Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: AFC Book List Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:18:42 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.246.249.182 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077746424 206.246.249.182 (25 Feb 2004 16:00:24 -0600) Lines: 117 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed2-zh.ip-plus.net!news-out2.nuthinbutnews.com!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165449 This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy to summarize what I got. NOTES: * this list is not verified yet * it isn't well formatted * it might have duplicates * it is probably a fraction of what is really out there from the earlier years of computer science * it isn't organized by title or author * metadata like ISBN numbers and dates aren't there yet as that will involve a lot of work, so it will take time Here is the very raw book list: AFC Book List "The Machine Stops", EM Forster, 1909? A Commentary on the UNIX Operating System, John Lions, UNSW, 1977. A Few Good Men from UNIVAC, D.E.Lundstrom, MIT, 1986. A Few Good Men From UNIVAC, Lundstrom A Quarter Century of UNIX, P.H.Salus, AW, 1993. Age Of The Pussyfoot, Frederick Pohl Alan M. Turing Archive @ King's, Cambridge Alan Turing: The Enigma, Andrew Hodges An Introduction To Microcomputers, Adam Osborne anything from Al Kossow Arrive At Easternwine, RA Lafferty Automatic Digital Computers, Booth and Booth BCPL-the Language and its Compiler, M.Richards C.Whitby-Stevens, CUP,1979. Before the Internet: Building the ARPAnet, BB&N, Peer-to-Peer, 1997. Before the Internet: Packet Communication, Bob Metcalfe, Peer-to-Peer, Before the Internet: Planning the ARPAnet, P.H.Salus ed., Brainfix, Chris Boyce Casting the Net, P.H.Salus, AW, 1994. Common Lisp: The Language, Guy Steele Computer Architecture and Parallel Processing by Hwang and Briggs Computer Architecture: Concepts and Evolution by Blaauw and Brooks Computer Engineering: A DEC view of Hardware Systems Design by Bell, Mudge and Macnamara Computer Lib / Dream Machines, Ted Nelson Computer Structures: Principles and Examples by Siewiorek, Bell and Newell Computer, M.Campbell-Kelly W.Aspray, Basic, 1996. Computing Perspectives, M.V.Wilkes, Morgan Kaufmann, 1995. "Cortada" Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX Operating System, McKusick Leffler Karels Quartermann Digital At Work, Pearson, 1992 Early British Computers, Simon Lavington Edgser W. Dijkstra Archive @ Austin Enigma: Biography of Alan Turing by Robert Harris Epiktistes (short stories), ??? Faster Than Thought, BV Bowden, 1953 Fire In The Valley Fundamentals of Interactive Computer Graphics, J.D.Foley A.vanDam, AW,1982. IBM's 360 and Early 370 Systems, Pugh Johnson Palmer, 1991 IBM's Early Computers, Bashe et al, MIT, 1986. IBM-Colossus in Transition, Robert Sobel, Times, 1981. Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th Edition with Source Code, John Lions, Management and the Computer of the Future, M.Greenberger ed., MIT,1962. Memoirs of a Computer Pioneer, M.V.Wilkes, MIT, 1985. Packet Communication by Bob Metcalfe Pascal User's Manual and Report, K.Jensen N.Wirth, Springer, 1974. Peer-to-Peer, a journal? Proceedings of HOPL and HOPL-II Reduced Instruction Set Computers, Stallings Rekursiv: Object-Oriented Computer Architecture, Harland Linn Rockerick stuff?, John Sladek Simulacron-3 Software Tools, B.W.Kernighan P.J.Plauger, AW, 1976. Structured Programming, O.-J.Dahl E.W.Dijkstra C.A.R.Hoare, AP, 1972. Technical Aspects of Data Communications, J.E.McNamara, Digital, 1977. The Adolescence of P1, Thomas J Ryan The Art Of Computer Programming, Donald Knuth The Big Idea, Anchor Books, 1999 The Compatible Time-Sharing System: A User's Guide, F.J.Corbato, MIT,1963. The Computer Contradictionary, 2nd ed., Stan Kelly-Bootle, MIT, 1995. The Computer-My Life, Konrad Zuse, Springer, 1993. The Computer: My Life's Work, Conrad Zuse The Cuckoo's Egg, Cliff Stoll, 1989 The Cyberiad, Stanslaw Lem The Dartmouth Time-sharing System The Devil's DP Dictionary, Stan Kelly-Bootle, McG-H, 1981. The Elements of Friendly Software Design, Paul Heckel, Warner, 1982. The Elements of Programming Style, B.W.Kernighan P.J.Plauger, AW,1974. The Machine Stops, EM Forster, 1909? The Matrix, John Quarterman, Digital, 1990. The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress, Heinlein, 1965 The Multics System, Organick The Multics System: An Examination of its Structure, E.I.Organick,MIT, 1972. The Mythical Man-Month by Fred Brooks The Mythical Man-Month, F.P.Brooks,Jr., AW, 1975 2000. The non-ESR versions of the Jargon File The Origins Of Digital Computers, Brian Randell The Psychology of Computer Programming, Gerry Weinberg, VNR, 1971. The SAGE Air Defence System, John Jacobs, 1986 The Shockwave Rider, John Brunner The Soul Of A New Machine, Tracy Kidder The Source Code Control System, M.Rochkind, IEEE Trans.Soft.Eng.,1975. The Universal Elixir and Other Computing Projects Which Failed by Robert L. Glass Turing And The Computer, Paul Strathern, 1997 When Harlie Was One, David Gerrold Where Wizards Stay Up Late, Katie Hafner Matthew Lyon -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- [4649 5920 4320 204e 4452 5420 5348 5920 4820 2056 2054 434d 2048 4d54 2045 204e 5259 4820 444e 0a53] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: Yeechang Lee Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 01:10:52 GMT Organization: Stanford 2nd Ward, Menlo Park California Stake Lines: 40 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: c-24-7-53-32.client.comcast.net (24.7.53.32) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077757852 53331605 I 24.7.53.32 ([91648]) X-Disclaimer: I don't speak for Arbor Advisors and it doesn't speak for me. X-Face: %^ToN=d7q{|gq79RFo$EU&4s!t3&qJH&JMvZ}HW:]|:izyAXGULq'amJchE3=H;~bLWLO0VM}0ei{:J;#j%o!Hv\Mh*r_.r^7cO-Sp(a@eFu`a!Wpw*,P~lUINX`!7T=*&$/&z>:q=FGhL)~("K6,IY[fa*Z wrote: > Common Lisp: The Language, Guy Steele If this is on the list, then surely this should as well: _Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs_ (1984, 1996), Abelson and Sussman (text available on the net for free at ) > Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) If magazines qualify, then _Byte_ from its 1975 founding through sometime in the mid-1980s (Perhaps when "Ciarcia's Circuit Cellar" left its pages? When the magazine stopped calling itself "The Small Systems Journal"?) is undoubtedly head and shoulders above any other from the micro era, with runnerup possibly _Creative Computing_'s entire 1974-1985 run. (And speaking of David Ahl, surely his classic book _101 Computer Games_ also qualifies.) I don't think system-specific magazines are appropriate for this list, but if they are I think only one really qualifies: _Transactor_ for the Commodore line. > Fire In The Valley Only its first edition (1984), even with its flaws; the second (1999)'s flaws are significantly greater. Also: _Art of Computer Game Design_ (1981), Crawford -- Read my Deep Thoughts @ PERTH ----> * 16:54:01 up 3 days, 18:54, 17 users, load average: 1.19, 1.06, 1.01 164 processes: 159 sleeping, 4 running, 1 zombie, 0 stopped CPU states: 4.8% user 4.4% system 90.6% nice 0.0% iowait 0.0% idle ###### From: Yeechang Lee Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 01:12:24 GMT Organization: Stanford 2nd Ward, Menlo Park California Stake Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: c-24-7-53-32.client.comcast.net (24.7.53.32) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077757944 53331605 I 24.7.53.32 ([91648]) X-Disclaimer: I don't speak for Arbor Advisors and it doesn't speak for me. X-Face: %^ToN=d7q{|gq79RFo$EU&4s!t3&qJH&JMvZ}HW:]|:izyAXGULq'amJchE3=H;~bLWLO0VM}0ei{:J;#j%o!Hv\Mh*r_.r^7cO-Sp(a@eFu`a!Wpw*,P~lUINX`!7T=*&$/&z>:q=FGhL)~("K6,IY[fa*Z PERTH ----> * 17:11:01 up 3 days, 19:11, 17 users, load average: 1.16, 1.09, 1.02 161 processes: 157 sleeping, 3 running, 1 zombie, 0 stopped CPU states: 4.8% user 4.4% system 90.6% nice 0.0% iowait 0.0% idle ###### From: adam@fsf.net (Adam Thornton) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 01:40:47 +0000 (UTC) Organization: Doghair Drifts Lines: 18 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: dev-linux.fsf.net X-Trace: news.fsf.net 1077759647 22547 192.168.1.4 (26 Feb 2004 01:40:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@fsf.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 01:40:47 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: adam@fsf.net (Adam Thornton) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!newsfeed.yul.equant.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!news.fsf.net!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165463 In article , Yeechang Lee wrote: >If magazines qualify, then _Byte_ from its 1975 founding through >sometime in the mid-1980s (Perhaps when "Ciarcia's Circuit Cellar" >left its pages? When the magazine stopped calling itself "The Small >Systems Journal"?) is undoubtedly head and shoulders above any other >from the micro era, with runnerup possibly _Creative Computing_'s >entire 1974-1985 run. You do know about "Circuit Cellar," right? That's Steve's actual magazine and has been for, eek, a decade and a half or so. It's been less fun recently, because it's really a professional trade journal for engineers now, and has fewer cool hobbyist projects for those of us without easy access to ways to solder surface-mount-devices onto small-run professionally-produced PCBs. For *those*, read "Nuts and Volts." Adam ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 25 Feb 04 17:49:54 -0800 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 23 Message-ID: <774.551T2735T10695572@kltpzyxm.invalid> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: p-436.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews2 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165477 In article shannon@news.widomaker.com (Charles Shannon Hendrix) writes: >This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) Computerworld In addition to the stories written by Robert L. Glass under the pseudonym Miles Benson (some of which were published as the book "The Universal Elixir..."), they also had a column entitled "Black Hat, White Hat" by Herb Grosch. Plus all of the usual trade rag stuff, of course. -- /~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! ###### From: "Hank Oredson" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: Subject: Re: AFC Book List Lines: 147 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:49:16 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.8.214 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1077763756 12.73.8.214 (Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:49:16 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:49:16 GMT Organization: AT&T Worldnet Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!nf3.bellglobal.com!wn11feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165464 A few more from the bookshelf across the room: "From Dits to Bits ... A Personal History of the Electronic Computer." by Herman Lukoff. Robotics Press, 1979. Introduction by J. Presper Eckert and Dr. John W. Mauchly. "Description of a Relay Calculator." by The Staff of the Computation Laboratory. Harvard University Press, 1949 "The Annals of the Computation Laboratory of Harvard University." I seem to remember there were 21 or 22 volumes in the set. This one is Volume XVI, 1948; the one over there is Volume I, 1946. -- ... Hank http://horedson.home.att.net http://w0rli.home.att.net "Charles Shannon Hendrix" wrote in message news:if3j1c.mdl.ln@escape.shannon.net... > > This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. > > I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy > to summarize what I got. > > NOTES: > > * this list is not verified yet > * it isn't well formatted > * it might have duplicates > * it is probably a fraction of what is really out there from the > earlier years of computer science > * it isn't organized by title or author > * metadata like ISBN numbers and dates aren't there yet as that > will involve a lot of work, so it will take time > > Here is the very raw book list: > > > AFC Book List > > "The Machine Stops", EM Forster, 1909? > A Commentary on the UNIX Operating System, John Lions, UNSW, 1977. > A Few Good Men from UNIVAC, D.E.Lundstrom, MIT, 1986. > A Few Good Men From UNIVAC, Lundstrom > A Quarter Century of UNIX, P.H.Salus, AW, 1993. > Age Of The Pussyfoot, Frederick Pohl > Alan M. Turing Archive @ King's, Cambridge > Alan Turing: The Enigma, Andrew Hodges > An Introduction To Microcomputers, Adam Osborne > anything from Al Kossow > Arrive At Easternwine, RA Lafferty > Automatic Digital Computers, Booth and Booth > BCPL-the Language and its Compiler, M.Richards C.Whitby-Stevens, CUP,1979. > Before the Internet: Building the ARPAnet, BB&N, Peer-to-Peer, 1997. > Before the Internet: Packet Communication, Bob Metcalfe, Peer-to-Peer, > Before the Internet: Planning the ARPAnet, P.H.Salus ed., > Brainfix, Chris Boyce > Casting the Net, P.H.Salus, AW, 1994. > Common Lisp: The Language, Guy Steele > Computer Architecture and Parallel Processing by Hwang and Briggs > Computer Architecture: Concepts and Evolution by Blaauw and Brooks > Computer Engineering: A DEC view of Hardware Systems Design by Bell, Mudge and Macnamara > Computer Lib / Dream Machines, Ted Nelson > Computer Structures: Principles and Examples by Siewiorek, Bell and Newell > Computer, M.Campbell-Kelly W.Aspray, Basic, 1996. > Computing Perspectives, M.V.Wilkes, Morgan Kaufmann, 1995. > "Cortada" > Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) > Design and Implementation of the 4.3BSD UNIX Operating System, McKusick Leffler Karels Quartermann > Digital At Work, Pearson, 1992 > Early British Computers, Simon Lavington > Edgser W. Dijkstra Archive @ Austin > Enigma: Biography of Alan Turing by Robert Harris > Epiktistes (short stories), ??? > Faster Than Thought, BV Bowden, 1953 > Fire In The Valley > Fundamentals of Interactive Computer Graphics, J.D.Foley A.vanDam, AW,1982. > IBM's 360 and Early 370 Systems, Pugh Johnson Palmer, 1991 > IBM's Early Computers, Bashe et al, MIT, 1986. > IBM-Colossus in Transition, Robert Sobel, Times, 1981. > Lions' Commentary on UNIX 6th Edition with Source Code, John Lions, > Management and the Computer of the Future, M.Greenberger ed., MIT,1962. > Memoirs of a Computer Pioneer, M.V.Wilkes, MIT, 1985. > Packet Communication by Bob Metcalfe > Pascal User's Manual and Report, K.Jensen N.Wirth, Springer, 1974. > Peer-to-Peer, a journal? > Proceedings of HOPL and HOPL-II > Reduced Instruction Set Computers, Stallings > Rekursiv: Object-Oriented Computer Architecture, Harland Linn > Rockerick stuff?, John Sladek > Simulacron-3 > Software Tools, B.W.Kernighan P.J.Plauger, AW, 1976. > Structured Programming, O.-J.Dahl E.W.Dijkstra C.A.R.Hoare, AP, 1972. > Technical Aspects of Data Communications, J.E.McNamara, Digital, 1977. > The Adolescence of P1, Thomas J Ryan > The Art Of Computer Programming, Donald Knuth > The Big Idea, Anchor Books, 1999 > The Compatible Time-Sharing System: A User's Guide, F.J.Corbato, MIT,1963. > The Computer Contradictionary, 2nd ed., Stan Kelly-Bootle, MIT, 1995. > The Computer-My Life, Konrad Zuse, Springer, 1993. > The Computer: My Life's Work, Conrad Zuse > The Cuckoo's Egg, Cliff Stoll, 1989 > The Cyberiad, Stanslaw Lem > The Dartmouth Time-sharing System > The Devil's DP Dictionary, Stan Kelly-Bootle, McG-H, 1981. > The Elements of Friendly Software Design, Paul Heckel, Warner, 1982. > The Elements of Programming Style, B.W.Kernighan P.J.Plauger, AW,1974. > The Machine Stops, EM Forster, 1909? > The Matrix, John Quarterman, Digital, 1990. > The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress, Heinlein, 1965 > The Multics System, Organick > The Multics System: An Examination of its Structure, E.I.Organick,MIT, 1972. > The Mythical Man-Month by Fred Brooks > The Mythical Man-Month, F.P.Brooks,Jr., AW, 1975 2000. > The non-ESR versions of the Jargon File > The Origins Of Digital Computers, Brian Randell > The Psychology of Computer Programming, Gerry Weinberg, VNR, 1971. > The SAGE Air Defence System, John Jacobs, 1986 > The Shockwave Rider, John Brunner > The Soul Of A New Machine, Tracy Kidder > The Source Code Control System, M.Rochkind, IEEE Trans.Soft.Eng.,1975. > The Universal Elixir and Other Computing Projects Which Failed by Robert L. Glass > Turing And The Computer, Paul Strathern, 1997 > When Harlie Was One, David Gerrold > Where Wizards Stay Up Late, Katie Hafner Matthew Lyon > > > -- > shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- [4649 5920 4320 204e 4452 5420 5348 5920 4820 > 2056 2054 434d 2048 4d54 2045 204e 5259 4820 444e 0a53] > > > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:47:21 -0500 Message-ID: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.135 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077768064 209.96.179.135 (25 Feb 2004 22:01:04 -0600) Lines: 70 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165466 On 2004-02-26, Yeechang Lee wrote: > First off, my apologies for not responding to the earlier thread. > > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> Common Lisp: The Language, Guy Steele > > If this is on the list, then surely this should as well: > > _Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs_ (1984, 1996), > Abelson and Sussman (text available on the net for free at > ) I thought it was on the list. I might have left something out. I use a program called HNB to organize information into outlines, and it cannot export a single branch, only the entire database. It's just temporary until I can come up with something better. I even thought about storing the list in some kind of bibliography format. >> Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) > > If magazines qualify, then _Byte_ from its 1975 founding through > sometime in the mid-1980s (Perhaps when "Ciarcia's Circuit Cellar" > left its pages? I have mixed feelings about magazines myself. Only a few have ever been any good, and many of those fizzled out in the last 20 years. > When the magazine stopped calling itself "The Small Systems Journal"?) > is undoubtedly head and shoulders above any other from the micro era, > with runnerup possibly _Creative Computing_'s entire 1974-1985 run. Hmmm... I never liked that magazine. It seemed way too amateurish and dumbed down, at least the few issues I read. > (And speaking of David Ahl, surely his classic book _101 Computer > Games_ also qualifies.) Isn't that a book of BASIC sources? >> Fire In The Valley > > Only its first edition (1984), even with its flaws; the second > (1999)'s flaws are significantly greater. The only reason I included that was it is one of the few that covers those topics in a way that doesn't make you want to hurl the book through a window. I hated the second one too. > Also: _Art of Computer Game Design_ (1981), Crawford Maybe. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["There is no such thing as security. Life is either bold adventure, or it is nothing -- Helen Keller"] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: Yeechang Lee Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 04:09:30 GMT Organization: Stanford 2nd Ward, Menlo Park California Stake Lines: 37 Message-ID: References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: c-24-7-53-32.client.comcast.net (24.7.53.32) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077768570 54976892 I 24.7.53.32 ([91648]) X-Disclaimer: I don't speak for Arbor Advisors and it doesn't speak for me. X-Face: %^ToN=d7q{|gq79RFo$EU&4s!t3&qJH&JMvZ}HW:]|:izyAXGULq'amJchE3=H;~bLWLO0VM}0ei{:J;#j%o!Hv\Mh*r_.r^7cO-Sp(a@eFu`a!Wpw*,P~lUINX`!7T=*&$/&z>:q=FGhL)~("K6,IY[fa*Z wrote: > >> Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) > > > > If magazines qualify, then _Byte_ from its 1975 founding through > > sometime in the mid-1980s (Perhaps when "Ciarcia's Circuit Cellar" > > left its pages? > > I have mixed feelings about magazines myself. > > Only a few have ever been any good, and many of those fizzled out in the > last 20 years. Agreed; however, if any magazine makes the cut, a _Byte_ subset belongs there. > > [W]ith runnerup possibly _Creative Computing_'s entire 1974-1985 > > run. > > Hmmm... I never liked that magazine. It seemed way too amateurish and > dumbed down, at least the few issues I read. While not in _Byte_'s league, still notably better than rivals _Popular Computing_ and _COMPUTE!_. > > (And speaking of David Ahl, surely his classic book _101 Computer > > Games_ also qualifies.) > > Isn't that a book of BASIC sources? Yes, but a very seminal one that pretty much launched an entire generation of gamers on mid-'70s mainframes/minis and the first generation of micros. -- Read my Deep Thoughts @ PERTH ----> * 20:07:02 up 3 days, 22:07, 17 users, load average: 1.24, 1.24, 1.13 164 processes: 160 sleeping, 3 running, 1 zombie, 0 stopped CPU states: 4.8% user 4.4% system 90.6% nice 0.0% iowait 0.0% idle ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 04:20:59 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 36 Message-ID: References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1077769259 20652 134.117.136.48 (26 Feb 2004 04:20:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 26 Feb 2004 04:20:59 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.carleton.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!syros.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!news-FFM2.ecrc.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165470 Charles Shannon Hendrix (shannon@news.widomaker.com) writes: > On 2004-02-26, Yeechang Lee wrote: > > >> When the magazine stopped calling itself "The Small Systems Journal"?) >> is undoubtedly head and shoulders above any other from the micro era, >> with runnerup possibly _Creative Computing_'s entire 1974-1985 run. > > Hmmm... I never liked that magazine. It seemed way too amateurish and > dumbed down, at least the few issues I read. > Of course, it was aimed at a very different crowd. It came out before there was a "home computer" market, and I gather was aimed at people who used BASIC. It got to change because those home computers came along. But it was never a technical magazine in the way that BYTE and Kilobaud were. I think a lot of the non-technical magazines (and this applies even up to the days of Wired) had too big a sense of "gosh" in dealing with the technology. The people writing often weren't the people doing, and that colored things. One might expect self-written articles to be hype, but I found that to be rarely the case, while when third parties wrote about something, they often were too dazzled by someone else's ability. The one issue of "Creative Computing" that I have intact (and it was one of the few issues that I bought new, though I did buy them from time to time at used prices) actually might be worth adding to the list. It's their tenth anniversary issue, November 1984, and the magazine did not live much longer. It's full of first person articles about the early days of small computers. Written at a time when it wasn't too far in the past, but with many of the events given the distance of some time. It dates from a time when most of those early home computer people were still active in the industry, rather than being called back years later to tell their story. Michael ###### From: Leif Harcke Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:48:45 -0800 Organization: Stanford University Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: dnab42a4a7.stanford.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso885915 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.Stanford.EDU 1077774524 6671 171.66.164.167 (26 Feb 2004 05:48:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@news.stanford.edu User-Agent: Pan/0.11.4 (Unix) X-Comment-To: "Charles Shannon Hendrix" Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!shelby.stanford.edu!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165472 On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:18:42 -0800, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy to > summarize what I got. I think this was mentioned previously: _The Computer from Pascal to von Neumann_, by Herman H. Goldstine Princeton University Press, 1973, 1980 (reprint). Back cover blurb: "In 1942, Lt. Herman H. Goldstine, a former mathematics professor, was stationed at the Moore School of Electrical Engineering at the University of Pennsylvania. It was there that he assisted in the creation of the ENIAC, the first electronic digital computer. The ENIAC was operational in 1945, but plans for a new computer were already underway. The principal source of ideas for the new computer was John von Neumann, who became Goldstine's chief collaborator. Together they developed EDVAC, successor to ENIAC. After World War II, at the Institute for Advanced Study, they built what was to become the prototype of the present-day computer. Herman Goldstine writes as both historian and scientist in this first examination of the development of computing machinery, from the seventeenth century through the early 1950s. His personal involvement lends a special authenticity to his narrative, as he sprinkles anecdotes and stories liberally through his text." -Leif ###### From: Leif Harcke Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:09:52 -0800 Organization: Stanford University Lines: 24 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: dnab42a4a7.stanford.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso885915 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: news.Stanford.EDU 1077775791 8919 171.66.164.167 (26 Feb 2004 06:09:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@news.stanford.edu User-Agent: Pan/0.11.4 (Unix) X-Comment-To: "Charles Shannon Hendrix" Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!shelby.stanford.edu!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165473 On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:18:42 -0800, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > The Cuckoo's Egg, Cliff Stoll, 1989 If you have Stoll's book on the list, then you also have to include _The Eudaemonic Pie_, Thomas A. Bass Houghton Mifflin, 1985 Backinprint, 2000 (reprint) ISBN: 0595142362 This non-fiction tale takes place during the microcomputer revolution of the late 1970's. It is the true story of a bunch of 20somethings from Silicon Valley and Santa Cruz who built a distributed, collaborative set of microcomputers to run programs for predicting roulette. The gag was they put the devices into the bottom of platform shoes and set about beating the odds in Vegas. Some of the principle characters ended up at Los Alamos studying chaos theory for a decade during the 1980's, and then founded a stock picking company in the early 1990's. http://www.predict.com/ -Leif ###### Message-ID: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 14 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:28:06 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.133.7 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1077776886 12.76.133.7 (Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:28:06 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:28:06 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!telefonica.de!hirsch.in-berlin.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed.news2me.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165474 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > > This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. > > I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy > to summarize what I got. You should add "Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs", Wirth. -- Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net) Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems. USE worldnet address! ###### Sender: mark@Claudio.Messina Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Organization: dis From: Mark L Pappin Mail-Copies-To: never X-no-archive: yes X-no-ahbou: yes Date: 26 Feb 2004 17:40:36 +1000 Message-ID: Lines: 8 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.219.142.118 X-Original-Trace: 26 Feb 2004 18:40:36 +1100, 203.219.142.118 NNTP-Posting-Host: dnews.tpgi.com.au X-Trace: news-syd 1077781489 dnews.tpgi.com.au (26 Feb 2004 02:44:49 -0500) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!news-peer-west.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!news-syd!dnews.tpgi.com.au!tpg.com.au!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165482 Charles Shannon Hendrix writes: > I even thought about storing the list in some kind of bibliography > format. I trust you're looking at BibTeX? mlp ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:59:53 +0000 Organization: Utility Muffin Research Kitchen Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: host81-128-244-22.in-addr.btopenworld.com (81.128.244.22) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077789726 53674194 I 81.128.244.22 ([203095]) X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.3-20031220 ("Taransay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.19 (i686)) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!host81-128-244-22.in-addr.btopenworld.COM!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165485 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > Enigma: Biography of Alan Turing by Robert Harris No, this is a novel set at Bletchley Park. pete -- pete@fenelon.com "there's no room for enigmas in built-up areas" ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:24:43 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 10 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1077794695 25355 81.100.44.205 (26 Feb 2004 11:24:55 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:24:55 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!212.23.6.1.MISMATCH!fuller.zen.co.uk!dedekind.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!130.88.203.18.MISMATCH!peernews.mcc.ac.uk!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165500 Pete Fenelon wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> Enigma: Biography of Alan Turing by Robert Harris > No, this is a novel set at Bletchley Park. We've done this already, and established that there are two or three books with the same name. One of them is indeed a novel. Pete ###### From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 11:27:19 +0000 Organization: Posted via Forte APN, http://www.forteinc.com/apn/index.php Message-ID: Reply-To: Nick Spalding References: X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 2.0/32.646 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/2.0.0.1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 14 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed.news2me.com!sn-xit-02!sn-xit-04!sn-xit-01!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!news20.forteinc.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165502 Pete Verdon wrote, in : > Pete Fenelon wrote: > > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >> Enigma: Biography of Alan Turing by Robert Harris > > > No, this is a novel set at Bletchley Park. > > We've done this already, and established that there are two or three books > with the same name. One of them is indeed a novel. And that is the Robert Harris one. -- Nick Spalding ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 15:21:02 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 35 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1077808862 7796 134.117.136.48 (26 Feb 2004 15:21:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 26 Feb 2004 15:21:02 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.carleton.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!news.netplace.de!news-FFM2.ecrc.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165528 Leif Harcke (lharcke@Stanford.EDU) writes: > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:18:42 -0800, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> The Cuckoo's Egg, Cliff Stoll, 1989 > > If you have Stoll's book on the list, then you also have to include > > _The Eudaemonic Pie_, Thomas A. Bass > Houghton Mifflin, 1985 > Backinprint, 2000 (reprint) > ISBN: 0595142362 > > This non-fiction tale takes place during the microcomputer revolution > of the late 1970's. It is the true story of a bunch of 20somethings > from Silicon Valley and Santa Cruz who built a distributed, > collaborative set of microcomputers to run programs for predicting > roulette. The gag was they put the devices into the bottom of > platform shoes and set about beating the odds in Vegas. > > Some of the principle characters ended up at Los Alamos studying chaos > theory for a decade during the 1980's, and then founded a stock > picking company in the early 1990's. > > http://www.predict.com/ > > -Leif It's kind of worth reading, but I never kept the copy I bought at a clearance. It wasn't something I wanted to reread, and memory tells me it was more about the adventure than the technical aspects. Many/most of the books on the list are there because over the test of time people still refer to them. Michael ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:24:39 -0500 Message-ID: <7ldl1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.185.97 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077822030 209.96.185.97 (26 Feb 2004 13:00:30 -0600) Lines: 41 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed2-zh.ip-plus.net!news-out2.nuthinbutnews.com!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165558 On 2004-02-26, Michael Black wrote: > Of course, it was aimed at a very different crowd. It came out before > there was a "home computer" market, and I gather was aimed at people who > used BASIC. It got to change because those home computers came along. [snip] I suppose it is historically important then. > But it was never a technical magazine in the way that BYTE and Kilobaud > were. I wish Byte was back... the old Byte. Even "hard core" magazines these days are way to, um, "fluffy". > I think a lot of the non-technical magazines (and this applies > even up to the days of Wired) had too big a sense of "gosh" in dealing > with the technology. Wired had great potential, and it seems like some people there at least are hell bent on ruining it. I don't understand several of the really stupid things they do, and some of the absolute crap they allow into the magazine. Some of the articles they do are excellent, its just not enough signal in the noise. And what is up with font stupidity like silver text on red backgrounds? -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["There is no such thing as security. Life is either bold adventure, or it is nothing -- Helen Keller"] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:28:42 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.185.97 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077822031 209.96.185.97 (26 Feb 2004 13:00:31 -0600) Lines: 28 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165559 On 2004-02-26, Mark L Pappin wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix writes: > >> I even thought about storing the list in some kind of bibliography >> format. > > I trust you're looking at BibTeX? Thinking about it. Then again, there are a lot of easy database formats I could use. The primary goal is hand-editable, but easy to index or process with a program. This is not the only database I maintain. Lately I've been trying to think of better storage formats. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["There is no such thing as security. Life is either bold adventure, or it is nothing -- Helen Keller"] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 Message-ID: <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.185.97 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077822035 209.96.185.97 (26 Feb 2004 13:00:35 -0600) Lines: 27 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed2-zh.ip-plus.net!news-out2.nuthinbutnews.com!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165562 On 2004-02-26, CBFalconer wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> >> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >> >> I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy >> to summarize what I got. > > You should add "Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs", Wirth. Actually, some people like that I just add their name to another list, to flesh out later. I wish you could query book databases without using the WWW. I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a program to automate a lot of the work. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["There is no such thing as security. Life is either bold adventure, or it is nothing -- Helen Keller"] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:11:41 +0000 Organization: Utility Muffin Research Kitchen Lines: 12 Message-ID: References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: host81-128-244-22.in-addr.btopenworld.com (81.128.244.22) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077822729 55379503 I 81.128.244.22 ([203095]) X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.3-20031220 ("Taransay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.19 (i686)) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!host81-128-244-22.in-addr.btopenworld.COM!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165565 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> >> I trust you're looking at BibTeX? > > Thinking about it. > Ugh. Please think about refer(1) instead. ;) pete -- pete@fenelon.com "there's no room for enigmas in built-up areas" ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 26 Feb 2004 20:21:35 GMT Lines: 18 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: 159-134-254-253.as1.nas.naas.eircom.net (159.134.254.253) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077826895 53793788 I 159.134.254.253 ([132592]) User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!159-134-254-253.as1.nas.naas.eircom.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165576 > Epiktistes (short stories), ??? > Faster Than Thought, BV Bowden, 1953 > The Soul Of A New Machine, Tracy Kidder > The Source Code Control System, M.Rochkind, IEEE Trans.Soft.Eng.,1975. > The Universal Elixir and Other Computing Projects Which Failed by Robert L. Glass > Turing And The Computer, Paul Strathern, 1997 > When Harlie Was One, David Gerrold > Where Wizards Stay Up Late, Katie Hafner Matthew Lyon Could this list be made dynamic some way, and have a field for rating?... Thanks for the effort, anyway. -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:27:19 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.185.46 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077840033 209.96.185.46 (26 Feb 2004 18:00:33 -0600) Lines: 24 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.rwth-aachen.de!news-out2.nuthinbutnews.com!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165604 On 2004-02-26, Pete Fenelon wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >>> >>> I trust you're looking at BibTeX? >> >> Thinking about it. >> > > Ugh. Please think about refer(1) instead. ;) Nothing written in stone... :) I'd have to think about refer or BibTex either one. In the past I've often used text files with block records. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:59 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.185.46 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1077840036 209.96.185.46 (26 Feb 2004 18:00:36 -0600) Lines: 27 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!news-fra1.dfn.de!news.rwth-aachen.de!news-out2.nuthinbutnews.com!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165605 On 2004-02-26, greymaus@yahoo.com wrote: > Could this list be made dynamic some way, and have a field for > rating?... It could be, but that would mean probably a website or telnet application that I don't have time for. A wiki might be interesting. In fact, it might be interesting if AFC had a website. I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored and properly filled out. It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database on a CD or something to search through. Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: Peter Flass User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 9 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 00:50:58 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.194.63.80 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com X-Trace: twister.nyroc.rr.com 1077843058 24.194.63.80 (Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:50:58 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 19:50:58 EST Organization: Road Runner Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!telefonica.de!eusc.inter.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news-rtr.nyroc.rr.com!news-out.nyroc.rr.com!twister.nyroc.rr.com.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165615 Yeechang Lee wrote: > >>Datamation, a magazine (need more old computer rags) > "Software Age". This was a 50's/60's mag that had a mix of employment-related stuff and programming "how-to" articles. Sorry, I didn't save any copies, though I did save the occasional article. ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:38:30 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 9 Message-ID: References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1077845926 23208 81.100.44.205 (27 Feb 2004 01:38:46 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:38:46 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165631 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a > program to automate a lot of the work. Hard but not impossible. I have a collection of Perl scripts that download and parse various pages with information that I'm interested in. Pete ###### From: "Hank Oredson" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Subject: Re: AFC Book List Lines: 39 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:41:10 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.8.105 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1077856870 12.73.8.105 (Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:41:10 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:41:10 GMT Organization: AT&T Worldnet Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!zen.net.uk!fuller.zen.co.uk!news.anlx.net!textnews.ldn.kewlio.net!lightspeed.eweka.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165642 "Charles Shannon Hendrix" wrote in message news:ncvl1c.6mk.ln@escape.shannon.net... > On 2004-02-26, Pete Fenelon wrote: > > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >>> > >>> I trust you're looking at BibTeX? > >> > >> Thinking about it. > >> > > > > Ugh. Please think about refer(1) instead. ;) > > Nothing written in stone... :) > > I'd have to think about refer or BibTex either one. > > In the past I've often used text files with block records. Please make it something generic, and not OS specific. "refer(1)", whatever that might be, would be of no use to me. Ditto anything ending in "TeX". Something called "ASCII" works pretty well for small databases, perhaps less than 10,000 or even 100,000 records. Create and store it any way you like, but please consider some simple and generic exchange format as a means to make it available to "everyone" ... even if they happen to run a C20. -- ... Hank - (I'm not B1FF) http://horedson.home.att.net http://w0rli.home.att.net ###### From: "Hank Oredson" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: Subject: Re: AFC Book List Lines: 41 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:44:23 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.8.105 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1077857063 12.73.8.105 (Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:44:23 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 04:44:23 GMT Organization: AT&T Worldnet Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!nf3.bellglobal.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165643 "Charles Shannon Hendrix" wrote in message news:nhvl1c.6mk.ln@escape.shannon.net... > On 2004-02-26, greymaus@yahoo.com wrote: > > > Could this list be made dynamic some way, and have a field for > > rating?... > > It could be, but that would mean probably a website or telnet > application that I don't have time for. Web site. Will be a rather small database. Perhaps someone will volunteer to host it. I would do so, but my current ISP does not provide appropriate facilities to make it easy for me to do. > A wiki might be interesting. > > In fact, it might be interesting if AFC had a website. Now THAT is scary! > I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored > and properly filled out. > > It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database > on a CD or something to search through. > > Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. Google? -- ... Hank http://horedson.home.att.net http://w0rli.home.att.net ###### Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 07:58:21 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 13 Organization: Wanadoo NNTP-Posting-Date: 27 Feb 2004 16:23:39 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0433.nas3-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1077899019 willi.euronet.nl 63304 62.234.217.179:1551 X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsfeed.multikabel.nl!news2.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.wanadoo.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165696 On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: CSH> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a CSH> program to automate a lot of the work. The solution to this problem is supposed to be SOAP interfaces :( -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: Lines: 17 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 09:30:40 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.111.167.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1077872416 80.111.167.46 (Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:00:16 MET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 10:00:16 MET Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed.esat.net!newsfeed.icl.net!kibo.news.demon.net!demon!newshub1.home.nl!home.nl!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165655 In article , Pete Verdon wrote: >Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a >> program to automate a lot of the work. > >Hard but not impossible. I have a collection of Perl scripts that download >and parse various pages with information that I'm interested in. A scriptable non-display browser is on my wishlist, just for these cases where the web is the only entrance. As long as they stick to html the task is not that complicated. It is wading through flash, javascript etc that is the challenge. -- mrr ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:04:10 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1077879877 16860 81.100.44.205 (27 Feb 2004 11:04:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:04:37 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!skynet.be!peer.news.eu-x.com!server2.netnews.ja.net!news.bham.ac.uk!bhamcs!news-out.ftel.co.uk!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165660 Morten Reistad wrote: > A scriptable non-display browser is on my wishlist, just for these > cases where the web is the only entrance. How about wget? Pete ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: Lines: 25 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:31:36 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.111.167.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1077897616 80.111.167.46 (Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:00:16 MET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 17:00:16 MET Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!195.34.132.50.MISMATCH!newsfeed01.chello.at!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165691 In article , Pete Verdon wrote: >Morten Reistad wrote: > >> A scriptable non-display browser is on my wishlist, just for these >> cases where the web is the only entrance. > >How about wget? That is what I have to use; but this is really a tool for copying. I want a tool for interaction. Something with a small surface-language; where I could specify an url, tell it to go look for a table after certain criteria, and construct database updates based on the fields in that table. Or to find a form; fill data into the form and submit; checking errors; or for multi-sgate input repeat the perforamce for the next form in the chain. It would have to parse html, but could stay at a lexical scope and wouldn't have to bother with things like rendering etc. -- mrr ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 27 Feb 2004 17:04:30 GMT Lines: 28 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: 159-134-255-123.as1.nas.naas.eircom.net (159.134.255.123) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077901470 55212413 I 159.134.255.123 ([132592]) User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!159-134-255-123.as1.nas.naas.eircom.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165700 On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:59 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored > and properly filled out. > > It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database > on a CD or something to search through. > > Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. > The thing about THE list is that its real hardcore stuff. All good. A big publication would have to include a lot of dross. What I was thinking of is some way of indicating to a newbie a list of books that are authoritive, not necessarily new or even up-to-date, but worth while consulting. Knuths books, for instance. NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). My worst hate was a book for the Amiga ("A complete guide to REXX") (or similiar), written by someone who knew their subject, but after describing a few functions, covered the rest by "see documentation". -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong ###### Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 18:12:06 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040227181206.0e2d430b.steveo@eircom.net> References: X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 23 Organization: Wanadoo NNTP-Posting-Date: 27 Feb 2004 18:00:11 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0277.nas1-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1077904811 willi.euronet.nl 63282 62.234.209.23:1573 X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!news-fra1.dfn.de!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news2.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.wanadoo.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165710 On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:31:36 +0100 Morten Reistad wrote: MR> I want a tool for interaction. Something with a small MR> surface-language; where I could specify an url, tell it to go look for MR> a table after certain criteria, and construct database updates based MR> on the fields in that table. MR> MR> Or to find a form; fill data into the form and submit; checking MR> errors; or for multi-sgate input repeat the perforamce for the next MR> form in the chain. MR> MR> It would have to parse html, but could stay at a lexical scope MR> and wouldn't have to bother with things like rendering etc. All this is pretty straightforward with Perl - the only hard part is deciding which of the many ways of doing it to use :) -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <20040227181206.0e2d430b.steveo@eircom.net> Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: Lines: 25 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:15:17 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.111.167.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1077906619 80.111.167.46 (Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:30:19 MET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:30:19 MET Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsgate.cistron.nl!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165712 In article <20040227181206.0e2d430b.steveo@eircom.net>, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: >On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 16:31:36 +0100 >Morten Reistad wrote: > >MR> I want a tool for interaction. Something with a small >MR> surface-language; where I could specify an url, tell it to go look for >MR> a table after certain criteria, and construct database updates based >MR> on the fields in that table. >MR> >MR> Or to find a form; fill data into the form and submit; checking >MR> errors; or for multi-sgate input repeat the perforamce for the next >MR> form in the chain. >MR> >MR> It would have to parse html, but could stay at a lexical scope >MR> and wouldn't have to bother with things like rendering etc. > > All this is pretty straightforward with Perl - the only hard >part is deciding which of the many ways of doing it to use :) The perl solutions I have found has a rather ad-hoc approach to parsing html. They are parts in toolchests; but not much more. (by all means, if anyone has a real perl solution for this, tell me) -- mrr ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 27 Feb 2004 20:48:23 GMT Lines: 25 Message-ID: References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 159-134-255-197.as1.nas.naas.eircom.net (159.134.255.197) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077914903 55956992 I 159.134.255.197 ([132592]) User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!159-134-255-197.as1.nas.naas.eircom.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165729 On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 22:47:21 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > > Maybe. Also; Hackers handbook, Cornwall, NOT the jargon file, rather the British book, which allowed me to get a modem operating. At the time, probably the only real guide to telecommunications for a `micro'. It was spasmodically banned in bookshops, because it showed how to crack online systems. (Well, not really). I came into possession of a 300/300, 1250/75 (?) modem which I tried to connect to a BBS at 300. (One had a ratio of upload/download). The HH pointed that 300/300 Yuropean and 300/300 US were incompatible. Saved me a fortune, and a lot of wasted time. Way out of date now. -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:56:43 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 18 Message-ID: References: Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1077929823 16849 81.100.44.205 (28 Feb 2004 00:57:03 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 00:57:03 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!212.23.6.1.MISMATCH!fuller.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!dedekind.zen.co.uk!news.glorb.com!logbridge.uoregon.edu!feed3.jnfs.ja.net!jnfs.ja.net!rfcgr.mrc.ac.uk!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165756 Morten Reistad wrote: > Pete Verdon wrote: >>How about wget? > That is what I have to use; but this is really a tool for copying. > > I want a tool for interaction. Something with a small surface-language; > where I could specify an url, tell it to go look for a table after > certain criteria, and construct database updates based on the fields > in that table. I think you need Perl and LWP. There is an O'Reilly on this, but the latest edition that Warwick's library has is 1997. Pete (Excuse me if I make little sense; I have just returned home from the Ale Festival.) ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 01:26:07 +0000 Organization: Utility Muffin Research Kitchen Lines: 11 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: host81-133-124-215.in-addr.btopenworld.com (81.133.124.215) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1077931627 55746691 I 81.133.124.215 ([203095]) X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.3-20031220 ("Taransay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.19 (i686)) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!host81-133-124-215.in-addr.btopenworld.COM!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165764 Pete Verdon wrote: > > I think you need Perl and LWP. There is an O'Reilly on this, but the latest > edition that Warwick's library has is 1997. God forbid that I should ever *need* Perl. That's the day I give up computing and take up something socially beneficial. pete -- pete@fenelon.com "there's no room for enigmas in built-up areas" ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List From: Andrew McLaren References: Organization: not much ... Message-ID: User-Agent: Xnews/5.04.25 X-stickybeak: why are you looking at my headers? Date: 28 Feb 2004 09:42:26 GMT Lines: 19 NNTP-Posting-Host: 211.30.186.9 X-Trace: 1077961346 5871 211.30.186.9 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news.linkpendium.com!newsfeeds.ihug.co.nz!ihug.co.nz!news.xtra.co.nz!news.mel.connect.com.au!snewsf0.syd.ops.aspac.uu.net!news1.optus.net.au!optus!newsfeeder.syd.optusnet.com.au!news.optusnet.com.au!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165789 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote in news:if3j1c.mdl.ln@escape.shannon.net: > This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. < ... snip ... > Not bad for a first cut, but I'm outraged :-) you did not include: Birtwistle GM, Dahl O, Myhrhaug B and Nygaard K "Simula Begin" Lund, Sweden, 1973; ISBN 91-44-06211-7 This is the definitive book on Simula, widely acknowledged to be the first major Object Oriented language. Admittedly this is a very, um, hard-to-locate volume these days (I already have my own copy ;-)) Cheers Andrew ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Organization: me From: Morten Reistad X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: mrr@via.reistad.priv.no (Morten Reistad) Message-ID: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Lines: 100 Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:28:53 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.111.167.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@chello.no X-Trace: amstwist00 1077971408 80.111.167.46 (Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:30:08 MET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 13:30:08 MET Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsgate.cistron.nl!amsnews01.chello.com!amsnews04.chello.com!amstwist00.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165801 In article , Andrew McLaren wrote: >Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote in >news:if3j1c.mdl.ln@escape.shannon.net: > >> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. > < ... snip ... > > >Not bad for a first cut, but I'm outraged :-) you did not include: [snip ] Browsing through bookshelf : .. comment to The Mythical Man Month : re-issue / 20th anniversary isbn 0-201-83595-9 is highly recommended For algorithms we also have these in addition to Knuth : Sedgewick : Algorithms, 1984, isbn 0-201-06672-6 Press,Flannery et al : Numerical Receipes in C, 1988, isbn 0-521-35465-X and a rewrite of a classic, even if pretty narrow : Jean Meeus : Astronomical Algorithms, 2nd ed, 1998, isbn 0-943396-61-1 For a newtork reference at the dawn of the Internet : Andrew S Tanenbaum : Computer Networks . I have the 2nd ed, isbn 0-13-166836-6, but there may be better editions. And, for the OS classics : Holt, Reinhart & Winston : Unix Programmers manual, Bell labs, vol 1-2, 1983 isbn 0-03-061742-1 and ..-061743-X The isbn of "Organic : the multics system , 1972" is 0-262-15012-3 Also whatever Comer&Stevens has written on Unix and networking. They keep revising their work as the field develops. For a very strange, but enlightning look at the ideology of the Internet applied to a (then) new field; SNMP : Marshall T Rose : The Simple Book, 1991, 0-13-812611-9. I would read the Michael Padlipsky RFC's as well, for a view of the idology in the fight beween the Internet and ITU for the design of what we now know as the Internet. Also from Kelly-Bootle : (a pommie version of jargon) : Stan Kelly-bootle : The devil's DP dictionary, 1981, isbn 0-07-034022-6 and two little pearls for learning : David Alcock, Illustrating basic, 1977, isbn 0-521-21703-0 Friedman & Felleisen : the little lisperm, 1987, isbn 0-262-56038-0 Setting the standard regarding the link layer : Radia Perlman : interconnections, 1992, isbn 0-201-56332-0 And hardware around 1980 seen from two angles : Adam Osborne ; 4&8-bit microprocessor handbook, 1981, isbn 0-031988-42-x Ralph E,Gorin : Introduction to the decsystem-20 assembly language programming, 1981, isbn 0-932376-12-6 If you haven't freaked yet, try this : gilman & rose ; APL, an interactive approach, 1976, isbn 0-471-30022-5 Try Winsto&Horn : LISP and Keny Dybvig : The Scheme Programming Language to recover. For a view of the computer world a few decades back Horowitz (ed) : Programming Languages, a grand tour, 1983-87, isbn 0-88175-142-1 My dragon book is on loan, so I don't have it ready for reference, but for a lighter version when this is too heavy tr Fisher&LeBlanc : Crafting a compiler, 1988, 0-8053-3201-4 And, last, a view from some truly black hats : Jurgen Wieckmann and the CCC : Das Chaos Computer Buch, 1988, isbn 3-8052-0474-4 (In German. It may not be wise to translate this to English). I have omitted an OS vade mecum (too dated), variuos hardware books, (although the MIPS and 80386 books are gems), C/C++ stuff, and scandinavian language books. (I remember sweating through Akelius: COBOL. This was not an entry to the classics list). -- mrr ###### Message-ID: <40400CA0.F19C27F7@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 14 Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:35:07 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.128.173 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1077971707 12.76.128.173 (Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:35:07 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:35:07 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165803 Pete Fenelon wrote: > ... snip ... > > God forbid that I should ever *need* Perl. That's the day I give > up computing and take up something socially beneficial. Knitting ? :-) -- Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net) Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems. USE worldnet address! ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:14:36 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 11 Message-ID: References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1077977702 10360 81.100.44.205 (28 Feb 2004 14:15:02 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 14:15:02 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165823 Morten Reistad wrote: > For a newtork reference at the dawn of the Internet : > > Andrew S Tanenbaum : Computer Networks . I have the 2nd ed, > isbn 0-13-166836-6, but there may be better editions. I have that. It's copyright 1989, which I wouldn't call the dawn of the Internet. Pete ###### From: mwilson@the-wire.com (Mel Wilson) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: References: Lines: 13 X-Newsreader: VSoup v1.2.9.37Beta [95/NT] Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:17:51 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.206.39.51 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ca.mci.com X-Trace: nnrp1.uunet.ca 1077983956 205.206.39.51 (Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:59:16 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 10:59:16 EST Organization: MCI Canada News Reader Service Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!news.uunet.ca!nnrp1.uunet.ca.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165841 In article , Pete Fenelon wrote: >Pete Verdon wrote: >> >> I think you need Perl and LWP. There is an O'Reilly on this, but the latest >> edition that Warwick's library has is 1997. > >God forbid that I should ever *need* Perl. That's the day I give up >computing and take up something socially beneficial. In that case, the Python standard libraries have stuff that will make the job possible. Regards. Mel. ###### Message-ID: <4040D173.DE03972@comcast.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@nospam.plano.net Organization: Canine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <40400CA0.F19C27F7@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 18 NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.1.126.198 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-Trace: attbi_s51 1077982898 24.1.126.198 (Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:41:38 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:41:38 GMT Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 15:41:38 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!newsfeed.news2me.com!wn52feed!worldnet.att.net!attbi_s51.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165840 CBFalconer wrote: > > Pete Fenelon wrote: > > > ... snip ... > > > > God forbid that I should ever *need* Perl. That's the day I give > > up computing and take up something socially beneficial. > > Knitting ? :-) > Well, knitting *still* needs Perl...or rather Purl: as in "knit one, purl two"... -- +----------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | +----------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: ab528@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 28 Feb 2004 16:03:24 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <40400CA0.F19C27F7@yahoo.com> Reply-To: ab528@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1077984204 7825 134.117.136.48 (28 Feb 2004 16:03:24 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 28 Feb 2004 16:03:24 GMT X-Given-Sender: ab528@smeagol.carleton.ca (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!peer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!ab528 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165842 CBFalconer (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) writes: > Pete Fenelon wrote: >> > ... snip ... >> >> God forbid that I should ever *need* Perl. That's the day I give >> up computing and take up something socially beneficial. > > Knitting ? :-) In several waiting areas of the cancer center, there are baskets containing balls of yarn and knitting needles. Some folks add a few rows while waiting, others do a complete project, finishing at home. Even some gender-secure men participate. ###### From: mwojcik@newsguy.com (Michael Wojcik) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 28 Feb 2004 16:12:42 GMT Organization: Micro Focus International Ltd Lines: 45 Message-ID: References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> Reply-To: mwojcik@newsguy.com NNTP-Posting-Host: p-150.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: xrn 9.00 Originator: mww@sen Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!wn51feed!worldnet.att.net!129.250.175.17!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!mww Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165851 In article <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net>, Steve O'Hara-Smith writes: > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > > CSH> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a > CSH> program to automate a lot of the work. > > The solution to this problem is supposed to be SOAP interfaces :( I don't think so; at any rate, SOAP was not designed as a programmatic interface to "the Web" (ie to that mishmash of HTML and various sorts of static and executable content served via HTTP, when it works). SOAP was invented to provide an alternative to RPC mechanisms like COM and CORBA which could penetrate many existing firewalls by sending everything via HTTP (which said firewalls were already configured to allow through). It's using the HTTP channel for other purposes, not providing another interface to the materials already available by HTTP. As it's generally implemented today, SOAP isn't a good mechanism for retrieving the kinds of data people typically get via the Web anyway. Data has to be represented in XML, which is a bulky format for text and completely impractical for binary data (which has to be encoded in a printable representation like Base64). (Yes, there's the XML Attachment spec, but I don't know if it's been approved, and I haven't seen anyone use it.) Most of the HTML on the web is not XML; there's XHTML, but again almost no one has converted to it, so even plain HTML would have to be converted to be sent via SOAP. Some online service providers, like Google and Amazon, have provided SOAP interfaces parallel to their HTML ones, but they're just that - parallel. SOAP isn't providing an interface to the human-readable Web application. It's providing an interface to the business logic behind it. Getting that right is a fair bit of work, so I don't expect we'll see widespread deployment of public SOAP interfaces for most web sites. -- Michael Wojcik michael.wojcik@microfocus.com Most people believe that anything that is true is true for a reason. These theorems show that some things are true for no reason at all, i.e., accidentally, or at random. -- G J Chaitin ###### From: Frank McConnell Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: AFC book list (was Re: origin of the UNIX dd command) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:59:33 -0800 Organization: File under Psychedelia Lines: 8 Message-ID: References: <20040218073612.306f1956.steveo@eircom.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: daemonweed.reanimators.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: daemonweed.reanimators.org 1077861573 34725 192.168.1.2 (27 Feb 2004 05:59:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@reanimators.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 27 Feb 2004 05:59:33 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news.linkpendium.com!news-out.visi.com!petbe.visi.com!news.octanews.net!newsfeed.news2me.com!newsfeed3.easynews.com!newsfeed1.easynews.com!easynews.com!easynews!news.he.net!news.kjsl.com!news.reanimators.org!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165649 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > I'd love to see a modern HAKMEM. Maybe _Hacker's Delight_ by Henry S. Warren, Jr.? (ISBN 0-201-91465-4) -Frank McConnell ###### Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 18:19:40 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040228181940.3c19364a.steveo@eircom.net> References: <20040227181206.0e2d430b.steveo@eircom.net> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 24 Organization: EuroNet Internet NNTP-Posting-Date: 29 Feb 2004 02:02:18 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0874.nas1-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1078020138 news.euronet.nl 2416 62.234.211.111:1640 X-Complaints-To: abuse@euronet.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.euronet.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165893 On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 19:15:17 +0100 Morten Reistad wrote: MR> The perl solutions I have found has a rather ad-hoc approach MR> to parsing html. They are parts in toolchests; but not much more. Well I would usually do the bits that need to parse HTML with the HTML::Parser class, and the bits that need to deal with HTTP using LWP::Simple or LWP::UserAgent (depending on how fiddly I need to get), the database is probably DBI:: of course. The rest I'd put together myself :) Yes it is parts in a toolchest, and a versatile plumbing system. MR> (by all means, if anyone has a real perl solution for this, tell me) If I needed to do a lot of it then I'd probably make up some suitable abstraction that suited the kinds of things I was doing and the way they translate to HTML/HTTP handling and bundle it in a package. -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Roland Hutchinson Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 16:02:00 -0500 Lines: 32 Message-ID: References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool-141-150-100-200.nwrk.east.verizon.net (141.150.100.200) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1078002122 56926190 I 141.150.100.200 ([99522]) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool-141-150-100-200.nwrk.east.verizon.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165880 In article <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> on Saturday 28 February 2004 07:28, Morten Reistad wrote: > If you haven't freaked yet, try this : > gilman & rose ; APL, an interactive approach, 1976, isbn 0-471-30022-5 > > Try Winsto&Horn : LISP and > Keny Dybvig : The Scheme Programming Language to recover. Along these lines (sort of), I don't think anyone has yet nominated: Abelson and Sussman. The Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs (http://mitpress.mit.edu/sicp/) Others that (unless I missed it) haven't yet been mentioned: Minsky. Computation: Finite and Infinite Machines. Papert: Mindstorms. the HAKMEM. (No points will be awarded for guessing where I went to school.) Point of order: Are we allowed to nominate journal articles and dissertations? -- Roland Hutchinson Will play viola da gamba for food. NB mail to my.spamtrap [at] verizon.net is heavily filtered to remove spam. If your message looks like spam I may not see it. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List From: Andrew McLaren References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Organization: not much ... Message-ID: User-Agent: Xnews/5.04.25 X-stickybeak: why are you looking at my headers? Date: 29 Feb 2004 03:51:49 GMT Lines: 11 NNTP-Posting-Host: 211.30.186.9 X-Trace: 1078026709 15134 211.30.186.9 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!news2.euro.net!lightspeed.eweka.nl!62.45.52.242.MISMATCH!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!feeder.news-service.com!newsfeed.pacific.net.au!newsfeeder.syd.optusnet.com.au!news.optusnet.com.au!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165896 Morten Reistad wrote > Also from Kelly-Bootle : (a pommie version of jargon) : ^^^^^^ Thank you for localising the content, for the Australian audience ;-) > David Alcock, Illustrating basic, 1977, isbn 0-521-21703-0 > Friedman & Felleisen : the little lisperm, 1987, isbn 0-262-56038-0 Yep, I support this recommendation. "Illustrating BASIC" is one of the strangest learn-to-program books ever; although it's far from being the most ineffectual. ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 29 Feb 2004 04:20:14 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 23 Message-ID: References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1078028414 7482 134.117.136.48 (29 Feb 2004 04:20:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 29 Feb 2004 04:20:14 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.carleton.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!peer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165897 Andrew McLaren (amclar@optusnet.n0$p@m.com.au) writes: > Morten Reistad wrote >> Also from Kelly-Bootle : (a pommie version of jargon) : > ^^^^^^ > Thank you for localising the content, for the Australian audience ;-) > >> David Alcock, Illustrating basic, 1977, isbn 0-521-21703-0 >> Friedman & Felleisen : the little lisperm, 1987, isbn 0-262-56038-0 > > Yep, I support this recommendation. "Illustrating BASIC" is one of the > strangest learn-to-program books ever; although it's far from being the > most ineffectual. Is that the one that uses dialogue between Sherlock Holmes and Watson to introduce the reader to BASIC? If not, there was a book like that. I believe I still have a copy that I picked up used, not to learn BASIC (I used Albrecht's book for any reading I needed) but because of the Holmes and Watson angle. Though, I never really looked at it much after bringing it home. Michael ###### Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:39:09 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040229183909.6b735b08.steveo@eircom.net> References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 35 Organization: Wanadoo NNTP-Posting-Date: 29 Feb 2004 17:39:29 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0665.nas4-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1078076369 picasso.euronet.nl 24443 62.234.222.157:1660 X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!news2.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.wanadoo.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165953 On 28 Feb 2004 16:12:42 GMT mwojcik@newsguy.com (Michael Wojcik) wrote: MW> MW> In article <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net>, Steve MW> O'Hara-Smith writes: MW> > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 MW> > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: MW> > MW> > CSH> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to MW> > CSH> write a program to automate a lot of the work. MW> > MW> > The solution to this problem is supposed to be SOAP interfaces :( MW> MW> I don't think so; at any rate, SOAP was not designed as a programmatic MW> interface to "the Web" (ie to that mishmash of HTML and various sorts MW> of static and executable content served via HTTP, when it works). Be that as it may SOAP is used as the mechanism to provide an API where previously a web interface was being screen scraped. MW> parallel. SOAP isn't providing an interface to the human-readable MW> Web application. It's providing an interface to the business logic MW> behind it. Getting that right is a fair bit of work, so I don't But that is the application the web interface is providing a human usable interface to. Ack it's all a matter of perspective. -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:00:45 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 47 Message-ID: References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> <20040229183909.6b735b08.steveo@eircom.net> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1078077670 20642 81.100.44.205 (29 Feb 2004 18:01:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:01:10 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!dedekind.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!130.88.203.18.MISMATCH!peernews.mcc.ac.uk!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:165954 Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > mwojcik@newsguy.com (Michael Wojcik) wrote: >> I don't think so; at any rate, SOAP was not designed as a programmatic >> interface to "the Web" (ie to that mishmash of HTML and various sorts >> of static and executable content served via HTTP, when it works). > Be that as it may SOAP is used as the mechanism to provide an > API where previously a web interface was being screen scraped. >> SOAP isn't providing an interface to the human-readable Web application. >> It's providing an interface to the business logic behind it. > But that is the application the web interface is providing a > human usable interface to. It's this: ====== +--| Core |--+ | ====== | | | ====== ===== | SOAP | | WEB | ====== ===== | | Program Human Rather than this: ====== | Core | ====== | ===== Human----| WEB | ===== | ====== Program--| SOAP | ====== And the vast majority of setups only have the right-hand half of the top diagram, so screen-scraping is still necessary. Pete ###### From: Philip Newton Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 11:37:19 +0100 Organization: very little Lines: 21 Message-ID: <1h4640d13l6rvk2i0nt69gkrjfl18d6f3m@4ax.com> References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Reply-To: "Philip 'Yes, that's my address' Newton" NNTP-Posting-Host: cou.ch (212.13.198.90) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1078137440 56862009 I 212.13.198.90 ([11583]) X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!cou.CH!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166025 On 29 Feb 2004 04:20:14 GMT, et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: > Is that the one that uses dialogue between Sherlock Holmes and Watson > to introduce the reader to BASIC? > > If not, there was a book like that. I remember one teaching XLISP (IIRC - a dialect of Lisp running on MS-DOS machines) by introducing two children interacting with a computer (or maybe an alien?). I wish I knew what it was called. I read it in German but don't remember whether it was a translation or not. Cheers, Philip -- Philip Newton Yes, that really is my address; no need to remove anything to reply. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate. ###### Lines: 22 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: bbreynolds@aol.comedxedl (Bruce B. Reynolds) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Date: 01 Mar 2004 19:44:15 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: Session Scheduler (Queue Name: usenet_offline-m20) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040301144415.21955.00000800@mb-m20.aol.com> Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!feedme.news.mediaways.net!telefonica.de!newspump.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!audrey-m1.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166074 In article , et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) writes: >Is that the one that uses dialogue between Sherlock Holmes and Watson >to introduce the reader to BASIC? > >If not, there was a book like that. I believe I still have a copy >that I picked up used, not to learn BASIC (I used Albrecht's book >for any reading I needed) but because of the Holmes and Watson angle. >Though, I never really looked at it much after bringing it home. > There are both Henry Ledgard, _Elementary Basic_, New York, Random House, 1982 (ISBN 0-394-52423-3) and Henry Ledgard and Andrew Singer, _Elementary Pascal_, New York, Random House, 1983 (ISBN 0-394-52424-1). Both list Watson as author, with an "as told to"; the Pascal book (and I assume also the BASIC book, which I do not have) is based on the (anachronistic) premise that Holmes was using the Analytical Engine to process his clues. -- Bruce B. Reynolds, Trailing Edge Technologies, Glenside PA ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:31:27 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.45 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078272063 209.96.179.45 (2 Mar 2004 18:01:03 -0600) Lines: 66 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166237 On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: > Please make it something generic, and not OS specific. > > "refer(1)", whatever that might be, would be of no use to me. refer is a program used by the nroff family of text formatters, primarily on UNIX platforms. It's not OS specific though, and relatively easy to parse. It's just plain ascii. > Ditto anything ending in "TeX". TeX is widely available, and again, BibTeX is not hard to parse. The advantage of using refer or BibTeX is that both are easy to format nicely, and there are tools to use with them already written. I've also been using both for about 14 years... :) But like I said, nothing written in stone. > Something called "ASCII" works pretty well for small databases, > perhaps less than 10,000 or even 100,000 records. You can do very large records in text and access it fast. The key is external indexes. I've replaced SQL servers with flat text files and gained tremendous speed. Recent generations of programmers can't seem to do any data processing without an SQL server. > Create and store it any way you like, but please consider some > simple and generic exchange format as a means to make it > available to "everyone" ... even if they happen to run a C20. Don't worry, it will be a format anyone can use, and will be in ascii. It's very possible it will be an ascii block record format like this: It can be parsed with eyeballs as well as programs, and is easy to turn into other things. refer and bibtex could be generated from this too. Honestly though... the hard work won't be the format. The hard part is digging up information on all these books and getting complete information on them. That's why I was hoping I could find an online database of books, preferrably not Amazon or other WWW application. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:33:22 -0500 Message-ID: <2k532c.9bb.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.45 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078272067 209.96.179.45 (2 Mar 2004 18:01:07 -0600) Lines: 22 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166238 On 2004-02-26, CBFalconer wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> >> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >> >> I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy >> to summarize what I got. > > You should add "Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs", Wirth. What about Sedgwick's Algorithms books? They've been around for awhile, and are used by schools all over the world. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:34:19 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.45 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078272088 209.96.179.45 (2 Mar 2004 18:01:28 -0600) Lines: 25 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166239 On 2004-02-27, Pete Verdon wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a >> program to automate a lot of the work. > > Hard but not impossible. I have a collection of Perl scripts that download > and parse various pages with information that I'm interested in. Feel free to package them and email them to me. I used to write screen scrapers, but got tired of constantly updating them as the websites changed. There should be a standard for this to make things easier. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:34:45 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.45 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078272092 209.96.179.45 (2 Mar 2004 18:01:32 -0600) Lines: 15 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166240 On 2004-02-27, Morten Reistad wrote: > As long as they stick to html the task is not that complicated. > It is wading through flash, javascript etc that is the challenge. And keeping up with the near-constant changes some sites go through. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:58:09 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.45 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078272096 209.96.179.45 (2 Mar 2004 18:01:36 -0600) Lines: 21 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166241 On 2004-02-27, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >CSH> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a >CSH> program to automate a lot of the work. > > The solution to this problem is supposed to be SOAP interfaces :( Yeah, in much the same way that lethal irradiation is the solution to fever blisters. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:01:22 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.246.249.165 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078275663 206.246.249.165 (2 Mar 2004 19:01:03 -0600) Lines: 38 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166248 On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: > Web site. I bet a vote here should choose telnet app... :) > Will be a rather small database. Perhaps someone will volunteer to > host it. I have an available host. >> In fact, it might be interesting if AFC had a website. > > Now THAT is scary! But oh so interesting... >> I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored >> and properly filled out. >> >> It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database >> on a CD or something to search through. >> >> Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. > > Google? Um, no. That's even more work than using Amazon. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["We have nothing to prove" -- Alan Dawkins] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:03:33 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.246.249.165 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078275666 206.246.249.165 (2 Mar 2004 19:01:06 -0600) Lines: 28 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166249 On 2004-02-28, Andrew McLaren wrote: > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote in > news:if3j1c.mdl.ln@escape.shannon.net: > >> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. > < ... snip ... > > > Not bad for a first cut, but I'm outraged :-) you did not include: > > Birtwistle GM, Dahl O, Myhrhaug B and Nygaard K "Simula Begin" > Lund, Sweden, 1973; ISBN 91-44-06211-7 Well, I have now! :) Thanks. And while I am at it, I want to say thanks to all who've sent suggestions. -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his." -- General George S. Patton] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:05:48 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.246.249.165 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078275667 206.246.249.165 (2 Mar 2004 19:01:07 -0600) Lines: 30 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.tiscali.ch!newsfeed.freenet.de!38.119.100.111.MISMATCH!news-out2.spamkiller.net!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166247 On 2004-02-28, Roland Hutchinson wrote: > Minsky. Computation: Finite and Infinite Machines. Also, "The Society of Mind" by Minsky. Very interesting work. > the HAKMEM. I've always wanted to recreate HAKMEM as a porting project. In college I tried to get people into writing snippets like that, but no one was interested. > Point of order: Are we allowed to nominate journal articles and > dissertations? I don't know. I am personally more interested in books right now, and articles and papers could explode in numbers as their are so very many of them. What does everyone else think? -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- ["The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his." -- General George S. Patton] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 00:59:49 +0000 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 33 Message-ID: <1078275589.807580@saucer.planet.gong> References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1078275590 11525 80.177.7.220 (3 Mar 2004 00:59:50 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:59:50 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 Cache-Post-Path: saucer.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.69.33 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166246 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: [SNIP] > You can do very large records in text and access it fast. The key is IIRC PostgreSQL *fields* can be up to 1TB in size now :). A sick man could probably work out some mechanism by which he could put filesystems into the DB, not that I'd dream of doing something that Billy has probably already got about 10 million patents on. > external indexes. I've replaced SQL servers with flat text files > and gained tremendous speed. I suspect most of us folks who've mucked about with Relational DBs have done the same at some point. My trick was reading the results of a query into memory and doing the join locally in my code. I've seen some 10-100x speed-ups from that (yes, I did check the Query plans to make sure I wasn't doing something boneheaded in SQL first). :) > Recent generations of programmers can't seem to do any data processing > without an SQL server. I do get alarmed by folks stashing configuration into relational databases. It seems to be overkill, but I can understand *why* they do it... Saves em coding cfg file parsers or having to grok yet another API. I've certainly been tempted to do the same occasionally. :/ Cheers, Rupert ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 02 Mar 04 19:00:36 -0800 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 30 Message-ID: <1194.557T1837T11405330@kltpzyxm.invalid> References: <1078275589.807580@saucer.planet.gong> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-821.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsxfer.eecs.umich.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews1 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166298 In article <1078275589.807580@saucer.planet.gong> roo@dark-try-removing-this-boong.demon.co.uk (Rupert Pigott) writes: >Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> Recent generations of programmers can't seem to do any data >> processing without an SQL server. Too true. >I do get alarmed by folks stashing configuration into relational >databases. It seems to be overkill, but I can understand *why* >they do it... Saves em coding cfg file parsers or having to grok >yet another API. I've certainly been tempted to do the same >occasionally. :/ And then your database gets scrambled... Long ago I fell into the habit of keeping all configuration data in comma-separated ASCII text records, with the first field being a record type and the second a key (if required). I can parse that stuff in my sleep - and if the worst happens, I can fix things up with a text editor. To me, giving up that sort of flexibility is sheer madness. -- /~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 02 Mar 04 19:08:44 -0800 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 17 Message-ID: <488.557T2200T11485941@kltpzyxm.invalid> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: p-823.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsxfer.eecs.umich.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!enews1 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166297 In article shannon@news.widomaker.com (Charles Shannon Hendrix) writes: >On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: > >> Web site. > >I bet a vote here should choose telnet app... :) FTP! :-) -- /~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! ###### Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:36:32 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040303073632.2fa6d60f.steveo@eircom.net> References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> <20040227075821.4a50cad3.steveo@eircom.net> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 26 Organization: Wanadoo NNTP-Posting-Date: 03 Mar 2004 18:00:08 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0315.nas1-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1078336808 maya.euronet.nl 63139 62.234.209.61:1797 X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!195.34.132.50.MISMATCH!newsfeed01.chello.at!newsfeed.utanet.at!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!news2.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.wanadoo.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166368 On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:58:09 -0500 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: CSH> On 2004-02-27, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: CSH> > On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 CSH> > Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: CSH> > CSH> >CSH> I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to CSH> >write a CSH> program to automate a lot of the work. CSH> > CSH> > The solution to this problem is supposed to be SOAP interfaces :( CSH> CSH> Yeah, in much the same way that lethal irradiation is the solution to CSH> fever blisters. Heh, and I didn't even give the full local recipe - Oracle, JDBC, Java, Websphere and SOAP mix well and serve. Service APIs to be designed by a committee that never has to touch code. I think of it as similar to decapitation as a cure for head lice. -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:18:07 +0000 Organization: Utility Muffin Research Kitchen Lines: 27 Message-ID: References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <2k532c.9bb.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: host81-133-124-215.in-addr.btopenworld.com (81.133.124.215) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1078309329 59686533 I 81.133.124.215 ([203095]) X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail User-Agent: tin/1.7.3-20031220 ("Taransay") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.19 (i686)) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!telefonica.de!image.surnet.ru!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!host81-133-124-215.in-addr.btopenworld.COM!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166303 Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > On 2004-02-26, CBFalconer wrote: >> Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >>> >>> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >>> >>> I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy >>> to summarize what I got. >> >> You should add "Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs", Wirth. > > What about Sedgwick's Algorithms books? They've been around for awhile, > and are used by schools all over the world. > I think they're splendid utilitarian books. We have a number of ancient copies of Sedgwick on the shelves at work and those of us with Knuth tend to leave them at home ;) (There was a good MIT Press algorithms book that was better on complexity theory than Sedgwick - Cormen/Leiberson/Rivest, I think? - but it appeared after I and most of my colleagues graduated. There's a copy in the lab somewhere but I haven't seen it for a while!) pete -- pete@fenelon.com "there's no room for enigmas in built-up areas" ###### Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:40:08 +0100 From: Steve O'Hara-Smith Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Message-ID: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> References: <488.557T2200T11485941@kltpzyxm.invalid> X-Newsreader: Sylpheed version 0.9.9 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-portbld-freebsd4.9) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 21 Organization: Wanadoo NNTP-Posting-Date: 03 Mar 2004 19:07:48 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: p0030.nas1-asd6.dial.wanadoo.nl X-Trace: 1078340868 maya.euronet.nl 63120 62.234.208.30:1807 X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!dedekind.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!news2.euro.net!beastiality.euro.net!postnews1.euro.net!news.wanadoo.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166378 On 02 Mar 04 19:08:44 -0800 "Charlie Gibbs" wrote: CG> In article CG> shannon@news.widomaker.com(Charles Shannon Hendrix) writes: CG> CG> >On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: CG> > CG> >> Web site. CG> > CG> >I bet a vote here should choose telnet app... :) CG> CG> FTP! :-) Gopher! -- C:>WIN | Directable Mirrors The computer obeys and wins. |A Better Way To Focus The Sun You lose and Bill collects. | licenses available - see: | http://www.sohara.org/ ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 3 Mar 2004 19:51:42 GMT Lines: 35 Message-ID: References: <98qj1c.0lc.ln@escape.shannon.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 159-134-255-100.as1.nas.naas.eircom.net (159.134.255.100) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1078343502 59989144 I 159.134.255.100 ([132592]) User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!159-134-255-100.as1.nas.naas.eircom.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166382 On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:31:27 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > Don't worry, it will be a format anyone can use, and will be in > ascii. > > It's very possible it will be an ascii block record format like this: > > > > > > > It can be parsed with eyeballs as well as programs, and is easy to turn > into other things. > > refer and bibtex could be generated from this too. > > Honestly though... the hard work won't be the format. The hard part > is digging up information on all these books and getting complete > information on them. > > That's why I was hoping I could find an online database of books, > preferrably not Amazon or other WWW application. > Amazon seems to be increasingly suspect. There was a competition on summat in UK a while ago, about best-loved songs. People from Ireland decided to pull a stroke, and UK's favourite sone was deemed to be (based on votes), "A Nation Once Again", Irish Republican ballad. Beware of voting systems -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 3 Mar 2004 20:43:17 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 26 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol.ncf.ca X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1078346597 3247 134.117.136.48 (3 Mar 2004 20:43:17 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 3 Mar 2004 20:43:17 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.ncf.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!peer1.stngva01.us.to.verio.net!news.verio.net!nntp1.roc.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!nntp.gblx.net!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166387 Steve O'Hara-Smith (steveo@eircom.net) writes: > On 02 Mar 04 19:08:44 -0800 > "Charlie Gibbs" wrote: > > CG> In article > CG> shannon@news.widomaker.com(Charles Shannon Hendrix) writes: > CG> > CG> >On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: > CG> > > CG> >> Web site. > CG> > > CG> >I bet a vote here should choose telnet app... :) > CG> > CG> FTP! :-) > > Gopher! > Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? Up to about 2.5 years ago, when such a question came up I could point to an information server at McGill University here that used Gopher. But then one year they changed over to a web-based system as the school year started. Michael ###### From: arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 16:47:10 -0600 Organization: Not Really! Lines: 35 Message-ID: <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: tcr92.dynip.ripco.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: e250.ripco.com 1078354024 15653 209.100.226.92 (3 Mar 2004 22:47:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ripco.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:47:04 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.92/32.572 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!gail.ripco.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166407 On 3 Mar 2004 20:43:17 GMT, et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: >Steve O'Hara-Smith (steveo@eircom.net) writes: >> On 02 Mar 04 19:08:44 -0800 >> "Charlie Gibbs" wrote: >> >> CG> In article >> CG> shannon@news.widomaker.com(Charles Shannon Hendrix) writes: >> CG> >> CG> >On 2004-02-27, Hank Oredson wrote: >> CG> > >> CG> >> Web site. >> CG> > >> CG> >I bet a vote here should choose telnet app... :) >> CG> >> CG> FTP! :-) >> >> Gopher! >> >Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? gopher://gopher.quux.org/ > >Up to about 2.5 years ago, when such a question came up I could >point to an information server at McGill University here that used >Gopher. But then one year they changed over to a web-based system >as the school year started. > > Michael -- Arargh403 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address. ###### Message-ID: <404664C6.8D316690@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 12 Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:07:55 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.134.189 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1078355275 12.76.134.189 (Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:07:55 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:07:55 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news.linkpendium.com!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166409 arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: > ... snip all ... I really see no reason to quote everything and not say anything new. -- Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net) Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems. USE worldnet address! ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:28:28 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 10 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1078356551 10270 81.100.44.205 (3 Mar 2004 23:29:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:29:11 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166410 arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: > et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: >>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? > gopher://gopher.quux.org/ Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy Mandrake. Pete ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:30:53 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 10 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1078356685 10270 81.100.44.205 (3 Mar 2004 23:31:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:31:25 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!dedekind.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!130.88.203.18.MISMATCH!peernews.mcc.ac.uk!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166411 Pete Verdon wrote: > Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy > Mandrake. Ah, oops. Yes I do. Seems Galeon will still do it, though Konqueror won't. Strangely enough I believe Internet Explorer does. Still, it doesn't quite seem right with a GUI client. Pete ###### X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.147.131.211 From: Brian Inglis Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Organization: Systematic Software Reply-To: Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.ab.ca Message-ID: <0vpc409u15sjum7nkrotm3n9skk68oc22m@4ax.com> References: <403D91C6.C4EF190@yahoo.com> <0qel1c.79l.ln@escape.shannon.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 36 Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:31:34 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.71.223.147 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shaw.ca X-Trace: pd7tw2no 1078356694 24.71.223.147 (Wed, 03 Mar 2004 16:31:34 MST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 16:31:34 MST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!telefonica.de!eusc.inter.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!elnk-nf2-pas!elnk-pas-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!pd7cy1no!shaw.ca!pd7tw2no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166412 On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:44:16 -0500 in alt.folklore.computers, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >On 2004-02-26, CBFalconer wrote: >> Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >>> >>> This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >>> >>> I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy >>> to summarize what I got. >> >> You should add "Algorithms + Data Structures = Programs", Wirth. > >Actually, some people like that I just add their name to another list, >to flesh out later. > >I wish you could query book databases without using the WWW. > >I hate how everything has moved to WWW apps... makes hard to write a >program to automate a lot of the work. http://www.cs.toronto.edu/pub/mirror/bibliography links to bibliography sites, where you can download bibliographies to search locally like: ftp://ftp.math.utah.edu/pub/tex/bib/master.bib or you could google for ".bib" files and pick a few large ones from likely sites The bibliography site has references for converters, which might be useful to remove local definitions and get all references in fully expanded format. -- Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca) fake address use address above to reply ###### From: Pete Verdon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:32:47 +0000 Organization: University of Warwick, UK Lines: 10 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> Reply-To: usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom NNTP-Posting-Host: cpc1-warw1-6-0-cust205.brhm.cable.ntl.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: wisteria.csv.warwick.ac.uk 1078356798 10270 81.100.44.205 (3 Mar 2004 23:33:18 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@csv.warwick.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:33:18 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 X-No-Archive: Yes Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!takemy.news.telefonica.de!telefonica.de!news1.dtag.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-ber1.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!server1.netnews.ja.net!warwick!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166413 Pete Verdon wrote: > Pete Verdon wrote: >> Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. > Ah, oops. Yes I do. Seems Galeon will still do it, though Konqueror won't. Huh. And then Galeon crashed. Pete ###### From: arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 19:43:59 -0600 Organization: Not Really! Lines: 21 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: tcr92.dynip.ripco.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: e250.ripco.com 1078364632 26491 209.100.226.92 (4 Mar 2004 01:43:52 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ripco.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:43:52 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.92/32.572 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news.linkpendium.com!border1.nntp.sjc.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!sjc70.webusenet.com!news.usenetserver.com!cyclone.bc.net!tdsnet-transit!newspeer.tds.net!gail.ripco.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166431 On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:28:28 +0000, Pete Verdon wrote: >arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: >> et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: > >>>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? > >> gopher://gopher.quux.org/ > >Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy Mandrake. Try this: http://gopher.quux.org:70/ -- Arargh403 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address. ###### From: Rupert Pigott Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 02:00:48 +0000 Organization: Titanic Enterprises Unlimited Lines: 23 Message-ID: <1078365648.839670@saucer.planet.gong> References: <1078275589.807580@saucer.planet.gong> <1194.557T1837T11405330@kltpzyxm.invalid> NNTP-Posting-Host: darkboong.demon.co.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1078365648 25243 80.177.7.220 (4 Mar 2004 02:00:48 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:00:48 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: <1194.557T1837T11405330@kltpzyxm.invalid> X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.1 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 Cache-Post-Path: saucer.planet.gong!unknown@192.168.69.33 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166435 Charlie Gibbs wrote: [SNIP] > And then your database gets scrambled... Long ago Well, no... Because you put in permissions and other neat stuff like backups. :) > I fell into the habit of keeping all configuration data in > comma-separated ASCII text records, with the first field being > a record type and the second a key (if required). I can parse > that stuff in my sleep - and if the worst happens, I can fix > things up with a text editor. To me, giving up that sort of > flexibility is sheer madness. I still like the cheesy old IBM/MS .ini style format. Easy to parse, well known and if you provide comment functionality it can be self documenting too. :) Cheers, Rupert ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 4 Mar 2004 03:34:33 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> <404664C6.8D316690@yahoo.com> Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol.ncf.ca X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1078371273 22270 134.117.136.48 (4 Mar 2004 03:34:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 4 Mar 2004 03:34:33 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.ncf.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newspeer1.nwr.nac.net!nntp.cifnet.net!HSNX.atgi.net!news.kjsl.com!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166447 CBFalconer (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) writes: > arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: >> > ... snip all ... > > I really see no reason to quote everything and not say anything > new. > He did, he put in the URL for a working gopher. Unfortunately, he didn't snip enough, so you have to look closely. I had to look twice to see it. It sure did look at first glance that he'd posted nothing but a quoting of my message. Michael ###### From: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 4 Mar 2004 03:37:12 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> Reply-To: et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) NNTP-Posting-Host: smeagol.ncf.ca X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 1078371432 22772 134.117.136.48 (4 Mar 2004 03:37:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 4 Mar 2004 03:37:12 GMT X-Given-Sender: et472@smeagol.ncf.ca (Michael Black) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!HSNX.atgi.net!news.kjsl.com!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!et472 Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166448 Pete Verdon (usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom.invalid) writes: > arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: >> et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: > >>>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? > >> gopher://gopher.quux.org/ > > Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy Mandrake. > > Pete It doesn't have Lynx? Even Links seems to do it. So much for fancy browsers. Michael ###### From: arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:49:24 -0600 Organization: Not Really! Lines: 18 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> <404664C6.8D316690@yahoo.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: tcr92.dynip.ripco.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: e250.ripco.com 1078379356 11852 209.100.226.92 (4 Mar 2004 05:49:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ripco.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:49:16 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.92/32.572 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!zen.net.uk!dedekind.zen.co.uk!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!newsfeed.hal-mli.net!feeder1.hal-mli.net!news.mbo.net!gail.ripco.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166450 On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:07:55 GMT, CBFalconer wrote: >I really see no reason to quote everything and not say anything >new. Because of the odd quoting, I couldn't really tell which was what or who. And it was only a 25 line post. Had it been any longer, I would have taken the time to figure out who was what or whatever. -- Arargh403 at [drop the 'http://www.' from ->] http://www.arargh.com BCET Basic Compiler Page: http://www.arargh.com/basic/index.html To reply by email, remove the garbage from the reply address. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Subject: Re: AFC Book List Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> <404664C6.8D316690@yahoo.com> X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Date: Thu, 04 Mar 04 10:09:33 GMT Lines: 22 Message-ID: <40471429$0$3091$61fed72c@news.rcn.com> X-Trace: DXC=LhZkL]lGCg\BFf0:[gNSe\0R]m=BkYWIW:6bU3OT9S9ZCMXe^O7;S2[aRAVNS:^U:_4, arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: >On Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:07:55 GMT, CBFalconer >wrote: > >>I really see no reason to quote everything and not say anything >>new. > >Because of the odd quoting, I couldn't really tell which was what or >who. > >And it was only a 25 line post. Had it been any longer, I would have >taken the time to figure out who was what or whatever. If you precede your comments with a which leaves white space around your comment, it would be easier to find it. For some strange reason, my eyes don't exclusively use the prefix angle brackets to identify a change of voice in the conversation. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.147.131.211 From: Brian Inglis Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Organization: Systematic Software Reply-To: Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.ab.ca Message-ID: <4h8e40tfvc5iklc0gksurq5r06eprja982@4ax.com> References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:34:29 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.71.223.147 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shaw.ca X-Trace: pd7tw1no 1078403669 24.71.223.147 (Thu, 04 Mar 2004 05:34:29 MST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 05:34:29 MST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!dedekind.zen.co.uk!zen.net.uk!demorgan.zen.co.uk!news2.euro.net!amsnews01.chello.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!pd7cy2so!shaw.ca!pd7tw1no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166483 On 4 Mar 2004 03:37:12 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: >Pete Verdon (usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom.invalid) writes: >> arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: >>> et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: >> >>>>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? >> >>> gopher://gopher.quux.org/ >> >> Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy Mandrake. >It doesn't have Lynx? Even Links seems to do it. So much for fancy browsers. Netscape still supports it so far as of 6.2 -- Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca) fake address use address above to reply ###### X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.147.131.211 From: Brian Inglis Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Organization: Systematic Software Reply-To: Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.ab.ca Message-ID: References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 36 Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:12:42 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.71.223.147 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shaw.ca X-Trace: pd7tw2no 1078405962 24.71.223.147 (Thu, 04 Mar 2004 06:12:42 MST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 06:12:42 MST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!pd7cy1no!shaw.ca!pd7tw2no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166497 On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:05:48 -0500 in alt.folklore.computers, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >On 2004-02-28, Roland Hutchinson wrote: > >> Minsky. Computation: Finite and Infinite Machines. > >Also, "The Society of Mind" by Minsky. Very interesting work. > >> the HAKMEM. > >I've always wanted to recreate HAKMEM as a porting project. In college >I tried to get people into writing snippets like that, but no one was >interested. Web paged at: http://home.pipeline.com/~hbaker1/hakmem/hakmem.html >> Point of order: Are we allowed to nominate journal articles and >> dissertations? > >I don't know. I am personally more interested in books right now, and >articles and papers could explode in numbers as their are so very many >of them. > >What does everyone else think? Maybe significant historical stuff like "GOTO Considered Harmful" or URLs for corpuses like AI Memos, EWD, AMT, Atlas, Mark I, inwap, spies, TUHS, Hamster, ... but maybe that should be a separate list! -- Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca) fake address use address above to reply ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: Charles Shannon Hendrix Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <488.557T2200T11485941@kltpzyxm.invalid> <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> Reply-To: cshSPAM@SPAM.widomaker.com User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:00:30 -0500 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.96.179.89 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 1078426868 209.96.179.89 (4 Mar 2004 13:01:08 -0600) Lines: 23 X-Comments: This message was posted through Visit Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 100,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!feeder2.ecngs.de!217.73.144.44.MISMATCH!ecngs!feeder.ecngs.de!38.119.100.149.MISMATCH!news-out2.nntp.be!local!corp.newsgroups.com!escape.shannon.net!nobody Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166546 On 2004-03-03, Steve O'Hara-Smith wrote: > Gopher! http://27.org/gopher-manifesto/ I remember I used to be able to find information a lot faster *before* the WWW in some cases. There is so much noise now. The people who pollute the meta tags should be killed over and over... -- shannon "AT" widomaker.com -- [governorrhea: a contagious disease that spreads from the governor of a state downward through other offices and his corporate sponsors] -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: "Gary A. Gorgen" Organization: Tunxis Design Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 18 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.7.126.247 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-Trace: attbi_s03 1078426858 24.7.126.247 (Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:00:58 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:00:58 GMT Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:00:58 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!zeus.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!green.octanews.net!news-out.octanews.net!news.glorb.com!wn51feed!worldnet.att.net!attbi_s03.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166545 Also, if you don't have it yet. Standardized Development of Computer Software Robert C. Tausworthe Prentice-Hall, 1977 ISBN: 0-13-842195-1 Standardized Development of Computer Software Part II Standards Robert C. Tausworthe Prentice-Hall, 1977 ISBN: 0-13-842203-6 -- Gary A. Gorgen | "From ideas to PRODUCTS" tunxis@comcast.net | Tunxis Design Inc. | Cupertino, Ca. 95014 ###### From: Roland Hutchinson Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 17:59:59 -0500 Lines: 26 Message-ID: References: <5i1q1c.4h13.ln@via.reistad.priv.no> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool-68-160-125-2.nwrk.east.verizon.net (68.160.125.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1078441200 61961360 I 68.160.125.2 ([99522]) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool-68-160-125-2.nwrk.east.verizon.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166584 In article on Thursday 04 March 2004 08:12, Brian Inglis wrote: > Web paged at: > http://home.pipeline.com/~hbaker1/hakmem/hakmem.html Very cool -- human and machine readable version! The far more flavorful (but not grepable [ObStylebookQuery: How many P's in "greppable"?]) scanned original is also available, in the AI Lab's own publications archive at: http://www.ai.mit.edu/research/publications/publications Typing in "hakmem" on that page produces the following URLs for the HAKMEM in your choice of PostScript or PDF: ftp://publications.ai.mit.edu/ai-publications/0-499/AIM-239.ps ftp://publications.ai.mit.edu/ai-publications/pdf/AIM-239.pdf -- Roland Hutchinson Will play viola da gamba for food. NB mail to my.spamtrap [at] verizon.net is heavily filtered to remove spam. If your message looks like spam I may not see it. ###### From: Giles Todd Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:42:03 +0100 Reply-To: g@todd.nu Message-ID: Cancel-Lock: sha1:rcaYTnF74UzLBAGkWZEZln1uIVg= References: <1078275589.807580@saucer.planet.gong> <1194.557T1837T11405330@kltpzyxm.invalid> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-NFilter: 1.2.1-b1 Lines: 21 NNTP-Posting-Date: 05 Mar 2004 05:50:00 CET NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.127.198.242 X-Trace: 1078462200 news.xs4all.nl 564 [::ffff:80.127.198.242]:54371 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!newsgate.cistron.nl!transit.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166608 On 02 Mar 04 19:00:36 -0800, "Charlie Gibbs" wrote: > And then your database gets scrambled... Long ago > I fell into the habit of keeping all configuration data in > comma-separated ASCII text records, with the first field being > a record type and the second a key (if required). I can parse > that stuff in my sleep - and if the worst happens, I can fix > things up with a text editor. To me, giving up that sort of > flexibility is sheer madness. The first thing one must do before relying on any database which requires a repair tool more sophisticated than a standard text editor is to write such a repair tool before committing any data. Otherwise, stick to databases maintainable by means of a text editor. Abstract databases aren't necessarily bad. You just need to make sure that you can deal with them when they go wrong. CSV text backups are indeed one way to approach that problem. Giles. ###### From: ignatios@fourier.cs.uni-bonn.de (Ignatios Souvatzis) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 5 Mar 2004 16:35:45 GMT Organization: HRZ - University of Bonn (Germany) Lines: 6 Approved: cute little animals Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> <4h8e40tfvc5iklc0gksurq5r06eprja982@4ax.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: fourier.cs.uni-bonn.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: f1node01.rhrz.uni-bonn.de 1078504545 31488 131.220.4.177 (5 Mar 2004 16:35:45 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.uni-bonn.de NNTP-Posting-Date: 5 Mar 2004 16:35:45 GMT X-Newsreader: knews 1.0b.1 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!news.uni-bonn.de!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166682 Brian Inglis writes: [about gopher] > Netscape still supports it so far as of 6.2 And 7.0. -is ###### From: Giles Todd Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 23:26:45 +0100 Reply-To: g@todd.nu Message-ID: <2jvh40l7gse6m3bce3m6t10vsaoduanrst@4ax.com> Cancel-Lock: sha1:DJzjGuC/SWzoTEN2MmfO/TUX8c8= References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> <93oc409ol8674rhpl8eqq01hg16h084j24@4ax.com> <4h8e40tfvc5iklc0gksurq5r06eprja982@4ax.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-NFilter: 1.2.1-b1 Lines: 23 NNTP-Posting-Date: 05 Mar 2004 23:30:00 CET NNTP-Posting-Host: 80.127.198.242 X-Trace: 1078525800 news.xs4all.nl 568 [::ffff:80.127.198.242]:56471 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xs4all.nl Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!eusc.inter.net!newsfeed.freenet.de!news2.euro.net!news2.euro.net!transit.news.xs4all.nl!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166729 On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:34:29 GMT, Brian Inglis wrote: > On 4 Mar 2004 03:37:12 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, > et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: > > >Pete Verdon (usenet@verdonet.organisation.unitedkingdom.invalid) writes: > >> arargh403NOSPAM@NOW.AT.arargh.com wrote: > >>> et472@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Michael Black) wrote: > >> > >>>>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? > >> > >>> gopher://gopher.quux.org/ > >> > >> Hmmph. I don't seem to have anything that can do gopherspace. Poxy Mandrake. > > >It doesn't have Lynx? Even Links seems to do it. So much for fancy browsers. > > Netscape still supports it so far as of 6.2 Mozilla Firefox 0.8 works just fine with the gopher URL. Giles. ###### From: Simon Lyall Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 6 Mar 2004 04:00:49 GMT Organization: Darkmere Private Access Internet, Auckland, NZ. Lines: 10 Message-ID: References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: green.darkmere.gen.nz X-Trace: red.darkmere.gen.nz 1078545649 844 203.109.158.194 (6 Mar 2004 04:00:49 GMT) User-Agent: tin/1.5.12-20020311 ("Toxicity") (UNIX) (Linux/2.4.21usb1 (i586)) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!news.linkpendium.com!newsfeeds.ihug.co.nz!ihug.co.nz!news.darkmere.gen.nz!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166764 Michael Black wrote: >Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? Okay, can anybody point to a FSP server still in use? -- Simon J. Lyall | Very Busy | Web: http://www.darkmere.gen.nz/ "Inside me Im Screaming, Nobody pays any attention." | eMT. Important. Anti-spam measures in use. Spammers, please add "nospam" to address. ###### X-Trace-PostClient-IP: 68.147.131.211 From: Brian Inglis Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Organization: Systematic Software Reply-To: Brian.Inglis@SystematicSw.ab.ca Message-ID: <1ppi40pj4bosfkvjoo374mfr6bb7jun62a@4ax.com> References: <20040303194008.4c372ede.steveo@eircom.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 15 Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 05:52:48 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.71.223.147 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shaw.ca X-Trace: pd7tw2no 1078552368 24.71.223.147 (Fri, 05 Mar 2004 22:52:48 MST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 22:52:48 MST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!feed5.newsreader.com!newsreader.com!news3.optonline.net!pd7cy1no!shaw.ca!pd7tw2no.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:166776 On 6 Mar 2004 04:00:49 GMT in alt.folklore.computers, Simon Lyall wrote: >Michael Black wrote: >>Can anyone point to a Gopher server still in use? > >Okay, can anybody point to a FSP server still in use? fsp.os.us.eu.org:21 -- Thanks. Take care, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada Brian.Inglis@CSi.com (Brian dot Inglis at SystematicSw dot ab dot ca) fake address use address above to reply ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Organization: W.J.Vermillion - Orlando / Winter Park Message-ID: References: Lines: 33 Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:05:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.40.24.38 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net 1079381101 65.40.24.38 (Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:05:01 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:05:01 PST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!5c1e743a!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168058 In article , Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >This is a raw dump of the AFC book list I've been compiling. >I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy >to summarize what I got. Let me add: >Computer Lib / Dream Machines, Ted Nelson I also have Ten Nelson's "Literary Machines" - the one where he coins the word 'hypertext' - and his vision is far beyond what we have to to see. In his "Home Computer Revolution" when asked about predictions he commented on how foolish it was, and then made one prediction about how many installed computers there would be NN years in the future. His prediction was the most accurate of any I've Red. I have all three of those Nelson books. I just checked the typical used book sources and my original Computer Lib / Dream Machines, and the Microsoft Press small sized reprint are a bit ratty, if they were like new they would sell for $250. I could find no listing of Literary Machines for sale - just a 'books in print' showing it is in print, but none of the 50,000 book stores in the list has it. I think Literary Machines should be part of the list. Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Organization: W.J.Vermillion - Orlando / Winter Park Message-ID: References: Lines: 37 Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:25:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.40.24.38 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net 1079382301 65.40.24.38 (Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:25:01 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:25:01 PST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!5c1e743a!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168064 In article , wrote: >On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:31:27 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> Don't worry, it will be a format anyone can use, and will be in >> ascii. >> >> It's very possible it will be an ascii block record format like this: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> It can be parsed with eyeballs as well as programs, and is easy to turn >> into other things. >> >> refer and bibtex could be generated from this too. >> >> Honestly though... the hard work won't be the format. The hard part >> is digging up information on all these books and getting complete >> information on them. >> That's why I was hoping I could find an online database of books, >> preferrably not Amazon or other WWW application. >Amazon seems to be increasingly suspect. I only use Amazon for some recent things. I use ABEBooks and Bookfinder to do some interesting searches to see what is out there. I've recently picked up a 1940 paperback and a 1936 hardbound of things I thought I'd never see again using those resources. Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Organization: W.J.Vermillion - Orlando / Winter Park Message-ID: References: Lines: 56 Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 20:45:07 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.40.24.38 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net 1079383507 65.40.24.38 (Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:45:07 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:45:07 PST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!5c1e743a!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168066 In article , Leif Harcke wrote: >On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:18:42 -0800, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> I didn't get any new submissions for awhile, so I'm posting a copy to >> summarize what I got. >I think this was mentioned previously: >_The Computer from Pascal to von Neumann_, by Herman H. Goldstine >Princeton University Press, 1973, 1980 (reprint). > >Back cover blurb: > > "In 1942, Lt. Herman H. Goldstine, a former mathematics >professor, was stationed at the Moore School of Electrical >Engineering at the University of Pennsylvania. It was there that >he assisted in the creation of the ENIAC, the first electronic >digital computer. The ENIAC was operational in 1945, but plans >for a new computer were already underway. The principal source >of ideas for the new computer was John von Neumann, who became >Goldstine's chief collaborator. Together they developed EDVAC, >successor to ENIAC. After World War II, at the Institute for >Advanced Study, they built what was to become the prototype >of the present-day computer. Herman Goldstine writes as both >historian and scientist in this first examination of the >development of computing machinery, from the seventeenth century >through the early 1950s. His personal involvement lends a special >authenticity to his narrative, as he sprinkles anecdotes and >stories liberally through his text." I have that one, but it brings to mind another book I have that I found fascintating is from the Babbage Institute History of Computing series. "The Moore School Lectures - Theory and Techniques for Design of Electronic Digital Computers" It's an edited publication of the lectures given at Moore in 1946 - ostensibly the first class ever taught on electronic computers. Lecturers included Aiken, Mauchly, Ecketer and von Neumann. The invited class of 28 students also include Claude Shannon. It was designed to familiarize those familiar with the mechanical coputers with the new electronics [tube] computers capabale of performing 5000 operations per second, a hundred fold increase over the relay machines. There are diagrams showing how cathode ray tubes were used for storage and multiple tube shift registers. Compared to modern machines it's akin to the Wright brothers and their first effors compared to the newest flying machines we have today. Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Organization: W.J.Vermillion - Orlando / Winter Park Message-ID: References: Lines: 29 Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:45:06 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.40.24.38 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net 1079387106 65.40.24.38 (Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:45:06 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:45:06 PST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newshosting.com!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!5c1e743a!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168086 In article , wrote: >On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:59 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: >> I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored >> and properly filled out. >> >> It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database >> on a CD or something to search through. >> >> Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. >> > >The thing about THE list is that its real hardcore stuff. All good. A > big publication would have to include a lot of dross. What I was > thinking of is some way of indicating to a newbie a list of books > that are authoritive, not necessarily new or even up-to-date, but > worth while consulting. Knuths books, for instance. >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ###### Message-ID: <40565074.DCFDC9FB@comcast.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@nospam.plano.net Organization: Canine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 32 NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.1.126.198 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-Trace: attbi_s01 1079391678 24.1.126.198 (Mon, 15 Mar 2004 23:01:18 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 23:01:18 GMT Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 23:01:18 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!news2.euro.net!in.100proofnews.com!in.100proofnews.com!cycny01.gnilink.net!cyclone1.gnilink.net!wn52feed!worldnet.att.net!attbi_s01.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168098 Bill Vermillion wrote: > > In article , > wrote: > >On Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:29:59 -0500, Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: > >> I don't mind hosting the list on a website though, once I get it stored > >> and properly filled out. > >> > >> It would be nice if I could get some huge publication database > >> on a CD or something to search through. > >> > >> Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. > >> > > > >The thing about THE list is that its real hardcore stuff. All good. A > > big publication would have to include a lot of dross. What I was > > thinking of is some way of indicating to a newbie a list of books > > that are authoritive, not necessarily new or even up-to-date, but > > worth while consulting. Knuths books, for instance. > > >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). > > Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 > > Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) > This really should be _Screw Yourself with C++ in 24 Hours_... ;-) -- +----------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | +----------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: Frank McConnell Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:34:26 -0800 Organization: File under Psychedelia Lines: 15 Message-ID: References: <40565074.DCFDC9FB@comcast.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: daemonweed.reanimators.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: daemonweed.reanimators.org 1079393666 16584 192.168.1.2 (15 Mar 2004 23:34:26 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@reanimators.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 15 Mar 2004 23:34:26 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!solnet.ch!solnet.ch!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!zonnet-feed!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.sjc.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone-sf.pbi.net!216.218.192.242!news.he.net!news.kjsl.com!news.reanimators.org!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168108 Charles Richmond wrote: > Bill Vermillion wrote: >> wrote: >> >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). >> >> Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 >> >> Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) >> > This really should be _Screw Yourself with C++ in 24 Hours_... ;-) This makes me think of "Enough Rope to Shoot Yourself in the Foot" by Allen Holub. -Frank McConnell ###### From: J Ahlstrom Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 16:31:38 -0800 Organization: Cisco Systems Inc. Message-ID: <40564AEA.2090808@cisco.com> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cache-Post-Path: sj-nntpcache-3!unknown@dhcp-171-71-47-32.cisco.com X-Cache: nntpcache 2.4.0b2 (see http://www.nntpcache.org/) X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 40 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!snoopy.risq.qc.ca!cyclone.bc.net!sjc70.webusenet.com!news.usenetserver.com!sn-xit-02!sn-xit-06!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168111 Davidow, William; "Marketing High Techology"; Hellerman, Herbert; "Digital Computer System Principles"; 1967; McGraw-Hill. Iverson, K E; "A Programming Language"; 1962; John Wiley & Sons. Lorin, Harold; "Parallelism in Hardware and Software: Real and Apparent Concurrency"; 1972; Prentice-Hall. McCracken, Daniel; "A Guide to Algol Programming"; 1967; John Wiley & Sons Madnick, Stuart E and John J Donovan; "Operating Systems"; 1974; McGraw-Hill Morse, Stephen; "The 8086 Primer: An Introduction to Its Architecture, System Desigh, and Programming"; 1980; Hayden Organick, Elliot; "A Computer Primer for the MAD Language"; 1961; Cushing-Mallow, Ann Arbor, MI. "Computer Science Organization. The B5700/B6700 Series"; 1973; Academic Press Richards, R K; "Arithmetic Operations in Digital Computers"; 1955; D Van Nostrand Company. > > > > -- The penalty that good people pay for not being interested in politics is to be governed by people worse than themselves. -Plato ###### Message-ID: <40566B2D.1CF36D7B@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 20 Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:01:09 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.76.141.206 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1079409669 12.76.141.206 (Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:01:09 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:01:09 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news.glorb.com!wn12feed!worldnet.att.net!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168136 Bill Vermillion wrote: > ... snip ... > > There are diagrams showing how cathode ray tubes were used for > storage and multiple tube shift registers. Compared to modern > machines it's akin to the Wright brothers and their first effors > compared to the newest flying machines we have today. Once upon a time I had some Atomic Energy of Canada publications that included a reprint of a lecture by Williams at Chalk River about the Manchester computer (I think). This also included Williams tubes and shift registers, etc. Circa 1950, in a green cover. I haven't seen it for 30 years or more. -- Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net) Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems. USE worldnet address! ###### Message-ID: <4056C5EB.953C4ABB@comcast.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@nospam.plano.net Organization: Canine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <40566B2D.1CF36D7B@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 30 NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.1.126.198 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-Trace: attbi_s52 1079421748 24.1.126.198 (Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:22:28 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:22:28 GMT Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:22:28 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news.glorb.com!wn51feed!worldnet.att.net!attbi_s52.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168142 CBFalconer wrote: > > Bill Vermillion wrote: > > > ... snip ... > > > > There are diagrams showing how cathode ray tubes were used for > > storage and multiple tube shift registers. Compared to modern > > machines it's akin to the Wright brothers and their first effors > > compared to the newest flying machines we have today. > > Once upon a time I had some Atomic Energy of Canada publications > that included a reprint of a lecture by Williams at Chalk River > about the Manchester computer (I think). This also included > Williams tubes and shift registers, etc. Circa 1950, in a green > cover. I haven't seen it for 30 years or more. > All I could Google up on the web for this was: D5 "High Speed Universal Digital Computers". Two lectures delivered at Chalk River, Ontario (National Research Council of Canada, Atomic Energy Project, Research Division, 1949). If this can help anyone find the text of the paper, that will be great... -- +----------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | +----------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### Message-ID: <4056C630.E13F224B@comcast.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@nospam.plano.net Organization: Canine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List References: <40565074.DCFDC9FB@comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.1.126.198 X-Complaints-To: abuse@comcast.net X-Trace: attbi_s52 1079421817 24.1.126.198 (Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:23:37 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:23:37 GMT Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:23:37 GMT Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.ip-plus.net!newsfeed.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!feed.news.tiscali.de!tiscali!newsfeed1.ip.tiscali.net!216.196.98.140.MISMATCH!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news.glorb.com!wn51feed!worldnet.att.net!attbi_s52.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168143 Frank McConnell wrote: > > Charles Richmond wrote: > > Bill Vermillion wrote: > >> wrote: > >> >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). > >> > >> Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 > >> > >> Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) > >> > > This really should be _Screw Yourself with C++ in 24 Hours_... ;-) > > This makes me think of "Enough Rope to Shoot Yourself in the Foot" by > Allen Holub. > "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing..." -- +----------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | +----------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: Roland Hutchinson Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:04:29 -0500 Lines: 33 Message-ID: References: <40565074.DCFDC9FB@comcast.net> <4056C630.E13F224B@comcast.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool-151-198-156-191.nwrk.east.verizon.net (151.198.156.191) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1079445871 72305049 I 151.198.156.191 ([99522]) User-Agent: KNode/0.7.2 Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool-151-198-156-191.nwrk.east.verizon.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168171 In article <4056C630.E13F224B@comcast.net> on Tuesday 16 March 2004 02:23, Charles Richmond wrote: > Frank McConnell wrote: >> >> Charles Richmond wrote: >> > Bill Vermillion wrote: >> >> wrote: >> >> >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). >> >> >> >> Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 >> >> >> >> Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) >> >> >> > This really should be _Screw Yourself with C++ in 24 Hours_... ;-) >> >> This makes me think of "Enough Rope to Shoot Yourself in the Foot" by >> Allen Holub. >> > "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing..." ObPedantry: not knowldege, learning. > -- > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ > | Charles and Francis Richmond richmond at plano dot net | > +----------------------------------------------------------------+ -- Roland Hutchinson Will play viola da gamba for food. NB mail to my.spamtrap [at] verizon.net is heavily filtered to remove spam. If your message looks like spam I may not see it. ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 19:14:59 +0000 (GMT) Organization: Dragonhill Systems Lines: 20 Message-ID: <20040316.1914.55816snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <40564AEA.2090808@cisco.com> X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 1079467648 21310 158.152.92.150 (16 Mar 2004 20:07:28 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Newsreader: SNews 1.31+mods(jlw030122/386) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!kibo.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!dsl.co.uk!bhk Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168220 On Monday, in article <40564AEA.2090808@cisco.com> jahlstro@cisco.com "J Ahlstrom" wrote: > McCracken, Daniel; "A Guide to Algol Programming"; > 1967; John Wiley & Sons I see, we're including bad exemplars as well as good, are we? (I don't actually know this book.) I used to think that McCracken's FORTRAN book(s) were abyssmal; I hate to think what sort of horrible hash he made of Algol. (From the date, one assumes this was Algol60; what's wrong with Dijkstra? Oh, and Randall & Russell as well: programmers ought to understand what's "under the bonnet" too.) -- fix (vb.): 1. to paper over, obscure, hide from public view; 2. to work around, in a way that produces unintended consequences that are worse than the original problem. Usage: "Windows ME fixes many of the shortcomings of Windows 98 SE". ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: bv@wjv.comREMOVE (Bill Vermillion) Subject: Re: AFC Book List Reply-To: bv@wjv.com Organization: W.J.Vermillion - Orlando / Winter Park Message-ID: References: <40565074.DCFDC9FB@comcast.net> <4056C630.E13F224B@comcast.net> Lines: 27 Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:45:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.40.24.38 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net 1079495101 65.40.24.38 (Tue, 16 Mar 2004 19:45:01 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 19:45:01 PST Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!irazu.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.belwue.de!newsfeed.arcor-online.net!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!news.cambrium.nl!news.cambrium.nl!border1.nntp.ash.giganews.com!border2.nntp.ash.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!5c1e743a!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168249 In article <4056C630.E13F224B@comcast.net>, Charles Richmond wrote: >Frank McConnell wrote: >> >> Charles Richmond wrote: >> > Bill Vermillion wrote: >> >> wrote: >> >> >NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). >> >> >> >> Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 >> >> >> >> Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) >> >> >> > This really should be _Screw Yourself with C++ in 24 Hours_... ;-) >> >> This makes me think of "Enough Rope to Shoot Yourself in the Foot" by >> Allen Holub. >"A little knowledge is a dangerous thing..." And as a friend of mine is fond of saying "and anything less can kill you". Bill -- Bill Vermillion - bv @ wjv . com ###### From: greymaus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: AFC Book List Date: 17 Mar 2004 09:43:51 GMT Lines: 23 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: 159-134-255-225.as1.nas.naas.eircom.net (159.134.255.225) X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de 1079516631 70520795 I 159.134.255.225 ([132592]) User-Agent: slrn/0.9.8.0 (Linux) Path: redlance.franklin.ch!pfaff2.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!switch.ch!news.imp.ch!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!159-134-255-225.as1.nas.naas.eircom.NET!not-for-mail Xref: redlance.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:168259 On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:45:06 GMT, Bill Vermillion wrote: >>> >>> Either that, or an online method that wasn't slow as molasses. >>> >> >>The thing about THE list is that its real hardcore stuff. All good. A >> big publication would have to include a lot of dross. What I was >> thinking of is some way of indicating to a newbie a list of books >> that are authoritive, not necessarily new or even up-to-date, but >> worth while consulting. Knuths books, for instance. > >>NOT "Learn C++ in 24 hours" (imaginary title). > > Teach Yourself C++ in 24 Hours - Jesse Liberty - ISBN 0672322242 > > Is 'Teach Yourself' close enough to "Learn" :-) Thats why publishers are so carefull about names -- greymaus Al Firan RumaiDin 97.025% of statistics are wrong