From: Andrew Stribblehill Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 12 Jul 2001 12:46:39 +0100 Organization: University of Durham, Durham, UK Lines: 23 Sender: ads@womble.dur.ac.uk Message-ID: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: womble.dur.ac.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: sirius.dur.ac.uk 994938399 27344 129.234.2.142 (12 Jul 2001 11:46:39 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@durham.ac.uk NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 11:46:39 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.0.103 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!grolier!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!easynet-monga!easynet.net!server5.netnews.ja.net!nntphost.dur.ac.uk!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85143 I can't think of a better newsgroup to ask than this, so here goes... On the slide part of my slide-rule there's a line with four scales on it. In left-right order, they go: ISd, ITd, Td, Sd. The bizarre thing is that the first two share a zero at something which is marked on the C scale with a 'V'. It seems to be pi/180, and the other two share a zero at 'U', 180/pi. Since this description is woefully incomplete, I have scanned the rule, and put it at http://www.dur.ac.uk/a.d.stribblehill/sliderule.jpg. It's 166 Kb. Has anyone any idea what these four scales do, and how I might use them? Furthermore, does anyone know what the 'S', 'L' and 'm' constants on the C scale are for? -- Andrew Stribblehill Systems programmer, IT Service, University of Durham, England ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 17:27:04 GMT Organization: Dragonhill Systems Ltd Message-ID: <994958824snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> X-Trace: mail2news.demon.co.uk 994963949 mail2news:17639 mail2news mail2news.demon.co.uk X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Mail2News-Path: news.demon.net!dsl.demon.co.uk X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.31 Lines: 45 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.online.be!62.232.80.34.MISMATCH!newspeer.highwayone.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85189 In article <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> dgreen@iinet.net.au "David Green" writes: > It looks as though you have a Thornton PIC rule there. > > The scales are "Trignometrical Differential Scales": > SD is Direct Sine Differential Scale > TD is Direct Tangent Differential Scale > ISD is Inverse Sine Differential Scale > ITD is Inverse Tangent Differential Scale > > V is indeed pi/180 > U, m and s are angle conversion constants and when used as divisors: > U is 180/pi = degrees to radians > m is 180*60/pi = minutes to radians > s is 180*60*60/pi = seconds to radians And THAT (apart from the top-posting) is what makes this particular froup so /wonderful/ (Before seeing your response, I was about to go and dig out my two rules, which I unearthed the other day from a storage trunk about which I had forgotten. One was a Faber-Castell[1], bought in 1961, with a 20in scale on a 10in rule: that one still has its very comprehensive manual, and lots of extra marks on both slides and cursor, so I was wondering if there was anything similar to the question posed. The other[2] was my grandfather's, which he'd used at Woolwich Technical College before the end of the C19th.) [1] Couldn't resist getting it out: it's a "Novo-Duplex No. 2/83". It must be the 1970s since I last used it, but I've discovered that it's like riding a bike! [2] A much simpler device, in wood with ivory(?) facings on which the scales are engraved. Whereas the Faber-Castell has four scales on each side of the slide, and eight more on the fixed parts on either side, this has only three on the slide, and two on the body. On the reverse is a strip of lacquered paper let into a chase within the wood, with a printed table of sines and tans to four decimals. Manufactured by Jackson Bros of Armley, Leeds. -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "We have gone from a world of concentrated knowledge and wisdom to one of distributed ignorance. And we know and understand less while being incr- easingly capable." Prof. Peter Cochrane, formerly of BT Labs ###### Message-ID: <3b4e1d7b_4@corp.newsgroups.com> From: Don Taylor Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> <994958824snz@dsl.co.uk> User-Agent: tin/1.5.8-20010221 ("Blue Water") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.58.8.1 Date: 12 Jul 2001 16:58:20 -0500 X-Trace: corp.newsgroups.com 994975100 206.58.8.1 (12 Jul 2001 16:58:20 -0500) Lines: 22 X-Comments: This message was posted through Newsfeeds.com X-Comments2: IMPORTANT: Newsfeeds.com does not condone, nor support, spam or any illegal or copyrighted postings. X-Comments3: IMPORTANT: Under NO circumstances will postings containing illegal or copyrighted material through this service be tolerated!! X-Report: Please report illegal or inappropriate use to X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers, INCLUDING the body (DO NOT SEND ATTACHMENTS) Organization: Newsfeeds.com http://www.newsfeeds.com 80,000+ UNCENSORED Newsgroups. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!local-out2.newsfeeds.com!corp.newsgroups.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85206 If anyone has a description of the scales used on a slide rule that was primarily oriented towards handling statistical calculations I would really appreciate some details. Years ago someone said he had a slide rule for statistics work, with no manual or instructions, and I fooled around and let that go by. But I would like to find such a rule or enough of a description to be able to craft one up. With some scribbling I think I have a plan to deal with factorials but there must be lots of other creative work that was put into these by folks who were much brighter than I will ever be. Thanks Some dumb kids stole my Otis King decades ago, I'm sure that they didn't even appreciate what it was that they had in their hands. Oh well. -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- ###### From: dgreen@iinet.net.au (David Green) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 01:34:26 GMT Message-ID: <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.5/32.452 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 41 NNTP-Posting-Host: i205-226.nv.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 994944449 21708 203.59.205.226 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news0.de.colt.net!newscore.gigabell.net!bignews.mediaways.net!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85154 Andrew It looks as though you have a Thornton PIC rule there. The scales are "Trignometrical Differential Scales": SD is Direct Sine Differential Scale TD is Direct Tangent Differential Scale ISD is Inverse Sine Differential Scale ITD is Inverse Tangent Differential Scale V is indeed pi/180 U, m and s are angle conversion constants and when used as divisors: U is 180/pi = degrees to radians m is 180*60/pi = minutes to radians s is 180*60*60/pi = seconds to radians David Green On 12 Jul 2001 12:46:39 +0100, Andrew Stribblehill wrote: > >I can't think of a better newsgroup to ask than this, so here goes... > >On the slide part of my slide-rule there's a line with four scales >on it. In left-right order, they go: ISd, ITd, Td, Sd. > >The bizarre thing is that the first two share a zero at something >which is marked on the C scale with a 'V'. It seems to be pi/180, and >the other two share a zero at 'U', 180/pi. > >Since this description is woefully incomplete, I have scanned the >rule, and put it at >http://www.dur.ac.uk/a.d.stribblehill/sliderule.jpg. It's 166 Kb. > >Has anyone any idea what these four scales do, and how I might use >them? > >Furthermore, does anyone know what the 'S', 'L' and 'm' constants on >the C scale are for? ###### Message-ID: <3B4ECCD2.98CB454D@home.com> From: John Ahlstrom Organization: @Home Network X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.73 [en]C-AtHome0407 (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> <994958824snz@dsl.co.uk> <3b4e1d7b_4@corp.newsgroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 4 Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 10:25:43 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.250.140.20 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news1.rdc1.sfba.home.com 995019943 24.250.140.20 (Fri, 13 Jul 2001 03:25:43 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 03:25:43 PDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news1.rdc1.sfba.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85235 There is a yahoo list for sliderules that might be a good resource: sliderules@yahoogroups.com ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: john Latala Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules In-Reply-To: <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> Message-ID: References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Lines: 17 Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:58:46 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.166.210.115 X-Complaints-To: abuse@golden.net X-Trace: radon.golden.net 995075928 199.166.210.115 (Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:58:48 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:58:48 EDT Organization: Golden Triangle On Line Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed1.cidera.com!radon.golden.net!shell.golden.net!jrlatala Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85236 On Fri, 13 Jul 2001, David Green wrote: > It looks as though you have a Thornton PIC rule there. > > The scales are "Trignometrical Differential Scales": > SD is Direct Sine Differential Scale > TD is Direct Tangent Differential Scale > ISD is Inverse Sine Differential Scale > ITD is Inverse Tangent Differential Scale What's the difference between a "Trigonometrical Differential Scale" and your plain old "Trigonometrical Scale"? -- john R. Latala jrlatala@golden.net ###### From: "Andrew McLaren" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> <994958824snz@dsl.co.uk> Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Lines: 16 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 12:01:02 +1000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.54.218.188 X-Trace: newsfeeds.bigpond.com 995074952 203.54.218.188 (Sat, 14 Jul 2001 11:42:32 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 11:42:32 EST Organization: Telstra BigPond Internet Services (http://www.bigpond.com) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-mue1.dfn.de!news-nue1.dfn.de!uni-erlangen.de!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!news.tele.dk!203.50.2.79!intgwlon.nntp.telstra.net!intgwpad.nntp.telstra.net!newsfeeds.bigpond.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85266 "Brian {Hamilton Kelly}" wrote > And THAT (apart from the top-posting) is what makes this particular froup > so /wonderful/ I agree - but I *do* resent this present learned assembly being called a "froup". Cheers ;-) Andrew (owner, "Hemi" brand slide rule ... Japanese, rather mass-produced, c. early 1970s). ###### From: ab528@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 14 Jul 2001 02:27:38 GMT Organization: The National Capital FreeNet Lines: 8 Message-ID: <9ioamq$joo$1@freenet9.carleton.ca> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> Reply-To: ab528@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) NNTP-Posting-Host: freenet10 X-Trace: freenet9.carleton.ca 995077658 20248 134.117.136.30 (14 Jul 2001 02:27:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: complaints@ncf.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 14 Jul 2001 02:27:38 GMT X-Given-Sender: ab528@freenet10.carleton.ca (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!out.nntp.be!propagator-dallas!news-in-dallas.newsfeeds.com!in.nntp.be!news.kjsl.com!xcski.com!freenet-news!FreeNet.Carleton.CA!ab528 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85258 john Latala (jrlatala@golden.net) writes: > > What's the difference between a "Trigonometrical Differential Scale" and > your plain old "Trigonometrical Scale"? Sines become cosines, cosines become sines, and they all march together in the Gay Pride parade. Tangents bugger off to infinity, and logarithms of all bases tend to go off scale. Secants and their co-'s don't show up. ###### Message-ID: <3B4FD224.8C969B4F@ev1.net> Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:01:24 -0700 From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@ev1.net Organization: Cannine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: c1656384-a.plano1.tx.home.com X-Trace: newsa.ev1.net 995079721 c1656384-a.plano1.tx.home.com (13 Jul 2001 22:02:01 -0500) Lines: 30 X-Authenticated-User: richmond Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!surfnet.nl!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed1.cidera.com!newsa.ev1.net Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85282 Andrew Stribblehill wrote: > > I can't think of a better newsgroup to ask than this, so here goes... > > On the slide part of my slide-rule there's a line with four scales > on it. In left-right order, they go: ISd, ITd, Td, Sd. > > The bizarre thing is that the first two share a zero at something > which is marked on the C scale with a 'V'. It seems to be pi/180, and > the other two share a zero at 'U', 180/pi. > > Since this description is woefully incomplete, I have scanned the > rule, and put it at > http://www.dur.ac.uk/a.d.stribblehill/sliderule.jpg. It's 166 Kb. > > Has anyone any idea what these four scales do, and how I might use > them? > > Furthermore, does anyone know what the 'S', 'L' and 'm' constants on > the C scale are for? > Hmmm...from the markings on the slide rule and the way the cursor is made, I would guess that this is a K & E (Kaufel and Esser) slide rule...right??? -- +-------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond | +-------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: "PL" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> <994958824snz@dsl.co.uk> Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Lines: 25 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 04:20:58 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.254.158.137 X-Complaints-To: news@primus.ca X-Trace: news1.tor.primus.ca 995098763 216.254.158.137 (Sat, 14 Jul 2001 04:19:23 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 04:19:23 EDT Organization: Primus Canada Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!news.tesion.net!news.belwue.de!news-stu1.dfn.de!news-mue1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed.nntp.primus.ca!feed.nntp.primus.ca!news1.tor.primus.ca.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85267 "Andrew McLaren" wrote in message news:csN37.853$a04.3692@newsfeeds.bigpond.com... > "Brian {Hamilton Kelly}" wrote > > > And THAT (apart from the top-posting) is what makes this particular froup > > so /wonderful/ > > I agree - but I *do* resent this present learned assembly being called a > "froup". > Mmm, well, considering what it cud be called . . .chew on that a while. > Cheers ;-) > Andrew > > (owner, "Hemi" brand slide rule ... Japanese, rather mass-produced, c. early > 1970s). > > > ###### From: jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 16 Jul 2001 12:43:31 GMT Organization: The MITRE Corporation Lines: 17 Message-ID: <9iunhj$k7p$1@top.mitre.org> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> <9ioamq$joo$1@freenet9.carleton.ca> Reply-To: jcmorris@mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Host: jmorris-pc.mitre.org X-Trace: top.mitre.org 995287411 20729 128.29.251.13 (16 Jul 2001 12:43:31 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 16 Jul 2001 12:43:31 GMT X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.6 (NOV) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc01.blue.aol.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!news.tufts.edu!blanket.mitre.org!news.mitre.org!jcmorris Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85338 ab528@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Heinz W. Wiggeshoff) writes: >john Latala (jrlatala@golden.net) writes: >> >> What's the difference between a "Trigonometrical Differential Scale" and >> your plain old "Trigonometrical Scale"? > Sines become cosines, cosines become sines, and they all march together > in the Gay Pride parade. Tangents bugger off to infinity, and logarithms > of all bases tend to go off scale. Secants and their co-'s don't show up. ROFLMAO! Thank you for a *much* needed laugh...*especially* since it's a Monday morning... Joe Morris ###### From: jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Message-ID: <3b5b126e.4410596@news.powersurfr.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b4e4a0c.10742866@news.m.iinet.net.au> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Lines: 42 Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 18:08:05 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.108.184.50 X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com X-Trace: news-rep.ab.videon.ca 995825113 24.108.184.50 (Sun, 22 Jul 2001 12:05:13 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 12:05:13 MDT Organization: Videon CableSystems Alberta Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!Amsterdam.Infonet!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!newshunter!cosy.sbg.ac.at!newsmaster-01.atnet.at!atnet.at!newsrouter.chello.at!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newscore.gigabell.net!isdnet!howland.erols.net!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!cy1!cy2!newsfeed.shawcable.com!news-rep.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:85685 On Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:58:46 -0400, john Latala wrote, in part: >On Fri, 13 Jul 2001, David Green wrote: >> It looks as though you have a Thornton PIC rule there. >> The scales are "Trignometrical Differential Scales": >> SD is Direct Sine Differential Scale >> TD is Direct Tangent Differential Scale >> ISD is Inverse Sine Differential Scale >> ITD is Inverse Tangent Differential Scale >What's the difference between a "Trigonometrical Differential Scale" and >your plain old "Trigonometrical Scale"? Note that the ISd/ITd scale's zero is aligned directly over the V, which is pi/180, and the Td/Sd scale's zero is aligned directly over the U, which is 180/pi. The Td/Sd scale is marked in degrees, and both scales are similar in size. Let us think about angles in the form of radians. Both sin(x) and tan(x) are approximately equal to x for small x. Sin(x) is smaller than x, and tan(x) is bigger than x. The Sd scale runs from 57 - 180/pi for 0 degrees to 90 for 90 degrees. So I'd say that when you look up an angle x in degrees on the Sd scale, you get x/sin(x) on the C scale. So the Td scale probably gives x/tan(x). The ISd/ITd scales are centered around pi/180, so they're the inverse ratio, here where arcsines and arctangents are in degrees, for a numerical argument: x/arcsin(x) and x/arctan(x). John Savard http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html http://plaza.powersurfr.com/jsavard/other/ch02.htm ###### From: jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Message-ID: <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Lines: 18 Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 02:13:08 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.108.184.50 X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com X-Trace: news-rep.ab.videon.ca 998964561 24.108.184.50 (Mon, 27 Aug 2001 20:09:21 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 20:09:21 MDT Organization: Videon CableSystems Alberta Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!newsfeed-zh.ip-plus.net!news.ip-plus.net!Amsterdam.Infonet!News.Amsterdam.UnisourceCS!skynet.be!skynet.be!howland.erols.net!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!cy1!cy2!newsfeed.shawcable.com!news-rep.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88674 On 12 Jul 2001 12:46:39 +0100, Andrew Stribblehill wrote, in part: >I can't think of a better newsgroup to ask than this, so here goes... > >On the slide part of my slide-rule there's a line with four scales >on it. In left-right order, they go: ISd, ITd, Td, Sd. I just found the following web page: http://www.spdc.com.au/sr/ which includes a manual for a slide rule with "Differential Trig" scales! John Savard http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html http://plaza.powersurfr.com/jsavard/other/slrint.htm ###### From: jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Message-ID: <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Lines: 25 Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:31:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.109.100.252 X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com X-Trace: news-rep.ab.videon.ca 999091634 24.109.100.252 (Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:27:14 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2001 07:27:14 MDT Organization: Videon CableSystems Alberta Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.stealth.net!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!cy1!cy2!newsfeed.shawcable.com!news-rep.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88823 On Tue, 28 Aug 2001 02:13:08 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) wrote, in part: >On 12 Jul 2001 12:46:39 +0100, Andrew Stribblehill > wrote, in part: >>I can't think of a better newsgroup to ask than this, so here goes... >>On the slide part of my slide-rule there's a line with four scales >>on it. In left-right order, they go: ISd, ITd, Td, Sd. >I just found the following web page: >http://www.spdc.com.au/sr/ >which includes a manual for a slide rule with "Differential Trig" >scales! There's even a site on slide rules that has a *page* about these scales: http://www.sliderules.clara.net/a-to-z/trig/thornton.htm John Savard http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html http://plaza.powersurfr.com/jsavard/other/slrint.htm ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 29 Aug 2001 19:34:30 GMT Lines: 18 NNTP-Posting-Host: userbk22.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999113670 news.dial.pipex.com 225 62.188.144.30 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!surfnet.nl!bnewspeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88920 On Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:31:01 GMT, John Savard wrote: >There's even a site on slide rules that has a *page* about these >scales: > >http://www.sliderules.clara.net/a-to-z/trig/thornton.htm Thanks for the url...In the past 6 months I've picked up half a dozen slide-rules (at an average price of 1.50 (pounds - about $2.25) each) and I'm trying to remember how to use them! My memory (among other things...) ain't what it was ;-) -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 24 Message-ID: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZwb3otg7ReBVgF8DLy55c6YBWvvqgiVBbh9MnnjF6JqPeuvTAnFzwd X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 30 Aug 2001 12:07:39 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-52 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89001 In article , stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) wrote: >On Wed, 29 Aug 2001 13:31:01 GMT, John Savard > wrote: > >>There's even a site on slide rules that has a *page* about these >>scales: >> >>http://www.sliderules.clara.net/a-to-z/trig/thornton.htm > >Thanks for the url...In the past 6 months I've picked up half a dozen >slide-rules (at an average price of 1.50 (pounds - about $2.25) each) >and I'm trying to remember how to use them! >My memory (among other things...) ain't what it was ;-) > It will be amusing to somebody try to teach how to use one via newsgroups. I can't even manage to put a TECO command sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) My slide rule is still in my junk room. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 01 09:14:04 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 18 Message-ID: <9mnu9t$pq$6@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVa5bJvRV12YqUcjRMkMI92Pw5ywNT+dnx8yQ8UW4bzHJZJuoKuL74KT X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 12:01:01 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsmi-eu.news.garr.it!newsmi-us.news.garr.it!NewsITBone-GARR!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-19 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89002 In article , stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) wrote: >On Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >> I can't even manage to put a TECO command >>sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) > >TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to >be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd >paid more attention the first time around ;-) > Practice. My problem is that only my fingers know the keys, not my brain and I don't have the docs. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 01 09:15:41 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 24 Message-ID: <9mnucu$pq$7@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVba5qnIY2Pgzpm2eUcyUUYVXbP+5XpSoimXdz+5ZshFghifqLfoYWpa X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 12:02:38 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-19 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89015 In article <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net>, jrlatala@shell.golden.net wrote: >In article , >Stan Barr wrote: >>On Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >>> I can't even manage to put a TECO command >>>sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) >> >>TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to >>be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd >>paid more attention the first time around ;-) > >Hmmm ... TECO ... it's been a while. One of the neat things you'd do with >TECO was to figure out what your full name would do if you typed it as a >TECO command. I always meant to do that when I had some time to screw around. Never did manage. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 01 09:16:12 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 15 Message-ID: <9mnudt$pq$8@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYHYZWtXJG3zdUPw95ggd9eYXMF+hF1pqJrElOVhIMzYblrxc9dlIjm X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 12:03:09 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-19 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89016 In article , Jim Thomas wrote: >>>>>> "john" == jrlatala writes: > > john> One of the neat things you'd do with TECO was to figure out what > john> your full name would do if you typed it as a TECO command. > >Try amusing yourself interpreting license plates while driving across the >country :-) Now that's a good idea :-). Neat! /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 30 Aug 2001 20:04:05 GMT Lines: 14 NNTP-Posting-Host: useran98.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999201845 news.dial.pipex.com 8508 62.188.135.115 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.158.233.21!news1.ebone.net!news.ebone.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsifeed00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88964 On Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > I can't even manage to put a TECO command >sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd paid more attention the first time around ;-) -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: lysse Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: lysse's domain Reply-To: lysse.news@blueyonder.co.uk User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980226 (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.6 (i486)) Message-ID: Lines: 13 Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 23:32:09 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.31.9.47 X-Complaints-To: http://www.blueyonder.co.uk/abuse X-Trace: news1.cableinet.net 999214329 62.31.9.47 (Fri, 31 Aug 2001 00:32:09 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 00:32:09 BST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!ldn-newsfeed.speedport.net!newsfeed.speedport.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!internal-news-hub.cableinet.net!news1.cableinet.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89053 Stan Barr wrote: > TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to > be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd > paid more attention the first time around ;-) Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. How is it done..? -- lysse at lysse dot co dot uk "Why are your problems always so much bigger than everyone else's?" "Because they're mine." -- Ally McBeal ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 23:39:26 -0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Sender: Pete Fenelon References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> User-Agent: tin/1.5.8-20010221 ("Blue Water") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 9 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!171.64.14.106!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89054 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > My slide rule is still in my junk room. One of mine's in my desk drawer at work. I've actually used it when I was doing some capacity planning, half in frustration at the general crapness of "calculators" on most systems these days, half just for the hell of it :) pete ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 00:11:00 -0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Sender: Pete Fenelon References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> User-Agent: tin/1.5.8-20010221 ("Blue Water") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 15 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89057 lysse wrote: > Stan Barr wrote: > >> TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to >> be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd >> paid more attention the first time around ;-) > > Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant > role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. > How is it done..? Several very good PDP-11 emulators out there - Bob Supnik's is superb, you can boot several OSs under it. (I've had a v6 unix on my PC for ages...) pete ###### From: Elliott Roper Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 01:46:00 +0100 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <310820010146007077%elliott@yrl.co.uk> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit User-Agent: YA-NewsWatcher/5.0.1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 21 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.224.25.10!sn-uk-xit-01!sn-uk-post-02!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!elliott Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89028 In article , Stan Barr wrote: > On Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > > I can't even manage to put a TECO command > >sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) > > TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to > be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd > paid more attention the first time around ;-) Slide rules and TECO in the one post! a.f.c rules! psst wanna teco manual? (DEC variant) There is one at http://www.yrl.co.uk/~elliott/teco.doc It is straight ascii, not a word document. Heaven Forbid! There is also a copy of vtedit.tes and vtedit.tec there too. (If you have to ask, you don't want it) ###### From: jrlatala@shell.golden.net Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Organization: A poorly-installed InterNetNews site Lines: 19 Message-ID: <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Date: 30 Aug 2001 22:27:33 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.166.210.115 X-Complaints-To: abuse@golden.net X-Trace: radon.golden.net 999224855 199.166.210.115 (Thu, 30 Aug 2001 22:27:35 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2001 22:27:35 EDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!newsfeed1.cidera.com!Cidera!radon.golden.net!shell.golden.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89020 In article , Stan Barr wrote: >On Thu, 30 Aug 01 09:20:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >> I can't even manage to put a TECO command >>sequence into ASCII readable characters. ;-) > >TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to >be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd >paid more attention the first time around ;-) Hmmm ... TECO ... it's been a while. One of the neat things you'd do with TECO was to figure out what your full name would do if you typed it as a TECO command. -- john R. Latala jrlatala@golden.net ###### From: Jim Thomas Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 30 Aug 2001 18:52:30 -1000 Organization: Canada France Hawai`i Telescope Lines: 9 Message-ID: References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: atlas.cfht.hawaii.edu X-Trace: news.hawaii.edu 999233550 29012 128.171.80.135 (31 Aug 2001 04:52:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@hawaii.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 04:52:30 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.6 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!hammer.uoregon.edu!news.hawaii.edu!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89069 >>>>> "john" == jrlatala writes: john> One of the neat things you'd do with TECO was to figure out what john> your full name would do if you typed it as a TECO command. Try amusing yourself interpreting license plates while driving across the country :-) Jim ###### From: jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 31 Aug 2001 13:38:12 GMT Organization: The MITRE Corporation Lines: 21 Message-ID: <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Reply-To: jcmorris@mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Host: jmorris-pc.mitre.org X-Trace: top.mitre.org 999265092 17254 128.29.251.13 (31 Aug 2001 13:38:12 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 13:38:12 GMT X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.6 (NOV) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.tufts.edu!blanket.mitre.org!news.mitre.org!jcmorris Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88958 Pete Fenelon writes: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> My slide rule is still in my junk room. >One of mine's in my desk drawer at work. I've actually used it when I was >doing some capacity planning, half in frustration at the general crapness of >"calculators" on most systems these days, half just for the hell of it :) ...and I keep two (circular) slide rules in my flight kit: the larger one is an E6-B "computer" (that's the term used in aviation); the small one I hang on a lanyard on my neck so that I can do quick calculations without being distracted from my primary job of flying the airplane...and not have to worry about dead batteries. (No, "E6B" has nothing to do with the type of airplane. It's the model of the slide rule, and just happens to be the same nomenclature as is used for a military airplane.) Joe Morris ###### From: brian_huntley@my-deja.com (Brian Huntley) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 31 Aug 2001 07:15:55 -0700 Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Lines: 16 Message-ID: References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 142.205.248.1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 999267355 13968 127.0.0.1 (31 Aug 2001 14:15:55 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 14:15:55 GMT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!postnews1.google.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89088 Pete Fenelon wrote in message news:... > jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > > > My slide rule is still in my junk room. > > One of mine's in my desk drawer at work. I've actually used it when I was > doing some capacity planning, half in frustration at the general crapness of > "calculators" on most systems these days, half just for the hell of it :) Until I stopped driving a car last October, I used a slide rule almost every time I filled up. It was a custom one that, when you aligned litres bought and kilometers driven, read out the result in miles per imperial gallon. - Brian "never got the hang of L/100Km" Huntley ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 31 Aug 2001 17:45:48 GMT Lines: 27 NNTP-Posting-Host: usercb16.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999279948 news.dial.pipex.com 233 62.188.150.183 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.freenet.de!news2.euro.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!newsfeed.icl.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsifeed02.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88962 On Thu, 30 Aug 2001 23:32:09 GMT, lysse wrote: >Stan Barr wrote: > >> TECO...don't talk to me about TECO...I've got an old 486 that pretends to >> be a PDP-11 and I'm just trying to get to grips with TECO. I wish I'd >> paid more attention the first time around ;-) > >Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant >role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. >How is it done..? John Wilson's Ersatz-11 - absolutely brilliant! Can't remember the url, but a search will turn it up. There's also Bob Supnik's emulator, I've not tried that one but it's said to be excellent. RSTS/E, RT-11 etc are available also if you look, sorry don't have urls for them, I just followed the links from a PDP website. My 486DX4-80 is run without video or keyboard and is connected to a Qume QVT-103 terminal for the real authentic green-screen experience. I'm looking for a nice old clattery printer now... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <310820010146007077%elliott@yrl.co.uk> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 31 Aug 2001 17:45:49 GMT Lines: 16 NNTP-Posting-Host: usercb16.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999279949 news.dial.pipex.com 233 62.188.150.183 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.germany.net!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.158.233.21!news1.ebone.net!news.ebone.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsifeed02.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88963 On Fri, 31 Aug 2001 01:46:00 +0100, Elliott Roper wrote: > >psst wanna teco manual? (DEC variant) >There is one at http://www.yrl.co.uk/~elliott/teco.doc >It is straight ascii, not a word document. Heaven Forbid! >There is also a copy of vtedit.tes and vtedit.tec there too. >(If you have to ask, you don't want it) I've got the .DOC that comes with RSTS/E but I'll take a look anyway as then I can have it up on this screen while trying things on the PDP. Thanks... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: never+mail@panics.com.invalid (Michael Roach) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 31 Aug 2001 18:22:59 GMT Organization: A small notepad underneath my in box Lines: 20 Message-ID: <9mokm3$rlp$2@news.panix.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: panix1.panix.com X-Trace: news.panix.com 999282179 28345 166.84.1.1 (31 Aug 2001 18:22:59 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@panix.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 18:22:59 GMT X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test74 (May 26, 2000) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.nikoma.de!tiscalinetde!f.de.uu.net!howland.erols.net!panix!news.panix.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:88984 In article , Stan Barr wrote: >My 486DX4-80 is run without video or keyboard and is connected to a Qume >QVT-103 terminal for the real authentic green-screen experience. >I'm looking for a nice old clattery printer now... A couple weeks ago in the Cleveland airport I saw an ancient (are there any new ones?) TI-800 RO printer in a closet behind a TWA counter at the gate. (I don't remember which gate.) It's still in use! I don't know what they print there. I had to take a look under the hood and sure enough, a cheat sheet showing how the dip switches should be set was taped on the inside cover. It had been retaped; yellowed fragmented bits were still holding on to some parts. I don't know where they get ribbons or print heads though, nor do I know if they'd sell it to you 8^) -- It will be advantageous to cross the great stream ... the Dragon is on the wing in the Sky ... the Great Man rouses himself to his Work. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sat, 01 Sep 01 10:12:06 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 28 Message-ID: <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVa3vSSBOJq4vEeRM6Br0qHlqTB21SNxcF04pjKfiX64/9KvfmGjdRMX X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 1 Sep 2001 12:59:12 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-16 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89149 In article , lysse wrote: >Pete Fenelon wrote: >>> Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant >>> role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. >>> How is it done..? > >> Several very good PDP-11 emulators out there - Bob Supnik's is superb, you >> can boot several OSs under it. (I've had a v6 unix on my PC for ages...) > >Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as >v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster >as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence >yet, Yup. Take a look at the pdp10 newsgroup posts for the last 12-14 months and you'll see some amazing developing efforts. > ...or is that straining a PC too much? Nope. But it will give you an idea of what could have been. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sat, 01 Sep 01 10:06:19 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 24 Message-ID: <9mqlo5$gjr$16@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <999281428snz@dsl.co.uk> <1b66b46nar.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbOPsKEBmn9fcDJvHJVL9NSxlUSvlhPZUPvWXcoeXUSKt0WZK8KFs5G X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 1 Sep 2001 12:53:25 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-16 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89160 In article <1b66b46nar.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu>, Joe Pfeiffer wrote: >bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: >> >> I cannot understand folks (particularly "the meedja") who persist in >> talking about prices of petrol as so much per gallon: petrol has not been >> sold in gallons for almost twenty years (or is it more) and such pricing >> is not the criterion on which one selects the cheapest source of fuel, >> because the filling stations advertise the price in pence per litre. > >Depends on where you live.... Once upon a time, I bought gas in Canada assuming the numbers were USA quantities. Since I didn't have any Canadian money, I paid with a credit card. Was I surprised when I got my CC bill after conversions. Now I fill up in Buffalo or Port Huron, depending on my heading. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 18:10:28 GMT Organization: Dragonhill Systems Ltd Message-ID: <999281428snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: mail2news.demon.co.uk 999285769 mail2news:18226 mail2news mail2news.demon.co.uk X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Mail2News-Path: news.demon.net!dsl.demon.co.uk X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.31 Lines: 21 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!212.74.64.35!colt.net!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89229 In article brian_huntley@my-deja.com "Brian Huntley" writes: > - Brian "never got the hang of L/100Km" Huntley Neither have I; I tend to work in miles/litre; with my diesel car, I tend to get 12 or better, even if flogging it along the motorway at 100mph (errm, I mean 70mph, occifer). I cannot understand folks (particularly "the meedja") who persist in talking about prices of petrol as so much per gallon: petrol has not been sold in gallons for almost twenty years (or is it more) and such pricing is not the criterion on which one selects the cheapest source of fuel, because the filling stations advertise the price in pence per litre. -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "We have gone from a world of concentrated knowledge and wisdom to one of distributed ignorance. And we know and understand less while being incr- easingly capable." Prof. Peter Cochrane, formerly of BT Labs ###### From: Joe Pfeiffer Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 31 Aug 2001 13:29:16 -0600 Organization: NMSU Computer Science Lines: 14 Message-ID: <1b66b46nar.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <999281428snz@dsl.co.uk> NNTP-Posting-Host: viper.cs.nmsu.edu X-Trace: bubba.NMSU.Edu 999286154 8496 128.123.64.113 (31 Aug 2001 19:29:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@bubba.NMSU.Edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 31 Aug 2001 19:29:14 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.5 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!dca6-feed2.news.digex.net!lax2-feed1.news.digex.net!intermedia!lynx.unm.edu!news.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89130 bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: > > I cannot understand folks (particularly "the meedja") who persist in > talking about prices of petrol as so much per gallon: petrol has not been > sold in gallons for almost twenty years (or is it more) and such pricing > is not the criterion on which one selects the cheapest source of fuel, > because the filling stations advertise the price in pence per litre. Depends on where you live.... -- Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer SWNMRSEF: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### From: lysse Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: lysse's domain Reply-To: lysse.news@blueyonder.co.uk User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980226 (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.6 (i486)) Message-ID: Lines: 16 Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 21:32:09 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.31.9.47 X-Complaints-To: http://www.blueyonder.co.uk/abuse X-Trace: news1.cableinet.net 999293529 62.31.9.47 (Fri, 31 Aug 2001 22:32:09 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 22:32:09 BST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!colt.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!internal-news-hub.cableinet.net!news1.cableinet.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89190 Pete Fenelon wrote: >> Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant >> role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. >> How is it done..? > Several very good PDP-11 emulators out there - Bob Supnik's is superb, you > can boot several OSs under it. (I've had a v6 unix on my PC for ages...) Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence yet, or is that straining a PC too much? -- lysse at lysse dot co dot uk "Why are your problems always so much bigger than everyone else's?" "Because they're mine." -- Ally McBeal ###### From: lysse Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: lysse's domain Reply-To: lysse.news@blueyonder.co.uk User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980226 (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.6 (i486)) Message-ID: Lines: 16 Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 21:32:10 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.31.9.47 X-Complaints-To: http://www.blueyonder.co.uk/abuse X-Trace: news1.cableinet.net 999293530 62.31.9.47 (Fri, 31 Aug 2001 22:32:10 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 22:32:10 BST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.158.233.21!news1.ebone.net!news.ebone.net!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!internal-news-hub.cableinet.net!news1.cableinet.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89189 Stan Barr wrote: > John Wilson's Ersatz-11 - absolutely brilliant! Can't remember the url, but > a search will turn it up. Thanks. I'll give both his and Supnik's a go, I think; I have 3 486s, one of them a laptop. > RSTS/E, RT-11 etc are available also if you look, sorry don't have urls for > them, I just followed the links from a PDP website. I'll go hunting. I never used the real things, so it'll be a learning exercise. I like those. ;-) -- lysse at lysse dot co dot uk "Why are your problems always so much bigger than everyone else's?" "Because they're mine." -- Ally McBeal ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 23:17:27 GMT Organization: Dragonhill Systems Ltd Message-ID: <999299847snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <1b66b46nar.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> X-Trace: mail2news.demon.co.uk 999325188 mail2news:23437 mail2news mail2news.demon.co.uk X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Mail2News-Path: news.demon.net!dsl.demon.co.uk X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.31 Lines: 21 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!194.42.224.136!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89237 In article <1b66b46nar.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu "Joe Pfeiffer" writes: > bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: > > > > I cannot understand folks (particularly "the meedja") who persist in > > talking about prices of petrol as so much per gallon: petrol has not been > > sold in gallons for almost twenty years (or is it more) and such pricing > > is not the criterion on which one selects the cheapest source of fuel, > > because the filling stations advertise the price in pence per litre. > > Depends on where you live.... Ah, but yourn gallons be different to ourn. -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "We have gone from a world of concentrated knowledge and wisdom to one of distributed ignorance. And we know and understand less while being incr- easingly capable." Prof. Peter Cochrane, formerly of BT Labs ###### From: jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Message-ID: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Lines: 28 Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.109.100.252 X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com X-Trace: news-rep.ab.videon.ca 999308254 24.109.100.252 (Fri, 31 Aug 2001 19:37:34 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 19:37:34 MDT Organization: Videon CableSystems Alberta Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.stealth.net!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!cy1!cy2!newsfeed.shawcable.com!news-rep.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89185 On 31 Aug 2001 13:38:12 GMT, jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) wrote, in part: >(No, "E6B" has nothing to do with the type of airplane. It's the model >of the slide rule, and just happens to be the same nomenclature as is used >for a military airplane.) It's the model number of one of the _original_ slide rules of that type, made by the Dalton Manufacturing Company - and then their competitors used that particular model number as a generic term for this type of device. They also made an E-6C that covered higher speeds, for use with jets, and an E-10 with more features and aluminum construction. Essentially, while it includes a circular slide rule for correcting air speed based on altitude and temperature, the main purpose of this type of slide rule is to perform vector addition in polar coordinates. A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. No, I don't own one (they were too expensive, and I'm not a pilot) but I did latch on to a copy of the *manual* at a thrift shop one lucky day. John Savard http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html http://plaza.powersurfr.com/jsavard/other/slrint.htm ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mokm3$rlp$2@news.panix.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 01 Sep 2001 07:34:43 GMT Lines: 33 NNTP-Posting-Host: userbn13.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999329683 news.dial.pipex.com 8508 62.188.145.64 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.64.68.27!newsgate.cistron.nl!news.worldonline.nl!bnewspeer01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsifeed01.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89136 On 31 Aug 2001 18:22:59 GMT, Michael Roach wrote: > >In article , >Stan Barr wrote: >>My 486DX4-80 is run without video or keyboard and is connected to a Qume >>QVT-103 terminal for the real authentic green-screen experience. >>I'm looking for a nice old clattery printer now... > >A couple weeks ago in the Cleveland airport I saw an ancient (are there >any new ones?) TI-800 RO printer in a closet behind a TWA counter at the >gate. (I don't remember which gate.) It's still in use! I don't know >what they print there. I had to take a look under the hood and sure >enough, a cheat sheet showing how the dip switches should be set was >taped on the inside cover. It had been retaped; yellowed fragmented bits >were still holding on to some parts. > I like it ;-) I always think if things do a good job, keep using 'em... I'm still using my old Star 9-pin DM printer I've had for years, It's completely reliable and trouble-free - if noisy! My Canon A1 camera is still my main photo tool...and I regularly use a '50s Rolleiflex. >I don't know where they get ribbons or print heads though, nor do I know >if they'd sell it to you 8^) I'm the wrong side of the pond anyway! -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Message-ID: <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.11/32.235 Lines: 12 Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 13:59:27 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.109.100.252 X-Complaints-To: abuse@powersurfr.com X-Trace: news-rep.ab.videon.ca 999352536 24.109.100.252 (Sat, 01 Sep 2001 07:55:36 MDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 07:55:36 MDT Organization: Videon CableSystems Alberta Inc. Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed1.cidera.com!Cidera!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!usenetserver.com!pd2nf1so.cg.shawcable.net!residential.shaw.ca!cy1!cy2!newsfeed.shawcable.com!news-rep.ab.videon.ca!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89173 On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) wrote, in part: >A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent disk, I should have noted. John Savard http://home.ecn.ab.ca/~jsavard/index.html http://plaza.powersurfr.com/jsavard/other/slrint.htm ###### From: lysse Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> Organization: lysse's domain Reply-To: lysse.news@blueyonder.co.uk User-Agent: tin/pre-1.4-980226 (UNIX) (Linux/2.2.6 (i486)) Message-ID: Lines: 23 Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 15:32:13 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.31.9.47 X-Complaints-To: http://www.blueyonder.co.uk/abuse X-Trace: news1.cableinet.net 999358333 62.31.9.47 (Sat, 01 Sep 2001 16:32:13 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2001 16:32:13 BST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!194.42.224.136!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!news-hub.cableinet.net!blueyonder!internal-news-hub.cableinet.net!news1.cableinet.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89203 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >>Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as >>v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster >>as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence >>yet, > Yup. Take a look at the pdp10 newsgroup posts for the last > 12-14 months and you'll see some amazing developing efforts. Whoopee! Thank you, you just made my day. Now, is it still possible to get hold of TOPS-10 or ITS? (btw, I don't think I've ever heard your opinion of ITS... or if I have, I've forgotten.) >> ...or is that straining a PC too much? > Nope. But it will give you an idea of what could have been. Which is certainly what I was after. Thanks. (It's also the closest I'll ever get to a PDP-10.) -- lysse at lysse dot co dot uk "Why are your problems always so much bigger than everyone else's?" "Because they're mine." -- Ally McBeal ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sun, 02 Sep 01 09:46:53 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 49 Message-ID: <9mt902$40r$13@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYPzL9tDSaJ8rOcDt1w1Aq1lIT+IhBjXjLEJjQdmopYu3f3bgETT+D/ X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 2 Sep 2001 12:34:10 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-91 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89257 In article , lysse wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >>>Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as >>>v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster >>>as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence >>>yet, > >> Yup. Take a look at the pdp10 newsgroup posts for the last >> 12-14 months and you'll see some amazing developing efforts. > >Whoopee! Thank you, you just made my day. Now, is it still possible >to get hold of TOPS-10 Yup. Read the newsgroup; it'll give you all the poop to put on your system. > ... or ITS? (btw, I don't think I've ever heard >your opinion of ITS... or if I have, I've forgotten.) Well, there was a post recently that somebody had gotten ITS to boot ( don't take my word for it because I could be wrong). I don't know if it's available for us unwashed types. It was a fine test for the emulators. > >>> ...or is that straining a PC too much? > >> Nope. But it will give you an idea of what could have been. > >Which is certainly what I was after. Thanks. (It's also the closest >I'll ever get to a PDP-10.) Again, read the newsgroup. There's a room hidden in Rhode Island that is now home to two of them....three of them--I forgot the KS. They have one web thingies but I don't have their address written down. Read any post from Carl Friend and you'll find the bread trails. There have been posts over the last month documenting their latest baby along with a lot of tapes. Apparently this KL was cared for very well and the previous owners were very careful about keeping and cataloging every tape they received from DEC. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sun, 02 Sep 01 09:51:16 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 42 Message-ID: <9mt988$40r$14@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9198B4.71A5D21D@boutel.co.nz> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZCll69K6pMEfpTZekF0HIKToO0WoAKu3npTAIprH7ySD0dknmWA4nA X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 2 Sep 2001 12:38:32 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news0.de.colt.net!colt.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-91 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89260 In article <3B9198B4.71A5D21D@boutel.co.nz>, Brian Boutel wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >> In article , >> lysse wrote: >> >Pete Fenelon wrote: >> >>> Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant >> >>> role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. >> >>> How is it done..? >> > >> >> Several very good PDP-11 emulators out there - >> >>>Bob Supnik's is superb, >> you >> >> can boot several OSs under it. (I've had a v6 unix on my PC for >> ages...) >> > >> >Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as >> >v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster >> >as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence >> >yet, >> >> Yup. Take a look at the pdp10 newsgroup posts for the last >> 12-14 months and you'll see some amazing developing efforts. >> >> > ...or is that straining a PC too much? >> >> Nope. But it will give you an idea of what could have been. > >Hmmm... I think I now understand the difference between fondly >remembering the past and actually wanting to relive it. I don't want to relive the past. However, getting this software working can be a really good training tool. People who want to temporarily escape from the Point/Click world and see how machine instructions really worked or look at how three different operating systems dealt with certain computing problems just might prove useful. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 01 Sep 2001 20:07:03 GMT Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: useraf05.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999374823 news.dial.pipex.com 230 62.188.131.246 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!kanja.arnes.si!news-hub.siol.net!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.158.233.21!news1.ebone.net!news.ebone.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89251 On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, John Savard wrote: > >Essentially, while it includes a circular slide rule for correcting >air speed based on altitude and temperature, the main purpose of this >type of slide rule is to perform vector addition in polar coordinates. >A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. Oh, I've got a cardboard one of those made by Jeppeson that I use with Flight Sim - as I can't afford to get my feet off the ground for real these days ;-( Of course everyone uses electronic calculators these days... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### Message-ID: <3B9198B4.71A5D21D@boutel.co.nz> From: Brian Boutel Organization: X X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 30 Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 14:25:56 +1200 NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.96.144.148 X-Complaints-To: abuse@tsnz.net X-Trace: news02.tsnz.net 999397403 203.96.144.148 (Sun, 02 Sep 2001 14:23:23 NZST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 14:23:23 NZST Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed01.tsnz.net!news02.tsnz.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89247 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > In article , > lysse wrote: > >Pete Fenelon wrote: > >>> Ooh, I have a couple of old 486s around here without a significant > >>> role in life, and pretending to be a PDP-11 sounds like a great use. > >>> How is it done..? > > > >> Several very good PDP-11 emulators out there - Bob Supnik's is superb, > you > >> can boot several OSs under it. (I've had a v6 unix on my PC for > ages...) > > > >Goody. I remember seeing that one could download v6 unix, as well as > >v5 and I think v4 too. Yum. :-) Do you think a 386 would pass muster > >as a PDP-8 emulator? And are there any PDP-10 emulators in existence > >yet, > > Yup. Take a look at the pdp10 newsgroup posts for the last > 12-14 months and you'll see some amazing developing efforts. > > > ...or is that straining a PC too much? > > Nope. But it will give you an idea of what could have been. Hmmm... I think I now understand the difference between fondly remembering the past and actually wanting to relive it. --brian ###### From: mirian@trantor.cosmic.com (Mirian Crzig Lennox) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mqm30$gjr$17@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mt902$40r$13@bob.news.rcn.net> Message-ID: User-Agent: slrn/0.9.6.4 (Linux) Lines: 16 Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 20:11:47 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.58.189.187 X-Complaints-To: abuse@shore.net X-Trace: news.shore.net 999461507 209.58.189.187 (Sun, 02 Sep 2001 16:11:47 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2001 16:11:47 EDT Organization: Shore.Net, a PRIMUS Company (info@shore.net) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.netcologne.de!skynet.be!skynet.be!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cambridge1-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!news.shore.net!mirian Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89534 On Sun, 02 Sep 01 09:46:53 GMT, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> ... or ITS? (btw, I don't think I've ever heard >>your opinion of ITS... or if I have, I've forgotten.) > >Well, there was a post recently that somebody had gotten ITS >to boot ( don't take my word for it because I could be wrong). >I don't know if it's available for us unwashed types. >It was a fine test for the emulators. About a week or so ago, I managed to achieve timesharing ITS on Bob Supnik's PDP-10 emulator (part of SIMH). I've just completed putting together a fairly snap-together bootstrap distribution of ITS, which you can get to from my ITS page at http://www.cosmic.com/u/mirian/its/ --Mirian ###### From: jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 3 Sep 2001 16:50:09 GMT Organization: The MITRE Corporation Lines: 26 Message-ID: <9n0cc1$33o$1@top.mitre.org> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <3b8afdc7.8856159@news.powersurfr.com> <3b8cee65.264223@news.powersurfr.com> <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> Reply-To: jcmorris@mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Host: jmorris-pc.mitre.org X-Trace: top.mitre.org 999535809 3192 128.29.251.13 (3 Sep 2001 16:50:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 3 Sep 2001 16:50:09 GMT X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.6 (NOV) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.tufts.edu!blanket.mitre.org!news.mitre.org!jcmorris Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89346 stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) writes: >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, John Savard wrote: >>Essentially, while it includes a circular slide rule for correcting >>air speed based on altitude and temperature, the main purpose of this >>type of slide rule is to perform vector addition in polar coordinates. >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >Oh, I've got a cardboard one of those made by Jeppeson that I use with >Flight Sim - as I can't afford to get my feet off the ground for real >these days ;-( >Of course everyone uses electronic calculators these days... Consider the problems of reading the display on an electric calculator on a bumpy day with bright sunlight that inevitably comes from the least desirable direction (or worse yet, at night). Or trying to punch in the digits while bumping along right at the top of an inversion. Or dropping the calculator on the floor. Or having dead batteries. Don't get me wrong; I keep my ancient HP41C around for doing a lot of flight planning, but for in-cockpit use I want something that's reliable, durable, and easy to use in adverse conditions: the E6B. Joe Morris ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 06 Sep 01 09:05:49 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 27 Message-ID: <9n7o45$8p$10@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> <9mnudt$pq$8@bob.news.rcn.net> <9n65lk$13pq@r02n01.cac.psu.edu> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYsg+CUZpTEnWBJ6OGvb58YMSSOVMTLo8eNDTKbdw/jfIuZcGSpmaF1 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 6 Sep 2001 11:53:41 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-102-46 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89699 In article <9n65lk$13pq@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>, hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Prof. Richard E. Hawkins) wrote: >In article <9mnudt$pq$8@bob.news.rcn.net>, wrote: >>In article , >> Jim Thomas wrote: > >>>Try amusing yourself interpreting license plates while driving across the >>>country :-) > >>Now that's a good idea :-). Neat! > >Walking across campus one day in graduate school, I immediately started >translating the greek eqation, not even thinking about what I was doing. > >It was a sorority sweatshirt, not an equation . . . not long after I >repeated this in an appropriate newsgroup,I found it added to the list >of signs that you might be a grad student . .. ROTFL. There were times when the guys at work would come in muttering about a stopcode on a license plate. (Our monitor stopcodes were uniquely identified with a combination of three uppercase letters.) /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Prof. Richard E. Hawkins) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 5 Sep 2001 21:32:36 GMT Organization: Penn State University, Center for Academic Computing Lines: 23 Message-ID: <9n65lk$13pq@r02n01.cac.psu.edu> References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mmsml$b88$1@shell.golden.net> <9mnudt$pq$8@bob.news.rcn.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: fac13.ds.psu.edu X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Prof. Richard E. Hawkins) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.ems.psu.edu!news3.cac.psu.edu!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89706 In article <9mnudt$pq$8@bob.news.rcn.net>, wrote: >In article , > Jim Thomas wrote: >>Try amusing yourself interpreting license plates while driving across the >>country :-) >Now that's a good idea :-). Neat! Walking across campus one day in graduate school, I immediately started translating the greek eqation, not even thinking about what I was doing. It was a sorority sweatshirt, not an equation . . . not long after I repeated this in an appropriate newsgroup,I found it added to the list of signs that you might be a grad student . .. hawk -- Prof. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq. /"\ ASCII ribbon campaign dochawk@psu.edu Smeal 178 (814) 375-4700 \ / against HTML mail These opinions will not be those of X and postings Penn State until it pays my retainer. / \ ###### Message-ID: <3B97D065.C0B72A2A@sis-dev.com> Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:37:09 -0500 From: bob irwin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.8 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mokm3$rlp$2@news.panix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.201.148.173 X-Trace: 6 Sep 2001 14:44:10 -0600, 216.201.148.173 Lines: 15 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!64.245.249.19.MISMATCH!dfw3-feed1.news.digex.net!intermedia!216.0.152.7!216.201.148.173 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89774 Michael Roach wrote: > > In article , > Stan Barr wrote: > >My 486DX4-80 is run without video or keyboard and is connected to a Qume > >QVT-103 terminal for the real authentic green-screen experience. > >I'm looking for a nice old clattery printer now... I've got a couple of Model 38 TTYs in the garage. upper/lower case, 132 column paper, rs232. Haven't turned one on in 21 years. Retired them when i got a TI thermal with dual cassets. If you're near Houston, you're welcome to haul them away. May also have a TI KSR thermal also. bob ###### From: "Charlie Gibbs" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 06 Sep 01 11:13:57 -0800 Organization: http://extra.newsguy.com Lines: 19 Message-ID: <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-617.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: THOR 2.5a (Amiga;TCP/IP) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!194.25.134.126.MISMATCH!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.germany.net!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!209.155.233.16!pln-e!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!news2 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89872 In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >(John Savard) wrote, in part: > >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. > >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >disk, I should have noted. We called it a "pencil". :-) -- cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular (Charlie Gibbs) I'm switching ISPs - watch this space. ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <87r8vms734.fsf@womble.dur.ac.uk> <9mokm3$rlp$2@news.panix.com> <3B97D065.C0B72A2A@sis-dev.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 07 Sep 2001 07:34:47 GMT Lines: 22 NNTP-Posting-Host: userav71.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999848087 news.dial.pipex.com 231 62.188.138.118 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.86.7.162!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!195.129.110.18.MISMATCH!bnewspeer00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsifeed02.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89820 On Thu, 06 Sep 2001 14:37:09 -0500, bob irwin wrote: >Michael Roach wrote: >> >> In article , >> Stan Barr wrote: >> >My 486DX4-80 is run without video or keyboard and is connected to a Qume >> >QVT-103 terminal for the real authentic green-screen experience. >> >I'm looking for a nice old clattery printer now... > >I've got a couple of Model 38 TTYs in the garage. upper/lower >case, 132 column paper, rs232. Haven't turned one on in 21 >years. Retired them when i got a TI thermal with dual cassets. >If you're near Houston, you're welcome to haul them away. >May also have a TI KSR thermal also. I'm the wrong side of the Atlantic unfortunately ;-( -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 07 Sep 2001 17:02:20 GMT Lines: 27 NNTP-Posting-Host: userbm55.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 999882140 news.dial.pipex.com 8508 62.188.145.7 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!195.158.233.21!news1.ebone.net!news.ebone.net!lnewspeer00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewsifeed02.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89818 On 06 Sep 01 11:13:57 -0800, Charlie Gibbs wrote: >In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> >jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: > >>On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >>(John Savard) wrote, in part: >> >>>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >> >>And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>disk, I should have noted. > >We called it a "pencil". :-) > Somewhere in the mountain of paper I have here is a "Byte" article entitiled "Generic Word Processor" which describes, in computer jargon, the use of a pencil for word-processing. I particularly liked their description of a pencil sharpener as an "Initialization Unit" ;-) -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sun, 09 Sep 01 10:29:52 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 51 Message-ID: <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYCjEO3Circ3ZH1xmPndsWvWq9wlrElmc+tNJtBlKz9hwcGRtGMGlfa X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 9 Sep 2001 13:18:13 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-219 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:89995 In article , Bernd Felsche wrote: >bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: > >>In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> >> cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: > >>> In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> >>> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: >>> >>> >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >>> >(John Savard) wrote, in part: >>> > >>> >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>> >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >>> > >>> >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent >>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>> >disk, I should have noted. >>> >>> We called it a "pencil". :-) > >>Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, >>that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO >>used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a >>"propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. >>Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular >>for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those >>perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. > >I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent films >held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned upon; the maps >were expensive. That was in the 1970's and 1980's. The beauty of the >Chinagraphs was/is that they are almost impervious to water; which >is quite important if your hole in the ground is filling rapidly >with water. Well water? > >The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two >cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became >geographically-embarrassed. I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just mean "get lost"? /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2001 07:27:53 GMT Organization: Dragonhill Systems Ltd Message-ID: <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> X-Trace: mail2news.demon.co.uk 999947096 mail2news:13029 mail2news mail2news.demon.co.uk X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net X-Mail2News-Path: news.demon.net!dsl.demon.co.uk X-Newsreader: Demon Internet Simple News v1.31 Lines: 32 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!colt.net!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!mail2news.demon.co.uk!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90085 In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: > In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> > jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: > > >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere > >(John Savard) wrote, in part: > > > >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating > >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. > > > >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >disk, I should have noted. > > We called it a "pencil". :-) Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a "propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. -- Brian {Hamilton Kelly} bhk@dsl.co.uk "We have gone from a world of concentrated knowledge and wisdom to one of distributed ignorance. And we know and understand less while being incr- easingly capable." Prof. Peter Cochrane, formerly of BT Labs ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2001 01:30:18 -0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Sender: Pete Fenelon References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> User-Agent: tin/1.5.8-20010221 ("Blue Water") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 11 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!sn-xit-04!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90034 Stan Barr wrote: > Somewhere in the mountain of paper I have here is a "Byte" article > entitiled "Generic Word Processor" which describes, in computer > jargon, the use of a pencil for word-processing. I particularly liked > their description of a pencil sharpener as an "Initialization Unit" ;-) > I've frequently asserted that all of my designs and specs have been created with DIN 16553 compliant tools... pete ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> From: Bernd Felsche User-Agent: nn/6.6.beta2 Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2001 18:52:44 +0800 Message-ID: Lines: 43 NNTP-Posting-Host: innovative.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 1000033364 15615 203.59.144.24 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.mel.connect.com.au!news.per.connect.com.au!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90061 bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: >In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> > cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: >> In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> >> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: >> >> >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >> >(John Savard) wrote, in part: >> > >> >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >> >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >> > >> >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent >> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> >disk, I should have noted. >> >> We called it a "pencil". :-) >Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, >that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO >used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a >"propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. >Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular >for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those >perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent films held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned upon; the maps were expensive. That was in the 1970's and 1980's. The beauty of the Chinagraphs was/is that they are almost impervious to water; which is quite important if your hole in the ground is filling rapidly with water. The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became geographically-embarrassed. -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus! | X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature| / \ and postings | to help me spread! | ###### From: "Kent Sutton" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2001 20:07:31 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 58 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.online.be!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!feeder.qis.net!sn-xit-02!sn-post-02!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90033 wrote in message news:9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net... > In article , > Bernd Felsche wrote: > >bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: > > > >>In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> > >> cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: > > > >>> In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> > >>> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: > >>> > >>> >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere > >>> >(John Savard) wrote, in part: > >>> > > >>> >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating > >>> >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. > >>> > > >>> >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent > >>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > >>> >disk, I should have noted. > >>> > >>> We called it a "pencil". :-) > > > >>Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, > >>that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO > >>used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a > >>"propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. > >>Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular > >>for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those > >>perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. > > > >I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent films > >held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned upon; the maps > >were expensive. That was in the 1970's and 1980's. The beauty of the > >Chinagraphs was/is that they are almost impervious to water; which > >is quite important if your hole in the ground is filling rapidly > >with water. > > Well water? > > > > >The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two > >cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became > >geographically-embarrassed. > > I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't > tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just > mean "get lost"? > > /BAH > > Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. I parsed it as they can't tell on the map which hole in the ground their ass is in. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Bernd Felsche User-Agent: nn/6.6.beta2 Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 10:05:39 +0800 Message-ID: Lines: 69 NNTP-Posting-Host: innovative.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 1000087882 18349 203.59.144.24 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90050 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >In article , > Bernd Felsche wrote: >>bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: >> >>>In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> >>> cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: >> >>>> In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> >>>> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: >>>> >>>> >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >>>> >(John Savard) wrote, in part: >>>> > >>>> >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>>> >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >>>> > >>>> >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent >>>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>>> >disk, I should have noted. >>>> >>>> We called it a "pencil". :-) >>>Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, >>>that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO >>>used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a >>>"propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. >>>Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular >>>for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those >>>perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. >>I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent films >>held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned upon; the maps >>were expensive. That was in the 1970's and 1980's. The beauty of the >>Chinagraphs was/is that they are almost impervious to water; which >>is quite important if your hole in the ground is filling rapidly >>with water. >Well water? No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". >>The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two >>cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became >>geographically-embarrassed. >I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't >tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just >mean "get lost"? "Georgraphically embarrassed" is as old as I can remember. Certainly dates back to the mid-1970's when I learnt to navigate. There's a big difference between "lost"; i.e. not being able to identify where you are and being geographically embarrassed (GE). The latter is where you end up in a place you didn't intend to go. Anybody who knows how to read a map and use a compass will only ever be GE; unless they've travelled off the map. A GPS will almost always ensure that you're never _lost_. But you tend to be frequently GE if you can't use a map in conjunction with GPS. -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus! | X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature| / \ and postings | to help me spread! | ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Mon, 10 Sep 01 08:55:27 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 91 Message-ID: <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVZad7XBCSWXDAuXcdztr/7IQhnYZpkpeJ1Corea6819fNZ6kSk5J02U X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 10 Sep 2001 11:43:59 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!feedme.news.mediaways.net!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!lon1-news.nildram.net!newspeer1.nac.net!netnews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-127 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90106 In article , Bernd Felsche wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >>In article , >> Bernd Felsche wrote: >>>bhk@dsl.co.uk (Brian {Hamilton Kelly}) writes: >>> >>>>In article <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> >>>> cgibbs@nowhere.in.particular "Charlie Gibbs" writes: >>> >>>>> In article <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> >>>>> jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere (John Savard) writes: >>>>> >>>>> >On Sat, 01 Sep 2001 01:41:25 GMT, jsavard@ecn.ab.SBLOK.ca.nowhere >>>>> >(John Savard) wrote, in part: >>>>> > >>>>> >>A transparent disk can rotate, with a scale around it indicating >>>>> >>degrees, and a slide marked like polar graph paper moves behind it. >>>>> > >>>>> >And you use an erasable marker to draw vectors on that transparent >>>>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >>>>> >disk, I should have noted. >>>>> >>>>> We called it a "pencil". :-) > >>>>Not usually; I think those particular disks require a wax pencil, >>>>that over in Rightpondia goes by the name of "Chinagraph". HMSO >>>>used to supply both the wooden-bodied variety, and also a >>>>"propelling" version with the waxy "lead" in a plastic holder. >>>>Both were stocked specifically for the RAF; they were also popular >>>>for the early whiteboards, and for writing backwards on those >>>>perspex screens that one sees in movies of the old war rooms. > >>>I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent films >>>held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned upon; the maps >>>were expensive. That was in the 1970's and 1980's. The beauty of the >>>Chinagraphs was/is that they are almost impervious to water; which >>>is quite important if your hole in the ground is filling rapidly >>>with water. > >>Well water? > >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning about that stuff. > >>>The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two >>>cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became >>>geographically-embarrassed. > >>I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't >>tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just >>mean "get lost"? > >"Georgraphically embarrassed" is as old as I can remember. Certainly >dates back to the mid-1970's when I learnt to navigate. > >There's a big difference between "lost"; i.e. not being able to >identify where you are and being geographically embarrassed (GE). >The latter is where you end up in a place you didn't intend to go. Men do that all the time. >Anybody who knows how to read a map I know how to do that; I like maps. > .. and use a compass will only ever >be GE; unless they've travelled off the map. I've never used a compass. Is that the tool I keep seeing getting used in movies in submarines and stuff? > >A GPS will almost always ensure that you're never _lost_. But you >tend to be frequently GE if you can't use a map in conjunction with >GPS. hmmm...I have this feeling that I know nothing about maps. I don't think I've ever used GPS. I think Dad uses it to find fish and his way back home. Although I never did figure out the "find fish" part. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: Sam Seiber Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 16:17:20 -0600 Organization: Change .com to .net Message-ID: <3B9D3BF0.168@earthlink.com> X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 10 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!sn-xit-04!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!news.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90137 Stan Barr wrote: > Somewhere in the mountain of paper I have here is a "Byte" article > entitiled "Generic Word Processor" which describes, in computer > jargon, the use of a pencil for word-processing. I particularly liked > their description of a pencil sharpener as an "Initialization Unit" ;-) Wasn't it referred to as a graphite display terminal? I have some memory of Byte writting about such things. Sam ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Ric Werme X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #119 Lines: 19 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 00:21:30 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.128.105.166 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 1000167690 24.128.105.166 (Mon, 10 Sep 2001 20:21:30 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2001 20:21:30 EDT Organization: Road Runner Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.70!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90227 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >>A GPS will almost always ensure that you're never _lost_. But you >>tend to be frequently GE if you can't use a map in conjunction with >>GPS. >hmmm...I have this feeling that I know nothing about maps. I >don't think I've ever used GPS. I think Dad uses it to find fish >and his way back home. Although I never did figure out the "find >fish" part. He doesn't - he uses it to mark (record) good fishing spots and goes back there later. With a handheld GPS receiver you can mark a place out of sight of land and get back there next month within a spitting distance of the original spot. -- Ric Werme | werme@nospam.mediaone.net http://people.ne.mediaone.net/werme | ^^^^^^^ delete ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Bernd Felsche User-Agent: nn/6.6.beta2 Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 16:26:06 +0800 Message-ID: Lines: 111 NNTP-Posting-Host: innovative.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 1000196783 21089 203.59.144.24 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90212 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >In article , > Bernd Felsche wrote: >>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >> >>>In article , >>> Bernd Felsche wrote: >>>>I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent >>>>films held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned >>>>upon; the maps were expensive. That was in the 1970's and >>>>1980's. The beauty of the Chinagraphs was/is that they are >>>>almost impervious to water; which is quite important if your >>>>hole in the ground is filling rapidly with water. >>>Well water? >>No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >>shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". >Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning >about that stuff. You might have gained some idea from the movies or television. Rain is pretty much independent of war. If you need to mark something that's wet, or is going to get wet, a "Chinagraph" pencil is a tool that works. >>>>The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two >>>>cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became >>>>geographically-embarrassed. >>>I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't >>>tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just >>>mean "get lost"? >> >>"Georgraphically embarrassed" is as old as I can remember. Certainly >>dates back to the mid-1970's when I learnt to navigate. >>There's a big difference between "lost"; i.e. not being able to >>identify where you are and being geographically embarrassed (GE). >>The latter is where you end up in a place you didn't intend to go. >Men do that all the time. Women too. The main difference between untrained men and women is that women will usually be able to go back where they've come from, as long as what they've seen along the way hasn't changed too much (visual memory). Men become GE if they lose spatial orientation; but will be able to develop a novel short-cut back to the point of origin if they maintain or recover orientation. Women tend to have to tred the same path back to the origin. Training can reduce most of the bias in both genders. >>Anybody who knows how to read a map >I know how to do that; I like maps. Can you look at a topo. map of an unfamiliar area and visualize the terrain and vegetation? Can you approximate inter-visibility just by looking at the map? >> .. and use a compass will only ever >>be GE; unless they've travelled off the map. >I've never used a compass. Is that the tool I keep seeing >getting used in movies in submarines and stuff? Infantry use it too. There's a sport called orienteering that's based on map and compass navigation as well as running. You might find it interesting if you're a fitness freak. A compass tells you which direction (bearing) is associated with a particular visible point relative to the observer. See references to rain and Chinagraph above. :-) Bearings can be represented in a number of schemes. North is the direction of the North pole; the magnetic North pole is where the compass points and all angles (bearings) are measured relative to that. Magnetic North is usually nowhere near geographic North (aka Santa's workshop :) and magnetic North moves with time. A good map will show magnetic variation for the area covered by the map. The military is necessarily precise about such things as errors tend to accumulate and it's nowadays unfashionable to send your infantry into your own mine fields, instead of the safe corridor that may only be a few metres wide... >>A GPS will almost always ensure that you're never _lost_. But you >>tend to be frequently GE if you can't use a map in conjunction with >>GPS. >hmmm...I have this feeling that I know nothing about maps. I >don't think I've ever used GPS. I think Dad uses it to find fish >and his way back home. Although I never did figure out the "find >fish" part. The GPS only told your dad the location where the fish happened to be. The Global Positioning System is just that. You can determine direction of travel with GPS, but you have to move between two points. The equipment then works out the direction from the coordinates of the two points. -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus! | X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature| / \ and postings | to help me spread! | ###### Message-ID: <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> From: CBFalconer Reply-To: cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net Organization: Ched Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 26 Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 08:30:29 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.90.168.188 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 1000197029 12.90.168.188 (Tue, 11 Sep 2001 08:30:29 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 08:30:29 GMT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.germany.net!news.stealth.net!204.127.161.2.MISMATCH!wn2feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.71!wnfilter1!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90241 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > In article , > Bernd Felsche wrote: > > ... snip ... > > > >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching > >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". > > Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning > about that stuff. > ... snip ... Not so any more. I have two daughters who are Colonels. And the image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they are the first to come in harms way. -- Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@XXXXworldnet.att.net) (Remove "XXXX" from reply address. yahoo works unmodified) mailto:uce@ftc.gov (for spambots to harvest) ###### Message-ID: <3B9E3F99.12A706B0@ev1.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@ev1.net Organization: Cannine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 34 Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 14:47:41 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.179.111.125 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news2.rdc2.tx.home.com 1000219661 24.179.111.125 (Tue, 11 Sep 2001 07:47:41 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 07:47:41 PDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newshub2.home.com!news.home.com!news2.rdc2.tx.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90216 CBFalconer wrote: > > jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > > > In article , > > Bernd Felsche wrote: > > > > ... snip ... > > > > > >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching > > >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". > > > > Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning > > about that stuff. > > > ... snip ... > > Not so any more. I have two daughters who are Colonels. > So the military flipped your daughters the bird??? (They are "bird" colonels, right???) > > And the > image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - > soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they > are the first to come in harms way. > IMHO soldiers prefer peace...but I am *not* sure about most of the generals. Certainly, General George Patton preferred *war*... -- +-------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond | +-------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: stanb@dial.pipex.com (Stan Barr) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <3B9D3BF0.168@earthlink.com> Organization: Metropolis Grafix Reply-To: stanb@dial.pipex.com Message-ID: X-Newsreader: slrn (0.9.4.3 UNIX) Date: 11 Sep 2001 17:02:23 GMT Lines: 28 NNTP-Posting-Host: userav77.uk.uudial.com X-Trace: 1000227743 news.dial.pipex.com 233 62.188.138.124 X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!newsfeed.online.be!195.129.110.18.MISMATCH!bnewspeer00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspeer01.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!lnewspost00.lnd.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90149 On Mon, 10 Sep 2001 16:17:20 -0600, Sam Seiber wrote: >Stan Barr wrote: >> Somewhere in the mountain of paper I have here is a "Byte" article >> entitiled "Generic Word Processor" which describes, in computer >> jargon, the use of a pencil for word-processing. I particularly liked >> their description of a pencil sharpener as an "Initialization Unit" ;-) > >Wasn't it referred to as a graphite display terminal? I have some >memory of Byte writting about such things. I went and found the article (I've got way too much paper stuff here!). It describes a pencil as the GWP (Generic Word Processor) System word- processing unit, with a character-insertion subunit (the point) and a character-deletion subunit (the eraser). It also describes the use of the block text extraction and replacement units - scissors and paste, and a variety of special fonts available, i.e. Sanskrit, Amharic and Heiroglyphics. Byte was such a good magazine in the old days - there's nothing of that quality now ;-( (or if there is, I haven't seen it) Dr.Dobbs ain't bad though.... -- Cheers, Stan Barr stanb@dial.pipex.com The future was never like this! ###### From: genew@mail.ocis.net (Gene Wirchenko) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 20:26:16 GMT Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3b9e7309.114142@news.ocis.net> Reply-To: genew@mail.ocis.net References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 21 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90139 Pete Fenelon wrote: >Stan Barr wrote: >> Somewhere in the mountain of paper I have here is a "Byte" article >> entitiled "Generic Word Processor" which describes, in computer >> jargon, the use of a pencil for word-processing. I particularly liked >> their description of a pencil sharpener as an "Initialization Unit" ;-) >I've frequently asserted that all of my designs and specs have been created >with DIN 16553 compliant tools... Finish the joke, please. What is "DIN 16553". Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Wed, 12 Sep 01 09:50:33 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 29 Message-ID: <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVaU4LSQZvTOlu6h1AOL9XDB2/O1vctjplIgkH0Id/a2oIXba8f+lDOH X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 12 Sep 2001 12:39:21 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-255-128 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90256 In article , Ric Werme wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >>>A GPS will almost always ensure that you're never _lost_. But you >>>tend to be frequently GE if you can't use a map in conjunction with >>>GPS. > >>hmmm...I have this feeling that I know nothing about maps. I >>don't think I've ever used GPS. I think Dad uses it to find fish >>and his way back home. Although I never did figure out the "find >>fish" part. > >He doesn't - he uses it to mark (record) good fishing spots and goes >back there later. That doesn't work in Lake Michigan. He must use some kind of sonar that also happens to have a GPS. > ...With a handheld GPS receiver you can mark a place >out of sight of land and get back there next month within a spitting >distance of the original spot. > That gives a coordinate. His somehow remembers a path. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Wed, 12 Sep 01 10:02:38 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 34 Message-ID: <9nnloe$r4v$14@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYN4W4LNb4pSa+IJpI5bXRKvOTywzojpob19Loy7nbmgPtp1n5mV6UT X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 12 Sep 2001 12:51:26 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeed.germany.net!newsfeed.icl.net!netnews.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-255-128 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90262 In article <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com>, CBFalconer wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >> >> In article , >> Bernd Felsche wrote: >> > >.... snip ... >> > >> >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >> >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". >> >> Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning >> about that stuff. >> >.... snip ... > >Not so any more. I have two daughters who are Colonels. I considered joining the army to pay for college. There was a reason I couldn't do it but I don't remember what it was now. > And the >image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - >soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they >are the first to come in harms way. AFAICT, it's the ones who don't have to fight who promote that image. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Wed, 12 Sep 01 10:00:09 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 119 Message-ID: <9nnljq$r4v$13@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbj9UZqliJEeHG3U6nexESTATYXMwURzddXY+9Z34E5ukeK7NeIMz6v X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 12 Sep 2001 12:48:58 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-255-128 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90264 In article , Bernd Felsche wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >>In article , >> Bernd Felsche wrote: >>>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >>> >>>>In article , >>>> Bernd Felsche wrote: > >>>>>I used Chinagraphs to plot navigation courses on transparent >>>>>films held over maps. Using a pencil on the map was frowned >>>>>upon; the maps were expensive. That was in the 1970's and >>>>>1980's. The beauty of the Chinagraphs was/is that they are >>>>>almost impervious to water; which is quite important if your >>>>>hole in the ground is filling rapidly with water. > >>>>Well water? > >>>No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >>>shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". > >>Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning >>about that stuff. > >You might have gained some idea from the movies or television. Which is probably very incorrect. But I didn't like watching war stuff. > >Rain is pretty much independent of war. If you need to mark >something that's wet, or is going to get wet, a "Chinagraph" pencil >is a tool that works. Is that a wax leaded pencil where you pull a string and then unravel the wood strip to "sharpen" it? > >>>>>The first thing to mark on the transparent media were two >>>>>cross-hairs for subsequent alignment. Those who didn't, became >>>>>geographically-embarrassed. > >>>>I think I just got PCed. ROTFL. Is this the same as "can't >>>>tell their ass from a hole in the ground"? Or do you just >>>>mean "get lost"? >>> >>>"Georgraphically embarrassed" is as old as I can remember. Certainly >>>dates back to the mid-1970's when I learnt to navigate. > >>>There's a big difference between "lost"; i.e. not being able to >>>identify where you are and being geographically embarrassed (GE). >>>The latter is where you end up in a place you didn't intend to go. > >>Men do that all the time. > >Women too. The main difference between untrained men and women is >that women will usually be able to go back where they've come from, >as long as what they've seen along the way hasn't changed too much >(visual memory). Men become GE if they lose spatial orientation; but >will be able to develop a novel short-cut back to the point of >origin if they maintain or recover orientation. Women tend to have >to tred the same path back to the origin. I sure do. I hadn't realized that men don't do this to retrace steps. NEAT! Something new. > >Training can reduce most of the bias in both genders. Now I want to learn how to do what you do. > >>>Anybody who knows how to read a map > >>I know how to do that; I like maps. > >Can you look at a topo. map of an unfamiliar area and visualize the >terrain and vegetation? I'm not sure that I've seen a topo. map. > ...Can you approximate inter-visibility just by >looking at the map? I've never tried that. I've only mapped roads in my head or turn the map as I turn the car. > >>> .. and use a compass will only ever >>>be GE; unless they've travelled off the map. > >>I've never used a compass. Is that the tool I keep seeing >>getting used in movies in submarines and stuff? > >Infantry use it too. There's a sport called orienteering that's >based on map and compass navigation as well as running. You might >find it interesting if you're a fitness freak. > >A compass tells you which direction (bearing) is associated with a >particular visible point relative to the observer. See references to >rain and Chinagraph above. :-) > >Bearings can be represented in a number of schemes. North is the >direction of the North pole; the magnetic North pole is where the >compass points and all angles (bearings) are measured relative to >that. Magnetic North is usually nowhere near geographic North (aka >Santa's workshop :) and magnetic North moves with time. A good map >will show magnetic variation for the area covered by the map. I've got an astrolabe but haven't taken the time to figure out how to use it. But that's based on sun orientation isn't it? /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: Pete Fenelon Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 22:49:41 -0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Sender: Pete Fenelon References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <3b9e7309.114142@news.ocis.net> User-Agent: tin/1.5.8-20010221 ("Blue Water") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.3-STABLE (i386)) X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 8 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90267 Gene Wirchenko wrote: > > Finish the joke, please. What is "DIN 16553". A typo on my part. DIN 16554 is a standard for ball-pen refills, and (I think) pencil leads... pete ###### X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/1.3.22.103 From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Reply-To: spalding@iol.ie Message-ID: <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.553 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 7 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 18:33:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.203.144.172 X-Complaints-To: abuse@iol.ie X-Trace: news.iol.ie 1000319599 193.203.144.172 (Wed, 12 Sep 2001 19:33:19 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 19:33:19 BST Organization: Ireland On-Line Customer Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!212.74.64.35!colt.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!diablo.theplanet.net!newsfeed.esat.net!194.125.2.178.MISMATCH!news.iol.ie!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90285 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net>: > That gives a coordinate. His somehow remembers a path. Mine does that too, probably most do. Garmin GPS 12. -- Nick Spalding ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 13 Sep 01 13:27:44 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 20 Message-ID: <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVY3ByqKITR4FvZolsC24TkBtAuOjhbBSu8mhEtYbpmFH5aQVzJ+zrpu X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 13 Sep 2001 16:16:47 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-131 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90303 In article <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com>, Nick Spalding wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net>: > >> That gives a coordinate. His somehow remembers a path. > >Mine does that too, probably most do. Garmin GPS 12. So how does it work? Let's say that it can record three entries. So there has to be a vector calculation based on reading those entries backwards. Where does the spillover happen if more entries than memory are requested? The first, the middle, or the last entry get overwritten? I can think of arguments for all three choices but, now that I've just learned that my mapping skills may not be quite useful, I no longer know. /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### From: jmfbahciv@aol.com Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 13 Sep 01 13:24:09 GMT Organization: UltraNet Communications, Inc. Lines: 21 Message-ID: <9nqlui$1hl$18@bob.news.rcn.net> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVYkR88W4RuDAxggbF7D0JkQzDR0QnpB08YL4bjvlFJip6mnPzrpOAOa X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 13 Sep 2001 16:13:06 GMT X-Newsreader: News Xpress Version 1.0 Beta #4 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-lei1.dfn.de!news-fra1.dfn.de!news0.de.colt.net!colt.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!207-172-245-131 Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90310 In article , Ric Werme wrote: >jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > >>>He doesn't - he uses it to mark (record) good fishing spots and goes >>>back there later. > >>That doesn't work in Lake Michigan. > >If fish hang out around rocky outcroppings or sunken boats, those don't >move. That's not the kind of fishing done in that part of Lake Michigan. Finding a school is the goal and they move as the water temp changes. They think... /BAH Subtract a hundred and four for e-mail. ###### Message-ID: <3B9FF589.95A97AFB@ev1.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@ev1.net Organization: Cannine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> <9nnloe$r4v$14@bob.news.rcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 43 Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:56:13 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.179.111.125 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news2.rdc2.tx.home.com 1000331773 24.179.111.125 (Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:56:13 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 14:56:13 PDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!paloalto-snh1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news2.rdc2.tx.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90330 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > > In article <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com>, > CBFalconer wrote: > >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: > >> > >> In article , > >> Bernd Felsche wrote: > >> > > >.... snip ... > >> > > >> >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching > >> >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". > >> > >> Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning > >> about that stuff. > >> > >.... snip ... > > > >Not so any more. I have two daughters who are Colonels. > > I considered joining the army to pay for college. There was > a reason I couldn't do it but I don't remember what it was now. > > > And the > >image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - > >soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they > >are the first to come in harms way. > > AFAICT, it's the ones who don't have to fight who promote that > image. > > If anyone can post the extended quote of General William T. Sherman that says "war is hell"...Sherman had a few choice remarks on this very idea... The quote I am thinking of starts with "I am sick and tired of war..." -- +-------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond | +-------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### From: genew@mail.ocis.net (Gene Wirchenko) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 00:35:33 GMT Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3b9fbf3f.15817730@news.ocis.net> Reply-To: genew@mail.ocis.net References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <3b9e7309.114142@news.ocis.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 19 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!isdnet!sn-xit-02!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90297 Pete Fenelon wrote: >Gene Wirchenko wrote: >> >> Finish the joke, please. What is "DIN 16553". > >A typo on my part. DIN 16554 is a standard for ball-pen refills, and (I think) >pencil leads... Thank you. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko Computerese Irregular Verb Conjugation: I have preferences. You have biases. He/She has prejudices. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Ric Werme X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #119 Lines: 28 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 02:07:19 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.128.105.166 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 1000346839 24.128.105.166 (Wed, 12 Sep 2001 22:07:19 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 22:07:19 EDT Organization: Road Runner Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.70!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90334 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >>He doesn't - he uses it to mark (record) good fishing spots and goes >>back there later. >That doesn't work in Lake Michigan. If fish hang out around rocky outcroppings or sunken boats, those don't move. If he's chasing schools of fish roaming a large range, then: He must use some kind of sonar >that also happens to have a GPS. >> ...With a handheld GPS receiver you can mark a place >>out of sight of land and get back there next month within a spitting >>distance of the original spot. >That gives a coordinate. His somehow remembers a path. Most receivers also have a "track log". For exmaple mine, can hold 1024 points collected at a fixed time interval or whenever a course change makes it clear it should log another track log point. Other receivers can hold multiple tracks (a rudimentary file system). -- Ric Werme | werme@nospam.mediaone.net http://people.ne.mediaone.net/werme | ^^^^^^^ delete ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> <9nnloe$r4v$14@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Bernd Felsche User-Agent: nn/6.6.beta2 Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 11:53:02 +0800 Message-ID: Lines: 39 NNTP-Posting-Host: innovative.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 1000354898 26478 203.59.144.24 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90322 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >In article <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com>, > CBFalconer wrote: >>jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote: >>> In article , >>> Bernd Felsche wrote: >>> >No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >>> >shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". >>> >>> Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning >>> about that stuff. >>.... snip ... >> >>Not so any more. I have two daughters who are Colonels. >I considered joining the army to pay for college. There was >a reason I couldn't do it but I don't remember what it was now. There were quite a few women in the reserves (Australian Army) when I was there. Proportion was increasing. The pay was abysmal; barely paid for expenses but you learnt a lot of stuff besides moving holes around the landscape with tools; entrenching and how to kill. >> And the >>image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - >>soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they >>are the first to come in harms way. >AFAICT, it's the ones who don't have to fight who promote that >image. Management and P.R. :-| -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus! | X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature| / \ and postings | to help me spread! | ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <9mlaab$6p8$2@bob.news.rcn.net> <9mo404$gr6$1@top.mitre.org> <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnljq$r4v$13@bob.news.rcn.net> From: Bernd Felsche User-Agent: nn/6.6.beta2 Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 12:21:28 +0800 Message-ID: <88cpn9.sdl.ln@innovative.iinet.net.au> Lines: 136 NNTP-Posting-Host: innovative.iinet.net.au X-Trace: news.iinet.net.au 1000354901 26478 203.59.144.24 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!skynet.be!skynet.be!newsfeed.iinet.net.au!news.iinet.net.au!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90321 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: >In article , > Bernd Felsche wrote: >>jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: [snip] >>>>No. Holes just deep enough to stop you getting shot or catching >>>>shrapnel. They tend to fill with stuff called "rain". >> >>>Females in this country are not trained in war. I'm just learning >>>about that stuff. >> >>You might have gained some idea from the movies or television. >Which is probably very incorrect. But I didn't like watching >war stuff. All Quiet on the Western Front (the original is a definitive anti-war film) worth seeing. Quite a few others. >>Rain is pretty much independent of war. If you need to mark >>something that's wet, or is going to get wet, a "Chinagraph" pencil >>is a tool that works. >Is that a wax leaded pencil where you pull a string and then unravel >the wood strip to "sharpen" it? I had nothing that fancy. Just a knife to sharpen it. Basically wax-cored with wood as a shell. They got pretty soft in summer and not so friendly to use when it was around freezing point. >>>>"Geographically embarrassed" is as old as I can remember. Certainly >>>>dates back to the mid-1970's when I learnt to navigate. >>>>There's a big difference between "lost"; i.e. not being able to >>>>identify where you are and being geographically embarrassed (GE). >>>>The latter is where you end up in a place you didn't intend to go. >> >>>Men do that all the time. >> >>Women too. The main difference between untrained men and women is >>that women will usually be able to go back where they've come from, >>as long as what they've seen along the way hasn't changed too much >>(visual memory). Men become GE if they lose spatial orientation; but >>will be able to develop a novel short-cut back to the point of >>origin if they maintain or recover orientation. Women tend to have >>to tred the same path back to the origin. >I sure do. I hadn't realized that men don't do this to retrace >steps. NEAT! Something new. It's even better when you know. Think twice about asking somebody of the other gender for "directions". >>Training can reduce most of the bias in both genders. >Now I want to learn how to do what you do. That take time and practice; about 10 hours of lessons and two days of hands-on. 100% success is not guarranteed! You can DIY when you visit a new town. When you get out of your mode of transport (car, bus, train, UFO) take out your map, locate where you are by landmarks, locate where you want to go (preferably something you can't see from where you're standing) and locate another prominent landmark (church steeple, clock tower, whatever). Next (this is the hard bit) imagine how that third landmark would look from where you're going. One can quantify how it will "look" by plotting on the map and using a protractor and compass, but imagining it is OK for casual use and to simply practice. Put your map away and head off in the direction that makes the landmark look that way. An alternative is to the single landmark is to pick several - and use the combined view (their relative positions) to determine your direction. A "trivial" case is if there's a clock tower at the railway station from where you start, and a tower immediately behind where you're going, then you need to keep that station clock directly behind you, and the other tower directly in front. Just keep walking until you get where you want. If you reach the second tower, you've gone too far! Other convenient directional navigation aids include the sun. I tend to become more easily disoriented on heavily-overcast days. >>>>Anybody who knows how to read a map >> >>>I know how to do that; I like maps. >> >>Can you look at a topo. map of an unfamiliar area and visualize the >>terrain and vegetation? >I'm not sure that I've seen a topo. map. Topographical maps indicate buildings, vegetation, water features, power lines, roads, paths and most importantly; contour lines. Contour lines are drawn between points of equal altitude. The contour interval is the altitude increments concerned; e.g. a map may have a contour interval of 5 metres; so each line corresponds to another 5 metres in altitude change. This is almost good enough for most uses. Most hikers (should) carry such maps or maps with smaller intervals. >> ...Can you approximate inter-visibility just by >>looking at the map? >I've never tried that. I've only mapped roads in my head or >turn the map as I turn the car. That's a step beyond what many are capable of doing :-) >>A compass tells you which direction (bearing) is associated with a >>particular visible point relative to the observer. See references to >>rain and Chinagraph above. :-) >> >>Bearings can be represented in a number of schemes. North is the >>direction of the North pole; the magnetic North pole is where the >>compass points and all angles (bearings) are measured relative to >>that. Magnetic North is usually nowhere near geographic North (aka >>Santa's workshop :) and magnetic North moves with time. A good map >>will show magnetic variation for the area covered by the map. >I've got an astrolabe but haven't taken the time to figure out >how to use it. But that's based on sun orientation isn't it? I have no idea on how to use an astrolabe. Sad, really. -- /"\ Bernd Felsche - Innovative Reckoning, Perth, Western Australia \ / ASCII ribbon campaign | I'm a .signature virus! | X against HTML mail | Copy me into your ~/.signature| / \ and postings | to help me spread! | ###### From: Joe Pfeiffer Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 13 Sep 2001 10:54:24 -0600 Organization: NMSU Computer Science Lines: 22 Message-ID: <1badzz9glb.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: viper.cs.nmsu.edu X-Trace: bubba.NMSU.Edu 1000400059 7675 128.123.64.113 (13 Sep 2001 16:54:19 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@bubba.NMSU.Edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 13 Sep 2001 16:54:19 GMT X-Newsreader: Gnus v5.7/Emacs 20.5 Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newscore.gigabell.net!news0.de.colt.net!colt.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed.news.qwest.net!hardy.tc.umn.edu!lynx.unm.edu!news.NMSU.Edu!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90294 jmfbahciv@aol.com writes: > > So how does it work? Let's say that it can record three > entries. So there has to be a vector calculation based on > reading those entries backwards. Where does the spillover > happen if more entries than memory are requested? The first, > the middle, or the last entry get overwritten? I can think > of arguments for all three choices but, now that I've just > learned that my mapping skills may not be quite useful, I > no longer know. A good GPS is on my list of Cool Toys to own some day, so this will be based on hazily-remembered catalog ads -- but the number of ``way points'' that can be saved is typically in the dozens. It's a pretty bizarre path by the time you have to worry about the max. I think that when you hit capacity, they just tell you that you can't enter another one... -- Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605 Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002 New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer SWNMRSEF: http://www.nmsu.edu/~scifair ###### X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/1.3.22.103 From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Reply-To: spalding@iol.ie Message-ID: References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.553 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 26 Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 17:45:51 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.203.145.95 X-Complaints-To: abuse@iol.ie X-Trace: news.iol.ie 1000403151 193.203.145.95 (Thu, 13 Sep 2001 18:45:51 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 18:45:51 BST Organization: Ireland On-Line Customer Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.esat.net!194.125.2.178.MISMATCH!news.iol.ie!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90325 jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net>: > In article <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com>, > Nick Spalding wrote: > >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net>: > > > >> That gives a coordinate. His somehow remembers a path. > > > >Mine does that too, probably most do. Garmin GPS 12. > > So how does it work? Let's say that it can record three > entries. So there has to be a vector calculation based on > reading those entries backwards. Where does the spillover > happen if more entries than memory are requested? The first, > the middle, or the last entry get overwritten? I can think > of arguments for all three choices but, now that I've just > learned that my mapping skills may not be quite useful, I > no longer know. It records the co-ordinates of each place where a change of course occurs; these are called waypoints. As someone else has posted it has a much larger capacity than 3 - the manual says it can store up to 20 routes each of up to 30 waypoints. -- Nick Spalding ###### From: hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Prof. Richard E. Hawkins) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 13 Sep 2001 18:06:27 GMT Organization: Penn State University, Center for Academic Computing Lines: 22 Message-ID: <9nqsj3$1b2e@r02n01.cac.psu.edu> References: <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com> <9nnloe$r4v$14@bob.news.rcn.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: fac13.ds.psu.edu X-Newsreader: trn 4.0-test76 (Apr 2, 2001) Originator: hawk@fac13.ds.psu.edu (Prof. Richard E. Hawkins) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.cis.ohio-state.edu!news.ems.psu.edu!news3.cac.psu.edu!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90296 In article <9nnloe$r4v$14@bob.news.rcn.net>, wrote: >In article <3B9DC4DC.64180801@yahoo.com>, > CBFalconer wrote: >> And the >>image of the warlike professional soldier is outright wrong - >>soldiers prefer peace for many reasons, one of which is that they >>are the first to come in harms way. >AFAICT, it's the ones who don't have to fight who promote that >image. Nope, it's the officer corps in general (and I'd expect the career enlisted, too . . .) hawk -- Prof. Richard E. Hawkins, Esq. /"\ ASCII ribbon campaign dochawk@psu.edu Smeal 178 (814) 375-4700 \ / against HTML mail These opinions will not be those of X and postings Penn State until it pays my retainer. / \ ###### Message-ID: <3BA133FC.D854EA59@ev1.net> From: Charles Richmond Reply-To: richmond@ev1.net Organization: Cannine Computer Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7C-CCK-MCD {C-UDP; EBM-APPLE} (Macintosh; I; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 24 Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 20:34:57 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.179.111.125 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news2.rdc2.tx.home.com 1000413297 24.179.111.125 (Thu, 13 Sep 2001 13:34:57 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 13:34:57 PDT Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!enews.sgi.com!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news2.rdc2.tx.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90350 Ric Werme wrote: > > [snip...] [snip...] [snip...] > > Most receivers also have a "track log". For exmaple mine, can hold 1024 > points collected at a fixed time interval or whenever a course change > makes it clear it should log another track log point. Other receivers > can hold multiple tracks (a rudimentary file system). > I just saw a segment on Dateline NBC (IIRC) about a man who was suspected of killing his daughter...then reporting her missing. The police installed a GPS device under his car. This device recorded everywhere he went. When the police recovered the device, they were able to use the recorded info to locate the girl's body... Certainly finding evidence of a murder is a worthwhile thing...but this makes one wonder what else they made do with GPS devices. And it smacks of Big Brother... -- +-------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond | +-------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: knews 1.0b.1 References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> <1badzz9glb.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu> From: dg@pearl.tao.co.uk (David Given) Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: Lines: 21 Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 13:23:15 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.255.240.131 X-Complaints-To: abuse@ntlworld.com X-Trace: news6-win.server.ntlworld.com 1000495202 62.255.240.131 (Fri, 14 Sep 2001 20:20:02 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 20:20:02 BST Organization: ntl Business News Service Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!btnet-peer1!btnet-peer0!btnet!news5-gui.server.ntli.net!ntli.net!news6-win.server.ntlworld.com.POSTED!172.16.100.66!nobody Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90428 In article <1badzz9glb.fsf@cs.nmsu.edu>, Joe Pfeiffer writes: [...] > A good GPS is on my list of Cool Toys to own some day, so this will be > based on hazily-remembered catalog ads -- but the number of ``way > points'' that can be saved is typically in the dozens. It's a pretty > bizarre path by the time you have to worry about the max. I think > that when you hit capacity, they just tell you that you can't enter > another one... Cleverer than that. My father's new cheap Garmin GPS will store something like 1024 automatic waypoints, to keep track of the user's progress. When it runs out, it will either forget about the oldest waypoints or else simplify the track to use fewer waypoints using some spline algorithm, depending how you set it. -- +- David Given --------McQ-+ | Work: dg@tao-group.com | "Those who do not understand Unix are forced to | Play: dg@cowlark.com | reinvent it, poorly." --- Henry Spencer +- http://www.cowlark.com -+ ###### From: jcmorris@mitre.org (Joe Morris) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Date: 14 Sep 2001 15:39:16 GMT Organization: The MITRE Corporation Lines: 55 Message-ID: <9nt8b4$fof$1@top.mitre.org> References: <3b903b4c.3167359@news.powersurfr.com> <3b90e982.471702@news.powersurfr.com> <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> Reply-To: jcmorris@mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Host: jmorris-pc.mitre.org X-Trace: top.mitre.org 1000481956 16143 128.29.251.13 (14 Sep 2001 15:39:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news.mitre.org NNTP-Posting-Date: 14 Sep 2001 15:39:16 GMT X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.6 (NOV) Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!arclight.uoregon.edu!news.tufts.edu!blanket.mitre.org!news.mitre.org!jcmorris Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90379 Nick Spalding writes: >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net>: >> So how does it work? Let's say that it can record three >> entries. So there has to be a vector calculation based on >> reading those entries backwards. Where does the spillover >> happen if more entries than memory are requested? The first, >> the middle, or the last entry get overwritten? I can think >> of arguments for all three choices but, now that I've just >> learned that my mapping skills may not be quite useful, I >> no longer know. >It records the co-ordinates of each place where a change of course >occurs; these are called waypoints. As someone else has posted it has a >much larger capacity than 3 - the manual says it can store up to 20 >routes each of up to 30 waypoints. I think we're seeing two different features being mixed up here. *Waypoints* are created by an explicit action of the user, defining specific locations on the Earth's surface. A sequence of these waypoints represents the desired path between the first and last in that sequence. From an aviation perspective (the only GPS experienece I have) I could set up a flight from Knoxville, TN to Manassas VA following some designated airways and some direct paths: KTYS (Knoxville airport) VXV (Knoxville navigation station) HMV (Bristol TN/VA) PSK (Pulaski VA) ROA (Roanoke VA) FLUKY (point in space) KHEF (Manassas airport) I manually enter these waypoints (avaition GPS units know the station identifiers so I don't have to enter lat/long numbers), then tell it to follow the paths between waypoints. OTOH, *tracking* is performed by periodically noting the geographical coordinates and storing them in memory. The recording might be on a time period (every so many seconds) or on a distance-travelled basis (record every time the location changes by so many thousand feet). The only user action is to turn tracking on or off, setting the recording interval, and clearing the track log. The memory for this might contain a thousand data points. I've got a handheld Garmin GPS ("Pilot III") that I can set up in my car; the tracking information is enough to hold more than one all-day highway trip, and the track display on the LCD screen is detailed enough to show the car's path around a cloverleaf intersection's ramps. Joe Morris ###### X-Posting-Agent: Hamster/1.3.22.103 From: Nick Spalding Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: [OT] Slide-rules Reply-To: spalding@iol.ie Message-ID: References: <590.649T2855T6735980@nowhere.in.particular> <999847673snz@dsl.co.uk> <9nfq6l$cse$16@bob.news.rcn.net> <9ni91v$c78$7@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nnl1p$r4v$12@bob.news.rcn.net> <9cavpts6v52c5s9l3t39d05otb7io1o5jp@4ax.com> <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net> <9nt8b4$fof$1@top.mitre.org> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.553 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 37 Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 17:36:59 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.203.144.211 X-Complaints-To: abuse@iol.ie X-Trace: news.iol.ie 1000489019 193.203.144.211 (Fri, 14 Sep 2001 18:36:59 BST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 18:36:59 BST Organization: Ireland On-Line Customer Path: chonsp.franklin.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!feed.news.nacamar.de!f.de.uu.net!do.de.uu.net!newsfeed.esat.net!194.125.2.178.MISMATCH!news.iol.ie!not-for-mail Xref: chonsp.franklin.ch alt.folklore.computers:90427 Joe Morris wrote, in <9nt8b4$fof$1@top.mitre.org>: > Nick Spalding writes: > > >jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote, in <9nqm5f$1hl$19@bob.news.rcn.net>: > > >> So how does it work? Let's say that it can record three > >> entries. So there has to be a vector calculation based on > >> reading those entries backwards. Where does the spillover > >> happen if more entries than memory are requested? The first, > >> the middle, or the last entry get overwritten? I can think > >> of arguments for all three choices but, now that I've just > >> learned that my mapping skills may not be quite useful, I > >> no longer know. > > >It records the co-ordinates of each place where a change of course > >occurs; these are called waypoints. As someone else has posted it has a > >much larger capacity than 3 - the manual says it can store up to 20 > >routes each of up to 30 waypoints. > > I think we're seeing two different features being mixed up here. > > *Waypoints* are created by an explicit action of the user, defining > specific locations on the Earth's surface. A sequence of these > waypoints represents the desired path between the first and last > in that sequence. From the GPS 12 manual, page 24. "Once the TracBack function has been activated, the GPS 12 will take the track log currently stored in memory and divided it into segments called legs. Up to 30 temporary way points will be created to mark the most significant features of the track log..." Temporary they may be but Garmin still calls them waypoints. -- Nick Spalding