the history of Islam rulers. Yes, that's true, too. >Now, I understand that >expansionism and empire was the mode of operation over a century ago. >Everybody else stopped thinking that way. In Western Europe and North America, yes, but not elsewhere. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 04 Aug 04 10:01:35 -0800 Organization: http://newsguy.com Lines: 38 Message-ID: <1505.712T1769T6012669@kltpzyxm.invalid> References: <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-855.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) *UNREGISTERED* Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news4 Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180272 In article <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com (jmfbahciv) writes: >In article , >John Woodgate wrote: >>[snip] >>> >>>The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; >>>Saddam had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. >> >>But I don't suppose that's his 'fault'! (;-) > >He was in the position of doing a lot of good for that country >and he did start out that way. Then he got the power bug and >started to think about owning the rest of the Islam world. This >seems to be a common disease throughout the history of Islam >rulers. You can remove the words "Islam" from the above paragraph and, unfortunately, it still holds. The phrase "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" wasn't coined with any one ideology in mind. The power bug can - and usually does - infect anyone, regardless of their political stance. >Now, I understand that expansionism and empire was the mode of >operation over a century ago. Everybody else stopped thinking >that way. In a political sense, perhaps. Economically, however, this attitude is alive and well - and its proponents are the ones making the huge campaign donations. -- /~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! ###### From: "John Homes" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 08:33:48 +1200 Organization: EDS New Zealand Limited Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <1505.712T1769T6012669@kltpzyxm.invalid> NNTP-Posting-Host: dhcp-134-251-235-16.dhcp.nz.eds.com X-Trace: hermes.nz.eds.com 1091651630 4074 134.251.235.16 (4 Aug 2004 20:33:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@hermes.nz.eds.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 20:33:50 +0000 (UTC) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!newsfeed.vmunix.org!news1.optus.net.au!optus!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.xtra.co.nz!newsfeed01.tsnz.net!news.eds.co.nz!news.nz.eds.com!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180280 "Charlie Gibbs" wrote in message news:1505.712T1769T6012669@kltpzyxm.invalid... > > You can remove the words "Islam" from the above paragraph and, > unfortunately, it still holds. The phrase "Power corrupts, absolute > power corrupts absolutely" wasn't coined with any one ideology in mind. This is not quite true. The original "All power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely," (Lord Acton) was aimed squarely at the then Pope. AIUI, Acton was an English Catholic involved in negotiations aimed at removing some of the legal disabilities placed on Catholics in the UK. The primary justification for these disablilties was the Papal claim that loyalty to the RCC and the Pope overrode loyalty to the Crown. The Pope was not willing to drop the claim for the benefit of the Faithful in the UK. > The power bug can - and usually does - infect anyone, regardless of > their political stance. > This, however, is all too true. :-( John Homes ###### From: Chaos Master Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 00:18:16 -0300 Organization: My old confused cr*ppy Win (3.11/98/NT)/Linux (2.4.26/2.6.5)/DOS(6.22) network. Does this counts as organization? Lines: 19 Message-ID: References: <3froec.v8h2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de XskaCkJthDNonqx1NMj/5gLbwMP/xB+IRyyVrM7ftkNyHtIMo= User-Agent: MicroPlanet-Gravity/2.60.2060 X-Face: +%o=9Q&<0b`\Wc3rtL@DN'zy_Cf7u-k|Pw-mvoK{-CbfV_,*M8-*eS]Knab*=z(aU|g@RN96W$&W^Z-k9S#5Udi5i-'bbF";VrJGs9;VyO>Q/CP{ckjjNOEJzvzX~p`=++Im91|Y`^hbwQ}deP%71knuj:}&jZOz/CDdz]O(4H0>">gQj-.dxM)4L"DKT X-NNTP-Posting-Host: win98.beholder.marreka.no-ip.com X-Complain-This-To: newsmaster@marreka.no-ip.com X-UserName-Creator: admin Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180299 Chaos happened and Morten Reistad said: > The term in Norwegian is Kondensator. > > Some people[1] tried to use "Kapasitor", but that never saw widespread use. Here in Brazil, if you go to a electronics shop and ask for a condenser, the people know you want a big capacitor (like the ones used for motors). The term in Portuguese is 'condensador' and 'capacitor'. 'Capacitor' is most common, but technicians use both. []s -- Chaos Master-b®, posting from Brazil. REPLY TO GROUP! MSN: wizard_of_yendor@hotmail.com http://marreka.no-ip.com "You're guilty; the punishment is death for all who live." ###### Message-ID: <4111BDDC.E5DFE5CE@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 05:32:56 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.134.180 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1091683976 12.76.134.180 (Thu, 05 Aug 2004 05:32:56 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 05:32:56 GMT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn13feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180304 John Woodgate wrote: > jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote > >> Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. > > Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal > rights people. All this bandying about of the skonk works products may result in an objection from the Al Capp copyright holders, whoever they may be today. -- A: Because it fouls the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 04 10:30:53 GMT Lines: 76 Message-ID: <41121e10$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=NglRE;E_YQWmZCC?C4oiS[0R]m=BkYWIW:6bU3OT9S9Z;QfNC5OJ=2C6QY X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!nntp.infostrada.it!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180321 In article , John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in ><4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: > >>The electricity suppliers are not (US) government owned. Therefore, how >>did the government cut thta infrastructure funding? > >The underinvestment dates from way back when the government was either >the legal owner or the moneybag, AIUI. So this isn't a new thing which is how I read the comment that's been scrubbed. AIUI, underinvestment of power infrastructure is a direct cause of ... pause whilst emoticon dons flame suits] the PC movements that object to atomic power plants, coal and oil usage. Or are you talking about an earlier time? I can't recall when the US government owned the power plants. There only a few municipalities who own theres and most of them scrapped their local power sources and use the major grids. Hudson, MA used to generate their own power with that teensy little water fall in town. I always wanted to find out how it all worked but never did. Then I heard a rumor that they scrapped it; never checked to verify the rumor. I thought that was mistake, if they did. > >>As it is, Congress >>has passed all kinds of tax incentives but I haven't heard many that use >>it as plowing back into maintenance and development. > >That may be what the utilities want. Nope. The functional dispersion was fought by the utilites. Some guy posted a scenario fortelling what would happen on comp.risks. ?Six? years later Enron imploded. >>He was in the position of doing a lot of good for that country and he >>did start out that way. Then he got the power bug and started to think >>about owning the rest of the Islam world. > >That's my impression, too. He was the only Muslim government leader who would award passports to the unwanted PLO. > >>This seems to be a common >>disease throughout the history of Islam rulers. > >Yes, that's true, too. > >>Now, I understand that >>expansionism and empire was the mode of operation over a century ago. >>Everybody else stopped thinking that way. > >In Western Europe and North America, yes, but not elsewhere. Well, I'm only starting to understand what the word means, let alone how it worked. I had no idea what Expansionism meant in el-hi history classes. To me, it was just another strange term that had to be memorized, spelled correctly, and slotted into a year-year bin. /BAH /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 04 10:33:44 GMT Lines: 14 Message-ID: <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=lBH1]nUUd6;5NMJKmZWPZ?0R]m=BkYWI7:6bU3OT9S9:;QfNC5OJ=2C6Q9 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!diablo.voicenet.com!199.184.165.233.MISMATCH!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180322 In article <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk>, John Woodgate wrote: >I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in ><4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >>Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. > >Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal rights people. Oh, don't get me started on those [ASCII arrangement elided] :-) /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <1505.712T1769T6012669@kltpzyxm.invalid> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 04 11:40:03 GMT Lines: 56 Message-ID: <41122e45$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=FE6@U8]4LTmF^Q^Jd0R]m=BkYWIg:6bU3OT9S9j:^[KE@1O@FnaRAVNS:^U:o64ORE4h75\mj_dFm32bNEg X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!209.11.36.156.MISMATCH!nntp-server.pubsub.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!feed3.news.rcn.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180329 In article <1505.712T1769T6012669@kltpzyxm.invalid>, "Charlie Gibbs" wrote: >In article <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>, jmfbahciv@aol.com >(jmfbahciv) writes: > >>In article , >>John Woodgate wrote: >>>[snip] >>>> >>>>The Iraqis have a better chance than the people in Afghanistan; >>>>Saddam had the most educated populace in all of the Muslim countries. >>> >>>But I don't suppose that's his 'fault'! (;-) >> >>He was in the position of doing a lot of good for that country >>and he did start out that way. Then he got the power bug and >>started to think about owning the rest of the Islam world. This >>seems to be a common disease throughout the history of Islam >>rulers. > >You can remove the words "Islam" from the above paragraph and, >unfortunately, it still holds. The phrase "Power corrupts, absolute >power corrupts absolutely" wasn't coined with any one ideology in mind. >The power bug can - and usually does - infect anyone, regardless of >their political stance. Sure. I'm not arguing that. I was commenting on an aspect that seems to be common with this group of people. Qadaffi(sp?) went so far as to create his own special brand of Islam. All salivate for the money that is associated with the religious-imposed tourist industry in Mecca. >>Now, I understand that expansionism and empire was the mode of >>operation over a century ago. Everybody else stopped thinking >>that way. > >In a political sense, perhaps. Exactly. If you mix in politics, you get wars. > Economically, however, this attitude >is alive and well - and its proponents are the ones making the huge >campaign donations. This mixing of politics and business is worrisome. It's also two areas that I actively tried to avoid because I didn't know who to evaluate actions, events and extrapolate mess predictions. I'm now doing a cram session trying to make up all this learning I should have done over the last 50 years [emoticon gazes sadly at pile of dust, orphaned math and science books]. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: Keith Williams Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:33:25 -0400 Organization: none here Lines: 17 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1090854642.747736@teapot.planet.gong> <20040726162405.3cc01368.steveo@eircom.net> <4107AF28.1908FF5C@alum.mit.edu> <3IKdnTSD1LAII5rcRVn-jw@comcast.com> <21ede509.0407281043.6d01a5a7@posting.google.com> <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <20040729.1803.57040snz@dsl.co.uk> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 4BQAcfvlzkQS4cHvvaGzvQO5ZiFKdebtVWEgK9FGuOH0k+KtmT X-Newsreader: MicroPlanet Gravity v2.60 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180337 [This followup was posted to sci.electronics.design and a copy was sent to the cited author.] In article <20040729.1803.57040snz@dsl.co.uk>, bhk@dsl.co.uk says... > On Thursday, in article > > krw@att.bizzzz "K Williams" wrote: > > > '74 ;-) (not counting my 4 years as a technician in college). > > Does the apostrophe stand in for the letters SN? Hmm, that would mean I graduated as a hex inverting OC buffer (SN7405;)? -- Keith ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 16:43:38 -0500 From: William Hamblen Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 04:44:00 -0500 Message-ID: References: <6cidnQeLBtgsNJTcRVn-uQ@mpowercom.net> <410a245b$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410a3a96$0$2826$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cdba7$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410e2e92$0$2835$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <4110b583$0$2847$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 43 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.52.7.244 X-Trace: sv3-cKxpmbrPJHBnYsOsr64JF5S9HFzjP+mGRIKuHl5J8evlTp/xQCOxFRCs3bJ7osXcFvgiJDtSlvQ7iVH!fTJLU/XSWokve+5CE1SC6MkNdtM9GR7aMjFLkWZkF9hQK3S28MKoIYIUghleY0rOfhuR+Q== X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180377 On Wed, 04 Aug 04 08:52:43 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >In article , > John Woodgate wrote: >>I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in >><410f8045$0$2833$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >>capacitors', on Tue, 3 Aug 2004: >> >>>This sounds like something Kerry has been saying recently. Can you give >>>me an example of where we've cut funding in building infrastructure in >>>the US? >> >>The electricity suppliers claim chronic underinvestment, although they >>are also alleged to be in a better position than those in Europe. > >The electricity suppliers are not (US) government owned. Therefore, >how did the government cut thta infrastructure funding? The real problem power producers and distributors have is not funding, but the difficulty in licensing new generating plants and power lines. In Nashville people turn out in large numbers to object to any construction project the electric power board proposes. I guess they think electricity comes out of the air. A fair amount of the electrical system in the US is government owned. Locally the Nashville Electric Service is owned by the city. During the Great Depression the privately owned Nashville Railway and Light went bankrupt and the city bought its assets. The streetcar part became the Nashville Transit Company (later Metropolitan Transit Authority) and the electricity part became NES. There are large federal power authorities. The Tennessee Valley Authority and the Bonneville Power Administration are the two I can think of right now. The federal authorities are self-capitalized and are not underfunded. In structure they are corporations whose stock is owned by the government. The president appoints the boards with confirmation by the congress. They sell electricity to power distribution companies and spend their own money without appropriations having to be made by the congress. What puts them in unfair competition with the privately owned power companies is that they can borrow money from the treasury of the United States at favorable rates, although most of their financing is through the normal bond market. The only reason they don't own the whole world by now is that the management has been inefficient. ###### X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.147.131.211 From: Brian Inglis Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Organization: Systematic Software Reply-To: Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.ab.ca Message-ID: References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 21:17:10 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.71.223.147 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shaw.ca X-Trace: pd7tw1no 1091740630 24.71.223.147 (Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:17:10 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:17:10 MDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newshosting.com!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!167.206.3.103.MISMATCH!news3.optonline.net!pd7cy1no!shaw.ca!pd7tw1no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180373 On Thu, 05 Aug 04 10:33:44 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >In article <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk>, > John Woodgate wrote: >>I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in >><4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >>capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >>>Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. >> >>Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal rights people. > >Oh, don't get me started on those [ASCII arrangement elided] :-) I like the P[EI]TA arrangement. Unixism: [EI] == alternative chars. Supporting mistreatment of humans to protest mistreatment of animals. -- Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca) fake address use address above to reply ###### From: Jim Thompson Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Message-ID: <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 32 Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 14:22:50 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.98.56.100 X-Complaints-To: abuse@cox.net X-Trace: fed1read04 1091740969 68.98.56.100 (Thu, 05 Aug 2004 17:22:49 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 17:22:49 EDT Organization: Cox Communications Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!peer01.cox.net!cox.net!p01!fed1read04.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180374 On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 21:17:10 GMT, Brian Inglis wrote: >On Thu, 05 Aug 04 10:33:44 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >>In article <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk>, >> John Woodgate wrote: >>>I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in >>><4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >>>capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >>>>Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. >>> >>>Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal rights people. >> >>Oh, don't get me started on those [ASCII arrangement elided] :-) > >I like the P[EI]TA arrangement. Unixism: [EI] == alternative chars. >Supporting mistreatment of humans to protest mistreatment of animals. I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) ...Jim Thompson -- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | | http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food. ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 23:32:25 +0100 (BST) Organization: Dragonhill Systems Lines: 26 Message-ID: <20040805.2232.57119snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091775098 119 158.152.92.150 (6 Aug 2004 06:51:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: SNews 1.31+mods(jlw030122/386) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!mutlu.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!dsl.co.uk!bhk Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180416 On Thursday, in article Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.Invalid "Brian Inglis" wrote: > I like the P[EI]TA arrangement. Unixism: [EI] == alternative chars. > Supporting mistreatment of humans to protest mistreatment of animals. Here in the UK, "animal rights activists" have been making death threats against directors and staff of various laboratories, not to mention various arson attacks. To such an extent that the gov'mint is going to bring in legislation to deal directly with these anarchists. My suggestion is that anyone convicted of any form of violence in support of "animal rights" spends time substituting for the animals in the experiments. [For some reason I'm put in mind of the woman who sued Anita Roddick, the founder of "Body Shop", because Body Shop's products were NOT tested on animals. Apparently she'd used a shampoo on her angora rabbit, and this had harmed the bunny's eyes!] -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "I don't use Linux. I prefer to use an OS supported by a large multi- national vendor, with a good office suite, excellent network/internet software and decent hardware support." ###### NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 17:36:20 -0500 From: "Dave VanHorn" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 17:36:28 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: Lines: 8 NNTP-Posting-Host: 68.51.96.141 X-Trace: sv3-zjgGtSSzT7EhhbuK0CcdHN0toHWUWz04WVa+Wy8O9XAwreIX5gswHLUXpkvGTFXwNhJ/x6uZSGi7d7l!tIaR8vI2uJsbmkvf+VIKSN1L3+ETgkhy6rjWvlmbZM9T3vDdN/II7unqvM62 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-DMCA-Complaints-To: dmca@comcast.net X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: 1.3.13 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.comcast.com!news.comcast.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180391 > I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) > > ...Jim Thompson If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) ###### From: Té Rowan Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 04:31:18 +0000 Organization: Word used by Space Aliens Lines: 14 Message-ID: References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp163-55.as.mi.is Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.simnet.is 1091766550 26888 217.151.163.55 (6 Aug 2004 04:29:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet-abuse@simnet.is NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 04:29:10 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!198.6.0.85!ash.uu.net!news.simnet.is!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180414 Saith Dave VanHorn: > >> I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) >> >> ...Jim Thompson > >If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) If He DID want us to, why are they cute and fluffy, then? FYI: I am a BME (Big Meat Eater). -- Té Rowan (reynirhs@mi.is) ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: <9qcvec.hjj.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Lines: 16 Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 08:00:32 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.217.0.253 X-Complaints-To: abuse@tele2.no X-Trace: juliett.dax.net 1091779232 193.217.0.253 (Fri, 06 Aug 2004 10:00:32 MET DST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 10:00:32 MET DST Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.stueberl.de!newsfeed.vmunix.org!uio.no!193.216.69.35.MISMATCH!dax.net!juliett.dax.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180422 In article , Té Rowan wrote: >Saith Dave VanHorn: > >> >>> I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >>If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) > >If He DID want us to, why are they cute and fluffy, then? So we will wait until they have matured, and are ready for eating. -- mrr ###### From: John Woodgate Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:43:59 +0100 Organization: JMWA Electronics Consultancy Lines: 28 Message-ID: References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Reply-To: John Woodgate NNTP-Posting-Host: jmwa.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091785715 17040 80.176.76.181 (6 Aug 2004 09:48:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:48:35 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 U <5Z8C9wtxbnpWyFnyfFzqmVF739> Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!in2p3.fr!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!jmwa.demon.co.uk!jmw Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180426 I read in sci.electronics.design that Té Rowan wrote (in ) about 'History of decoupling capacitors', on Fri, 6 Aug 2004: >Saith Dave VanHorn: > >> >>> I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >>If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) > >If He DID want us to, why are they cute and fluffy, then? Many people don't eat the cute and fluffy ones. I've gone off rabbit in my later years, although it kept a lot of us going during WW2 and it does taste nice. > >FYI: I am a BME (Big Meat Eater). >-- >Té Rowan (reynirhs@mi.is) You have cute and fluffy animals in Iceland?? Poodles? (;-) -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. The good news is that nothing is compulsory. The bad news is that everything is prohibited. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk ###### From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 11:15:57 +0100 Lines: 13 Message-ID: References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Reply-To: Nick Spalding Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de ZEIN+LIZxUa1dK+1q8MRLQiymmjSPNoKWPLlNhokq4AK62yMc= X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.652 X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/2.0.0.1 Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180434 Dave VanHorn wrote, in : > > > I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) > > > > ...Jim Thompson > > If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) That's what the cannibal said about people in one of the Flanders & Swan sketches. -- Nick Spalding ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 18:58:44 +0100 (BST) Organization: Dragonhill Systems Lines: 14 Message-ID: <20040806.1758.57128snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1091832110 7518 158.152.92.150 (6 Aug 2004 22:41:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: SNews 1.31+mods(jlw030122/386) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.icl.net!proxad.net!proxad.net!194.159.246.34.MISMATCH!peer-uk.news.demon.net!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!dsl.co.uk!bhk Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180503 On Friday, in article spalding@iol.ie "Nick Spalding" wrote: > That's what the cannibal said about people in one of the Flanders & Swan > sketches. Ah yes; the genuine anthropophagaei. -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "I don't use Linux. I prefer to use an OS supported by a large multi- national vendor, with a good office suite, excellent network/internet software and decent hardware support." ###### From: blmblm@myrealbox.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: 7 Aug 2004 06:38:57 GMT Organization: None Lines: 35 Message-ID: <2njbo1F1h76nU3@uni-berlin.de> References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de ojeDQ5xy4QDi2FhCFXNGXApolZzYZqasn+d2J52G6JHXff8snx X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180538 In article <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no>, Morten Reistad wrote: [ snip ] >Have anyone actually seen a political program by Kerry and the Democrats? >(or by Bush for that sake, although I'll give them until their convention >to hammer one out). For anyone curious/interested enough to wade through rather a lot of partisan rah-rah, going to http://www.johnkerry.com and following links eventually turns up some fairly specific-sounding "here's what I would do instead" stuff (with regard to Iraq, health care, jobs, etc.) I feel sure GWB has something similar but am less willing to wade through partisan rah-rah in search of it. Is that what you mean by "political program"? As for hammering things out and conventions -- my understanding is that nothing of substance will be decided at either convention. Anyone know otherwise? I seem to recall that U.S. parties used to have formally-approved "platforms", the "planks" of which were sometimes argued heatedly at the convention. The platforms probably still exist and can be found on the Web somewhere, though they don't seem to get much media attention lately. [ snip ] -- | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. ###### From: Rich Grise Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Lines: 30 Organization: As Little as Possible User-Agent: KNode/0.7.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit Message-ID: Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 08:00:51 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 4.11.179.74 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verizon.net X-Trace: nwrddc04.gnilink.net 1091865651 4.11.179.74 (Sat, 07 Aug 2004 04:00:51 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 04:00:51 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news.glorb.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!spamkiller.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!nwrddc04.gnilink.net.POSTED!dd653b87!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180542 Jim Thompson wrote: > On Thu, 05 Aug 2004 21:17:10 GMT, Brian Inglis > wrote: > >>On Thu, 05 Aug 04 10:33:44 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, >>jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >>>In article <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk>, >>> John Woodgate wrote: >>>>I read in sci.electronics.design that jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote (in >>>><4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>) about 'History of decoupling >>>>capacitors', on Wed, 4 Aug 2004: >>>>>Nah, water guns filled with skunk oil. >>>> >>>>Distilling skunks will get you in trouble with the animal rights people. >>> >>>Oh, don't get me started on those [ASCII arrangement elided] :-) >> >>I like the P[EI]TA arrangement. Unixism: [EI] == alternative chars. >>Supporting mistreatment of humans to protest mistreatment of animals. > > I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) > Yeah, if God didn't intend for people to eat animals, why did He make them out of meat? Cheers! Rich ###### From: Rich Grise Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Followup-To: alt.folklore.computers References: <_qCdnTrb75DAj5XcRVn-vg@comcast.com> <410b846a$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> Lines: 23 Organization: As Little as Possible User-Agent: KNode/0.7.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8Bit Message-ID: <910Rc.1297$l96.970@nwrddc04.gnilink.net> Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 08:03:17 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 4.11.179.74 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verizon.net X-Trace: nwrddc04.gnilink.net 1091865797 4.11.179.74 (Sat, 07 Aug 2004 04:03:17 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 04:03:17 EDT Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed-0.progon.net!progon.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!spamkiller.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!nwrddc04.gnilink.net.POSTED!dd653b87!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180543 Té Rowan wrote: > Saith Dave VanHorn: > >> >>> I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) >>> >>> ...Jim Thompson >> >>If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) > > If He DID want us to, why are they cute and fluffy, then? > So we let enough of them get to breeding age to make more. And you've never had veal? I think it's different with human SPMs - they're just cute so you don't kill them. Cheers! Rich ###### From: Té Rowan Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 01:43:20 +0000 Organization: Word used by Space Aliens Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp162-39.as.mi.is Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.simnet.is 1091929267 13261 217.151.162.39 (8 Aug 2004 01:41:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet-abuse@simnet.is NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 01:41:07 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeeds.sol.net!wns13feed!worldnet.att.net!198.6.0.85!ash.uu.net!news.simnet.is!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180623 Saith John Woodgate: >You have cute and fluffy animals in Iceland?? Poodles? (;-) Them, too. Plus lambs and other kid, them bunnies (albeit caged) and some other randoms. -- Té Rowan (reynirhs@mi.is) ###### From: Té Rowan Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 04:18:41 +0000 Organization: Word used by Space Aliens Lines: 22 Message-ID: References: <410cda8f$0$2838$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <52toec.gkh2.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> <4110b9c0$0$2815$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <3jHoO2BasREBFwKC@jmwa.demon.co.uk> <41121ebb$0$2832$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> <0895h01uvsr37uiionrsnj1hrpvc92qnc4@4ax.com> <910Rc.1297$l96.970@nwrddc04.gnilink.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp162-168.as.mi.is Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.simnet.is 1092024976 474 217.151.162.168 (9 Aug 2004 04:16:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet-abuse@simnet.is NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 04:16:16 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!uunet!ash.uu.net!news.simnet.is!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:180764 Saith Rich Grise: >Té Rowan wrote: > >> Saith Dave VanHorn: >> >>> >>>> I'm a charter member of PETA: People Eating Tasty Animals ;-) >>>> >>>> ...Jim Thompson >>> >>>If god didn't want us to eat animals, why are they made of meat? :) >> >> If He DID want us to, why are they cute and fluffy, then? >> >So we let enough of them get to breeding age to make more. > >And you've never had veal? I take it you overlooked the FYI below the quip. -- Té Rowan (reynirhs@mi.is) ###### From: "Jeff" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Lines: 24 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4939.300 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2004 22:58:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 142.177.142.146 X-Complaints-To: abuse@aliant.net X-Trace: ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca 1094597899 142.177.142.146 (Tue, 07 Sep 2004 19:58:19 ADT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2004 19:58:19 ADT Organization: MPowered-Subscriber Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.ip-plus.net!newsfeed.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.space.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!gnilink.net!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!207.35.177.252!nf3.bellglobal.com!ursa-nb00s0.nbnet.nb.ca!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:184392 "Joe Pfeiffer" wrote in message news:1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu... > Nick Spalding writes: > > > > > > "Condenser", shirley. > > > > Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was > > in the submarine cable business in the '50s. > > They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. Not on anything made in the last decade or two. The points and condenser system is replaced by electronics. > -- > Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 > Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 > New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer > Southwestern NM Regional Science and Engr Fair: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### From: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 01:25:51 +0000 (UTC) Organization: a2i network Lines: 18 Message-ID: References: <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: green.rahul.net X-Trace: blue.rahul.net 1094606751 6063 192.160.13.49 (8 Sep 2004 01:25:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: support@rahul.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 01:25:51 +0000 (UTC) Originator: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!fr.ip.ndsoftware.net!cox.net!news-xfer.cox.net!gail.ripco.com!wasp.rahul.net!192.160.13.20.MISMATCH!rahul.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:184399 In article , Jeff wrote: [...] >> They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. > >Not on anything made in the last decade or two. The points and condenser >system is replaced by electronics. Hidden inside that electronics thing is usually a condenser of olden days. The elctronic thing is a semiconductor switch that gets commanded off by the magnet passing a certain point on the pole. Silicon got cheaper than points. -- -- kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge ###### From: Reynir Stefánsson Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 08 Sep 2004 02:18:45 +0000 Organization: Siminn - Iceland Telecom - Internet News Lines: 20 Message-ID: References: <877jsspdtn.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com> <2mkho4FntnfrU1@uni-berlin.de> <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: ppp163-120.as.mi.is Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.simnet.is 1094609905 17090 217.151.163.120 (8 Sep 2004 02:18:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet-abuse@simnet.is NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 02:18:25 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!uunet!ash.uu.net!news.simnet.is!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:184403 So spake Jeff: > >"Joe Pfeiffer" wrote in message >news:1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu... >> Nick Spalding writes: >> > > >> > > "Condenser", shirley. >> > >> > Not in the last 40 years or so. They were still condensers when I was >> > in the submarine cable business in the '50s. >> >> They're still condensors on lawn mower ignitions. > >Not on anything made in the last decade or two. The points and condenser >system is replaced by electronics. Last time I knew lawn mower ignitions were magnetos. Has it changed? -- Reynir Stefánsson (reynirhs@mi.is) ###### From: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers,sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: History of decoupling capacitors Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 03:11:24 +0000 (UTC) Organization: a2i network Lines: 11 Message-ID: References: <1bpt6cupdo.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: green.rahul.net X-Trace: blue.rahul.net 1094613084 9960 192.160.13.49 (8 Sep 2004 03:11:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: support@rahul.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 03:11:24 +0000 (UTC) Originator: kensmith@green.rahul.net (Ken Smith) X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Path: nightfall.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!wasp.rahul.net!192.160.13.20.MISMATCH!rahul.net!not-for-mail Xref: nightfall.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:184409 In article , Reynir Stefánsson wrote: [...] >Last time I knew lawn mower ignitions were magnetos. Has it changed? They are still magnetos. The points have been replaced with an electronic do-dad thats all. -- -- kensmith@rahul.net forging knowledge