From: hancock4@bbs.cpcn.com (Lisa or Jeff) Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: 4 Sep 1998 23:26:03 GMT Organization: Net Access BBS Lines: 12 Message-ID: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: bbs.cpcn.com Originator: root@bbs.cpcn.com Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!europa.clark.net!207.106.0.20!news-xfer.netaxs.com!netaxs.com!bbs.cpcn.com!root > If I'm recalling things correctly here (which may be questionable > at best), the Flexowriter (from Friden, pre-dating the Selectric by > many years) was capable of letter-quality print at around 15 cps on > a good day. This, in the late '50s. In the 1960s they had a "computer" version which was programmable in an assembler like language via a paper tape. It sort of functioned like an automated word processing forms-gen type program. I think it was the 5610. The machine could be fed by tapes prepared by the older machines. The tape code was completely different than ASCII or EBCDC. ###### From: "Harold Zvi Rabbie" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: 5 Sep 1998 08:01:17 GMT Organization: AT&T WorldNet Services Lines: 27 Message-ID: <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.64.105.246 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1162 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!wn4feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.225!attworldnet!newsadm The Flexowriter used Baudot code - a 5-bit code. Enough for 26 upper case alphabetics with a few spares. There was a FIGS code which shifted it to a numerics and punctuation character set, and a LETS code that shifted it back. The same machine is used for Telex transmissions. Wrote my first program in Algol-60 on an Elliott KDF-9 using a Flexowriter. None o' them new-fangled punched cards. -- Harold Rabbie Saratoga, CA Remove spam trap when replying Lisa or Jeff wrote in article <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com>... > > If I'm recalling things correctly here (which may be questionable > > at best), the Flexowriter (from Friden, pre-dating the Selectric by > > many years) was capable of letter-quality print at around 15 cps on > > a good day. This, in the late '50s. > > In the 1960s they had a "computer" version which was programmable in > an assembler like language via a paper tape. It sort of functioned > like an automated word processing forms-gen type program. I think > it was the 5610. > > The machine could be fed by tapes prepared by the older machines. > The tape code was completely different than ASCII or EBCDC. > ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: dbryant@netcom.com (David K. Bryant) Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Message-ID: Organization: ICGNetcom X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 CURRENT #9 References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 01:10:45 GMT Lines: 13 Sender: dbryant@netcom8.netcom.com Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!ix.netcom.com!dbryant "Harold Zvi Rabbie" writes: >The Flexowriter used Baudot code - a 5-bit code. Maybe the originals, but, the white & blue Flexowriters used an 8-level code on 1" PPT. I think the old brown Flexowriters used 8-level also. I used to be a Flexowriter gear-head in my early 8008 days. I still have a few nuts & bolts pieces around in /dev/garage. ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: alderson@netcom11.netcom.com (Richard M. Alderson III) Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) In-Reply-To: "Harold Zvi Rabbie"'s message of 5 Sep 1998 08:01:17 GMT Message-ID: Sender: alderson@netcom11.netcom.com Reply-To: alderson@netcom.com Organization: NETCOM On-line services References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 02:22:35 GMT Lines: 10 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom11!alderson In article <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> "Harold Zvi Rabbie" writes: >None o' them new-fangled punched cards. New-fangled? 1880s technology??? -- Rich Alderson Last LOTS Tops-20 Systems Programmer, 1984-1991 Current maintainer, MIT TECO EMACS (v. 170) last name @ XKL dot COM Chief systems administrator, XKL LLC, 1998-now ###### From: jsavard@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca () Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: 8 Sep 1998 02:25:51 GMT Organization: Edmonton FreeNet, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Lines: 16 Message-ID: <6t24jf$4c0$2@news.sas.ab.ca> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> NNTP-Posting-Host: fnt2.freenet.edmonton.ab.ca X-Trace: news.sas.ab.ca 905221551 4480 198.161.206.18 (8 Sep 1998 02:25:51 GMT) X-Complaints-To: news@sas.ab.ca NNTP-Posting-Date: 8 Sep 1998 02:25:51 GMT X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2.6] Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!torn!rover.ucs.ualberta.ca!sas.ab.ca!jsavard Harold Zvi Rabbie (hzrabbie@REMOVE.THIS.worldnet.att.net) wrote: : The Flexowriter used Baudot code - a 5-bit code. There were 5-bit Baudot Flexowriters; there were Flexowriters using a 6-bit code with upper and lower case that resembled Baudot (the most common kind, I think); and there were ASCII Flexowriters. They did _not_ all use the same code. Some Flexowriters even had proportional spacing. Incidentally, they also strongly resembled the earliest models of IBM electric typewriter, and some parts were actually interchangeable with them. John Savard ###### From: "Rick Lugg" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: Tue, 8 Sep 1998 08:45:49 +0200 Organization: The South African Internet Exchange Lines: 28 Message-ID: <6t2juv$gt7$1@news2.saix.net> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> <6t24jf$4c0$2@news.sas.ab.ca> NNTP-Posting-Host: qit-prxy-0000.telkom.co.za X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2120.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2120.0 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!netnews.globalip.ch!news-lond.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!insnet.net!uunet!uunet!in3.uu.net!news2.saix.net!not-for-mail We used to use an IBM "golfball typewriter" as the console device for the Elliott 4100 sold by NCR in the UK in the 60s. This was a dramatic improvement over the Westrex teleprinter that was on the original unit that I used. -- Rick Lugg jsavard@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca wrote in message <6t24jf$4c0$2@news.sas.ab.ca>... >Harold Zvi Rabbie (hzrabbie@REMOVE.THIS.worldnet.att.net) wrote: >: The Flexowriter used Baudot code - a 5-bit code. > >There were 5-bit Baudot Flexowriters; > >there were Flexowriters using a 6-bit code with upper and lower case that >resembled Baudot (the most common kind, I think); > >and there were ASCII Flexowriters. > >They did _not_ all use the same code. Some Flexowriters even had >proportional spacing. Incidentally, they also strongly resembled the >earliest models of IBM electric typewriter, and some parts were actually >interchangeable with them. > >John Savard ###### From: Bogus Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: 09 Sep 1998 20:52:58 PDT Organization: Concentric Internet Services Lines: 30 Message-ID: <35F75B31.1B09B2FF@concentric.net> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> Reply-To: nil@concentric.net NNTP-Posting-Host: ts002d41.box-ma.concentric.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC) To: alderson@netcom.com Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-was.dfn.de!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!worldfeed.gte.net!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!207.155.183.80.MISMATCH!global-news-master I think back from olden times... As all good PDP-1 programmers know, the older flexo's used a sixbit code MIDAS (a PDP-1) compiler used the pseudo-op FLEXO as in Flexo .foo. #first char infield limits argument up to second occurrance (# starts comment) N.B. at 18 bits/word Six bits meant 3 chars/word I think the -10's MACRO had a SIXBIT pseudo-op that also did flexowriter code I'm not sure at all that flexo's ever did 5-bit Baudot wex@concentric.net Richard M. Alderson III wrote: > In article <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> "Harold Zvi Rabbie" > writes: > > >None o' them new-fangled punched cards. > > New-fangled? 1880s technology??? > -- > Rich Alderson Last LOTS Tops-20 Systems Programmer, 1984-1991 > Current maintainer, MIT TECO EMACS (v. 170) > last name @ XKL dot COM Chief systems administrator, XKL LLC, 1998-now ###### From: "George R. Gonzalez" Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 22:25:41 -0500 Organization: SkyPoint Communications, Inc. Lines: 20 Message-ID: <6ta5eq$n0j$1@shadow.skypoint.net> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> <6t24jf$4c0$2@news.sas.ab.ca> <6t2juv$gt7$1@news2.saix.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: dial114.skypoint.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.eecs.umich.edu!newshub.tc.umn.edu!skypoint.com!not-for-mail BTW what was the deal with the flexowriter mechanicals? Not only was the thing built like a TANK, with what looked like a cast-steel frame, but all the screws were non-standard. Back around 1978 I interfaced a 6-bit flexowriter to a hmmm.... Z-100 I think. After watching it kerchunk for for an hour or so, I said this is very entertaining, but ENOUGH, no more, never again, and started taking it apart. I musta removed two hundred little screws which I carefully put in a jar. Much later, I needed a 4-40 screw.. I dug through the jar for one, but it never quite fit in the 4-40 nut. Same with 6-32. It looks like they used some unusual thread design! Somewhere I still have a plastic drawerfull of these weird screws that don't seem to fit anything (except another FlexoWriter, and when am I going to be crazy enough to drag another one of those home?) ###### From: Charles Richmond Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 21:52:02 +0000 Organization: Cannine Computer Center Lines: 14 Message-ID: <35F99B82.40188195@plano.net> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> <35F75B31.1B09B2FF@concentric.net> Reply-To: richmond@plano.net NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.44.41.247 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: 905568031 R67V8VHUD29F7D12CC usenet54.supernews.com X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; 68K) To: nil@concentric.net Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!newscore.univie.ac.at!europa.clark.net!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!Supernews60!supernews.com!Supernews69!not-for-mail Bogus wrote: > > I think back from olden times... > As all good PDP-1 programmers know, the older flexo's used a sixbit code > MIDAS (a PDP-1) compiler used the pseudo-op FLEXO as in > Was MIDAS an assembler, and *not* a compiler? I have *never* used MIDAS or a PDP-1 either, but I did read somwhere about the "hackers" at MIT writing the MIDAS assembler. -- +-------------------------------------------------------------+ | Charles and Francis Richmond | +-------------------------------------------------------------+ ###### Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers From: alderson@netcom.netcom.com (Richard M. Alderson III) Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) In-Reply-To: Charles Richmond's message of Fri, 11 Sep 1998 21:52:02 +0000 Message-ID: Sender: alderson@netcom.netcom.com Reply-To: alderson@netcom.com Organization: NETCOM On-line services References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> <35F75B31.1B09B2FF@concentric.net> <35F99B82.40188195@plano.net> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 18:46:53 GMT Lines: 49 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news.belnet.be!news-raspail.gip.net!news-dc.gip.net!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!ix.netcom.com!netcom!alderson In article <35F99B82.40188195@plano.net> Charles Richmond writes: >Was MIDAS an assembler, and *not* a compiler? I have *never* used MIDAS or a >PDP-1 either, but I did read somwhere about the "hackers" at MIT writing the >MIDAS assembler. From the file INFO:MIDAS.INFO -- ^_^L MIDAS Node: Top, Up: (DIR), Next: Invoke Overview of MIDAS MIDAS is a PDP-10 assembler. It takes as its input an ASCII file, and produces a binary file in any of several formats (*Note Out: Output.) NOTE: Numbers used in this document are assumed to be octal, unless followed by a "." in which case they are decimal. E.G. 12 = 10. = ten. * Menu: [snip of rest of menu] ^_^L MIDAS Node: Basic, Previous: Interrupts, Up: Top, Next: Example Machine Instructions in MIDAS The main body of a MIDAS program is composed primarily of machine instructions -- just as you would expect. The PDP-10 machine language instruction breaks down into five fields of bits: a nine bit opcode field, a four bit accumulator (AC) field, a one bit indirect field, a four bit index register field, and an 18 bit memory address field. The instruction set is documented very clearly in the "DecSystem-10 System Reference Manual" (DEC-10-HGAC-D, and the later versions), which is published by the manufacturer, Digital Equiptment Corp. ("DecSystem-10" is a pretentious salesman's name for the PDP-10). [snip rest of section] ************************************************************ So it's an assembler (with an attitude). NB: The typo "Equiptment" is in the original, which I simply C&P'd with my trusty X terminal... -- Rich Alderson Last LOTS Tops-20 Systems Programmer, 1984-1991 Current maintainer, MIT TECO EMACS (v. 170) last name @ XKL dot COM Chief systems administrator, XKL LLC, 1998-now ###### From: David Scheidt Newsgroups: alt.folklore.computers Subject: Re: Flexowriter (was IBM Selectric) Date: 12 Sep 1998 20:15:37 GMT Organization: EnterAct L.L.C. Turbo-Elite News Server Lines: 12 Message-ID: <6tekp9$10d$1@eve.enteract.com> References: <6spsub$c6f@netaxs.com> <01bdd8a2$9e257b40$f669400c@machshev> <6t24jf$4c0$2@news.sas.ab.ca> <6t2juv$gt7$1@news2.saix.net> <6ta5eq$n0j$1@shadow.skypoint.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 207.229.143.6 Path: ccw.ch!pfaff.ethz.ch!news-zh.switch.ch!news-ge.switch.ch!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.enteract.com!news.enteract.com!dscheidt George R. Gonzalez wrote: : Much later, I needed a 4-40 screw.. I dug through the jar for one, but it : never quite fit in the 4-40 nut. Same with 6-32. It looks like they : used some unusual thread design! Metric, perhaps? I suppose they might be BA, but that would be excessively perverse. If you take one to the hardware store, they can probably help you out. Or just send me one. David